Bolivian Glacier Disappears

iBrian

iBrian

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Bolivian Glacier disappears:
BBC NEWS | World | Americas | Huge Bolivian glacier disappears

But not a simple scientific curiosity or testament to Global Warming:

The World Bank warned earlier this year that many of the Andes' tropical glaciers will disappear within 20 years.

This, the bank said, would both threaten the water supplies of nearly 80 million people living in the region, and jeopardise the future generation of hydropower.

Bolivia, Ecuador and Peru depend on that power for about half their electricity.
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Frightening to think that water shortages might rival or surpass petro shortages in the near future. Colorado has water issues, makes me shake my head all the time over how we misuse this resource. I can't begin to imagine whole countries running out of water.
 
Avi1223 said:
Brian, I am afraid this is both a simple scientific fact and a testament to global warming.
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My bad for not explaining properly - what I meant was that the story had an real human edge to it in terms of direct loss of water supplies and electricity generation, rather than being a mere statistic.

A lot of stories covering climate change don't easily report a direct human consequence of the event they are recording - for example, melting of Antarctic glaciers will impact everyone indirectly, but usually no individual peoples are directly impacted by their loss for their immediate environment.

It's early, so I may still sound confused. :)
 
I said:
My bad for not explaining properly - what I meant was that the story had an real human edge to it in terms of direct loss of water supplies and electricity generation, rather than being a mere statistic.

A lot of stories covering climate change don't easily report a direct human consequence of the event they are recording - for example, melting of Antarctic glaciers will impact everyone indirectly, but usually no individual peoples are directly impacted by their loss for their immediate environment.
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Good point Brian, but the image is not quite as compelling as a beautiful polar bear floating on a mostly melted block of ice. Al Gore has done his homework on this one :)
 
The spine of the Andes makes for one of the worlds richest areas of mineral deposits. The exploitation of them by the so called 'free market' has led to serious widespread contamination of groundwater. Compounding the the problems faced by glacial melting.
 
Avi1223 said:
Good point Brian, but the image is not quite as compelling as a beautiful polar bear floating on a mostly melted block of ice. Al Gore has done his homework on this one :)
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except polar bears have always floated on mostly melted blocks of ice... tis a way to sneak up on dinner.... seals...and use currents to get from one place to another without swimmng so much.
 
wil said:
except polar bears have always floated on mostly melted blocks of ice... tis a way to sneak up on dinner.... seals...and use currents to get from one place to another without swimmng so much.
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And people like it when it's warm because they can go swimming and eat ice cream.

So more 100+ degree days should just make everybody happier!

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Yaaaaaaay!!! ICE CREAM for EVERYBODY!!!
 
citizenzen said:
And people like it when it's warm because they can go swimming and eat ice cream.

So more 100+ degree days should just make everybody happier!

orange.gif
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Yaaaaaaay!!! ICE CREAM for EVERYBODY!!!
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My sister did her 2 year peace corp stint in Benin. She said when it got below 80 degrees they were always concerned as this is when the old people died...too cold for them.

Adapt.
 
wil said:
Adapt.
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One of the interesting aspects of climate change is that temperature has changed in the past and those who discount human's contribution to the problem are quick to point this out.

But what is different about the current warming trend is that it's happening on a timescale of decades instead of thousands of years. Adaptation by plant and animals happens too slowly to keep pace. In our own lifetime we'll see the effects of this.

If only one could adapt just by wishing. The creatures of this Earth surely don't enjoy that luxury.
 
citizenzen said:
One of the interesting aspects of climate change is that temperature has changed in the past and those who discount human's contribution to the problem are quick to point this out.

But what is different about the current warming trend is that it's happening on a timescale of decades instead of thousands of years. Adaptation by plant and animals happens too slowly to keep pace. In our own lifetime we'll see the effects of this.

If only one could adapt just by wishing. The creatures of this Earth surely don't enjoy that luxury.
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What about the little ice age theory that ended in 1850...as a reason for our 'warming'...and melting...
 
citizenzen said:
One of the interesting aspects of climate change is that temperature has changed in the past and those who discount human's contribution to the problem are quick to point this out.

But what is different about the current warming trend is that it's happening on a timescale of decades instead of thousands of years. Adaptation by plant and animals happens too slowly to keep pace. In our own lifetime we'll see the effects of this.

If only one could adapt just by wishing. The creatures of this Earth surely don't enjoy that luxury.
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I'm sure all of the flash frozen mammoths, woolly rhinos, saber toothed cats, and other frozen critters found in Alaska and Siberia didn't have time to adapt to the rapid climate change they experienced when they were flash-frozen.
 
wil said:
What about the little ice age theory that ended in 1850...as a reason for our 'warming'...and melting...
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What are you suggesting about the Little Ice Age? That climate change occurs naturally or that plants and animals are able to adapt to these sudden changes?
 
seattlegal said:
I'm sure all of the flash frozen mammoths, woolly rhinos, saber toothed cats, and other frozen critters found in Alaska and Siberia didn't have time to adapt to the rapid climate change they experienced when they were flash-frozen.
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This point escapes me. :confused: :confused: :confused:
 
seattlegal said:
Sudden {and I do mean sudden} climate change can occur naturally.
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What proof do you have that a frozen mammoth is the result of climate change and not just a severe storm?

As has been pointed out by some, even in this current climate freakish cold spells occur.
 
citizenzen said:
What are you suggesting about the Little Ice Age? That climate change occurs naturally or that plants and animals are able to adapt to these sudden changes?
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A little of both. SL answered part but if the little ice age ended in 1850 and we've been warming since from such an anomoly (if it is) then how much of the accelerated temperature change is warming and how much is returning to what was prior to the little ice age?

A great place to contemplate climate change is Berlin Nevada
Berlin Ichthyosaur State Park encompasses 1,540 acres. The elevation ranges from 6,840 feet to a high point of 7,880 feet. The hillsides in the park are covered with Big Sagebrush (The Nevada State Flower) while Pinyon Pine and Utah Juniper dominate the upper elevations......

Ichthyosaurs (ICK-thee-o-soars) were prehistoric marine reptiles ranging in size from about two to over seventy feet in length. Ichthyosaur was the most highly specialized reptile for life in the ocean. Very fish-like in appearance and locomotion, they bore their young alive and had amazingly large eyes in relation to the rest of the body. These carnivorous reptiles ate free swimming mollusks such as ammonites, squid like creatures, and probably fish. Like all reptiles, Ichthyosaur was air breathing and resembles modern day cetaceans (whales and dolphins to which it is not related) in some of its characteristics.
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So what do we find in this high desert the other side of the Sierras from the Pacific? Fish lizard fossils that beached themselves enmasse on the side of the mountain 6,840 feet above sea level.

You sit there and contemplate the discussions that somehow man causes whales to beach themselves...must have been those awful Atlanteans and their sonar driving Ichthyosaurs crazy back then. You contemplate the desert where you can see for a couple hundred miles in front of you...and imagine it all sea, with the pine forests behind you being rainforest....

adapt or die...
 
citizenzen said:
What proof do you have that a frozen mammoth is the result of climate change and not just a severe storm?

As has been pointed out by some, even in this current climate freakish cold spells occur.
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They're still frozen after all this time. The grass under their bodies is still there--it didn't rot away in a thaw. Methinks that can rule out a freak storm. One moment, they were eating buttercups. Next moment, they were frozen, and have remained frozen for thousands of years. I would say that indicates a rapid transition to a stable, frozen climate.
 
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