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You seem to assume that discursive reasoning and cognitive ability are conditions subsequent of the Fall. They are not, nor do they necessarily separate us from the Real. In fact a close reading of the text will show that Adam and Eve display both prior to the Fall. Aquinas (13th c), and...

Devadatta to Thomas, over. Hi Thomas. First of all, I very much appreciate your taking the trouble to fully respond to my post. Your fundamental point is clearly stated: I’m misreading scripture, being an outsider. Of course, if that’s true then I’m bound to misread you – so there’s the...

Nagarjuna is the one true man of the left. Nagarjuna is the one true man of the left out. Nagarjuna is the one true man of the left out of account. Yet Nagarjuna is not truly a man of the left. Nagarjuna is not truly (as above). Nagarjuna is not (as above). The bhikkhus recite and write...

It seems to me there's 2000 word limit on posts - a tragedy for all windbags. Is that right?

Why, thank you!

I thought I dash off something quickly on this, as I did above; after all, it’s bedtime, and I didn’t think you’d want to talk to me anymore anyway. But then you took the trouble to look this up on Wiki! This is an extraordinarially complex question, which one can endlessly debate, which has no...

Oh, gee, Seattle, didn't I very early on say that for me these are metaphorical languages, didn't I mention the parallel narrative of the theory of evolution? I was pretty clear that I was outside the barn, which is why I placed the thread where I did. Apologetics? That's just for my wife...

Hi Netti Netti. I've repeated the above here because of all the sloppy typing. The editing function never seems to work for me on this site. -- As for as Elohim, etc., goes; I think that's interesting. In points to the fact that the Abrahamic God is an improvement over the Mesopotamian, a...

-- As for as Elohim, etc., goes; I think that's interesting. In points to the fact that Abrahamic God is an improvement over the Mesopotamian, a point I would never deny. Again, I was at pains to point out the problematic in the tradition, that it's mixed, ambigious, that there are dichotomies...

Okay, let us indeed try to sort this out. I’ll start by explaining my impression of your trail of posts, which led to my momentary grumpiness. First, you take issue with my characterisation of authority and obedience as being “negative”, when even a cursory reading of the post would show that I...

Hi not this - but maybe that! You know my last post is one of those one regrets making - it was a tad grumpy. So I apologize for that. On the other hand, so far you haven't engaged much with the substance of my post. You appear to be following your own parallel track. Which is fine, but kind...

Devadatta wrote, way back in the first post: So here the point is not the superficial one of the necessity of free will, of choosing between good and evil, but the deeper necessity of the fall into duality as the precondition for the summum bonum of mutual recognition between human consciousness...

Hi Muslimwoman. I have a couple questions for you. First, your views would seem very much at variance with our friend Hado here, who unless I’m mistaken represents pretty much the Muslim mainstream. In fact, your views sound pretty radical. So what place do you find in your community, as a...

Hi again. Thanks for your interesting take on this. Let’s compare notes. First, I should make clear that from my point of view this is a question of metaphorical language and its adequacy to the case. So when I say God “laid a trap” I’m only expressing in a brief way my sense that “the fall” is...

But he who is greatest among you shall be your servant. And whoever exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted. Shanti.

Hi not-this, not-this. With the name you’ve chosen for these forums, I’d expect you to be a little less literalist.:) I respect your sentiments and your good heart. But the merest glance at the histories of Christianity and Islam reveals the great difficulties inherent in this emphasis on...

Hey Seattle. I guess I'm a simple soul. A text which has human beings "subduing and having dominion" and heavenly bodies "ruling" appears to have a least some thematic weight. And this theme is hardly absent throughout the bible, to say the least. But you know we're no doubt talking past...

[/COLOR] Hi Dondi. Sure, Paul noodles around these points in various ways. But the bottom line here is that the Law as understood in Jewish tradition has been abrogated. Paul, like Jesus, is a radical, but his radicalism takes a different turn. Jesus, in my plain reading of the synoptics...

Well, I'm sure you would agree that the language of authority is all over this, so a straightforward reading of this would assume this preoccupation. I mean we do have other creation myths which aren't structured this way, don't we? What am I missing about what you're saying? Shanti. [/INDENT]