Alif Balaam Yashin
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Semantics is what you are talking about. It's simple, until there is actual, objective proof of any god, it remains a big NO.
Does God really exist?
- Thread starter abdolhosseini
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Something which clearly violated things we know to be true. The moon turning into a disco ball, or something? But that could be explained away by aliens with sufficient technology. Maybe a bit in the Bible describing some scientific knowledge that is cl;ear about what it is talking about, but couldn't have been known by the people living at the time. I saw an example of this somewhere once, using Kepler's laws or something, but I can't remember it off the top of my head.
In any case, God would know what would convince me, even if I don't.
Thank you!Welcome to the forum, btw.
But you are redefining the name as well.
You are redefining God to mean "The universe".
We already have a name for the universe. That name is: "The Universe."
Deciding that "God" is a better name for it is not justifiable (at least as far as I can see) for two reasons.
First, you've provided no justification as to why calling it God is better than calling it The Universe.
Secondly, calling it God carries with it a lot of preconceived ideas, and these ideas will be different for different people. This creates a great deal of ambiguity as to what exactly you mean by calling the universe "God."
Longfellow
Well-Known Member
I've wondered about this too. I'm thinking that maybe whenever people think of the universe as having some kind of awareness and/or purpose in it or behind it, they call that "God." Or they call the universe "God" as a way of saying that there is some kind of awareness and/or purpose in it. There might be some confusion sometimes about whether they think that's what "God" means in the Abrahamic scriptures.
talib-al-kalim
Well-Known Member
There are indeed different concepts between and in the Abrahamic religions and over time. The concept that God is universal is more rooted in Islam. The ancient Jews called Him "our God", and Christians pray "our Father". But we also pray to God. God is near, His Spirit is in us, and we link with our environment. The concept of the Universe is different. I associate with this something that is far off, huge indeed but it doesn't need my attention.
Indeed, G-d is aware of what is in our minds.
We are not automatons .. we have a soul .. a conscience .. which is G-d given.
G-d has no need of anybody's worship .. we are the ones in need .. to enable us
to ward off evil .. to remind us of the path of righteousness.
Human beings are easily led .. our worldly desires can lead us astray.
Craz
Well-Known Member
I do not believe so.
(Just my thoughts on the subject of how belief came about)
The life cycle.
All things are made(created), preserved(exist for some time), and destroyed(their existence ends; death).
An acronym of this which I have always liked is Generation(creation), Operation(in existence), Destruction.
Maybe that's where the word GOD came from....eer probably not
I think that the ancients(wise people, thinkers, sages etc) of all cultures, observed this cycle and noticed that it is universal and named it.
Writers wrote about it mythologically. Some believed in the stories.
Some deified it.
Hence, the myriad of different belief systems.
(I have been a strong theist in two religions, both of which I really enjoyed. So I am not without empathy towards theists).
craz
Clobbernocky
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Defining God:
The non contingent foundation of all existence. Yes
That which is morally superior authority.
Nothing shows up
All knowing.
No
All powerful.
No. Would have acted by now.
Creator.
No. This is evidently a horrible creation.
Infinite ground of all being.
Maybe but I don't believe so
All wise.
No such existence
Perfectly benevolent with supreme innocence.
I wish, but nothing evidently shows up.
No need of checking out any monotheistic religions. The trouble they cause is immense.
The non contingent foundation of all existence. Yes
That which is morally superior authority.
Nothing shows up
All knowing.
No
All powerful.
No. Would have acted by now.
Creator.
No. This is evidently a horrible creation.
Infinite ground of all being.
Maybe but I don't believe so
All wise.
No such existence
Perfectly benevolent with supreme innocence.
I wish, but nothing evidently shows up.
No need of checking out any monotheistic religions. The trouble they cause is immense.
Religion is not the problem.
It is human beings' love of power and wealth that is the problem.
So then we are agreed: God knows what would convince me.
The next question is this: Is he capable of producing this evidence?
I don't see how this address my point at all, which was that you claim that redefining things is wrong, yet you are doing it yourself.
talib-al-kalim
Well-Known Member
I'm not defining things. Things cannot be defined. I'm explaining words and my understanding of it
Longfellow
Well-Known Member
One justification would be common usage. Calling the universe "God" in a context of some kind of awareness or purpose in it is a common practice. There seems to be a thing where people want to think that they believe in something called "God," even if they don't believe at all in the Abrahamic one, and any excuse will do for imagining something and calling it "God. Or maybe they don't want people to think that they are atheists.
Agreed. When people call something in their imagination "God," I always wonder if they think it's the God in the Abrahamic scriptures or not, so I've started asking people sometimes.
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powessy
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If everything in our universe is time/energy then it's time is defined by how long it remains here. The sun will eventually become nothing here it's time will have ended along with many other things in this solar system. Where does this time go?? I find time that is no longer here and understand this phenomenon many times greater then most due to my experience with it. As we become nothing here the energy will be figured out by dimensional minds as they try to become us again. Each dimension has five frequencies and five steps of becoming nothing here. This is the third dimension, we will descend through the second, first and 0 zero dimensional fields till there is just no time remaining just energy with no time left to become itself, this is origin.
The ancients understood this because once you get to origin you become yourself again but you have no time and cannot figure yourself out, I often imagine this as coins that hold everything that ever was it/you on these coins. The yourself never realizes itself until it has no time remaining then they try to figure themselves out only when it is too late. Origin can only find time two ways, the first is a big bang and time will move out to become itself again, boom and here we are asking these same questions all over again. the second is god, has the ability to bring time to origin and this will cause everything to become itself again moving up through the dimensional fields and this time dimensional minds can become us giving us time all the time. God can resurrect any time out of origin at any time up to the time it finds time again through his time only.
This is not the only universe there are others many others there are places in time that minds cannot teach me so I know these places are other universes. If you imagine a line with millions of lines each representing a different timeline consisting of different things then many of these timelines are blank these have to be other universes time that is not us.
I find thoughts of god all the time through finding and figuring out time, I just do not know how to figure him out other then to figure out everything he is not.
just thoughts about your thoughts.
powessy
The ancients understood this because once you get to origin you become yourself again but you have no time and cannot figure yourself out, I often imagine this as coins that hold everything that ever was it/you on these coins. The yourself never realizes itself until it has no time remaining then they try to figure themselves out only when it is too late. Origin can only find time two ways, the first is a big bang and time will move out to become itself again, boom and here we are asking these same questions all over again. the second is god, has the ability to bring time to origin and this will cause everything to become itself again moving up through the dimensional fields and this time dimensional minds can become us giving us time all the time. God can resurrect any time out of origin at any time up to the time it finds time again through his time only.
This is not the only universe there are others many others there are places in time that minds cannot teach me so I know these places are other universes. If you imagine a line with millions of lines each representing a different timeline consisting of different things then many of these timelines are blank these have to be other universes time that is not us.
I find thoughts of god all the time through finding and figuring out time, I just do not know how to figure him out other then to figure out everything he is not.
just thoughts about your thoughts.
powessy
First of all, how could you tell? If someone speaks of God, how do you tell if they are speaking of a God like the Abrahamic one or a more pantheistic idea of God?
Secondly, the vast majority of religious people (at least in western society) are refering to a deity when they speak of God, not a pantheistic God.
So it's a little confusing that you speak of going with the common usage, and then suggest what appear to be uncommon alternatives.
Then why did you suggest that going with the common usage of the word "god" was enough to justify referring to the universe as God?
And how is your understanding of it not the same thing as your definition of it?
otherbrother
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And if it is useful, works to make us feel and be more whole, more abundantly alive, how is that not a real thing? God is because God works. As you say, faith in God is useful, so God functions in our lives in a very real way. That doesn’t tell us the details of the reality, just its effects. Separate Being or Function? If “God” is really our potential for wholeness, aided by endorphins or prefrontal cortex’s, that still is real and certainly worth praying to, accessing, using in our real lives. God is because God works.
By this reasoniong, a child's imaginary friend is real if that imaginary friend helps that child through a difficult time.
otherbrother
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I get your logic on the Big Bang, as the explosion was likely the result of a Greater Reality (Or non physical dimension) coming into a lesser reality, physical dimension. The physical dimension cannot adequately contain the other dimension, so, Bang. And with the explosion everything stretches out into space, resulting in time. Not so much that God created time so everything doesn’t happen at once (Einstein said, I think), but God was just too much for it to be manifested all at once.
I don’t quite get your second cause of time. Are you just saying God put it in Creation? That would be in line with Einstein’s joke.
otherbrother
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That was the God Function (or simply God) disguised as an imaginary friend so the child could relate to (whatever is) God in an intimate and effective manner.