Old Testament -New Testament which do christians use?

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bruce

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Very good question and the answer lyes in the New Testament 2nd Timothy 3:16"All scritpture is given by inspiration of God,and is profitable for doctrine,for for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:"So we use the whole bible not just the New or Old Testament.The reason I raise this question is there are mordern day churchs that will only use the New Testament and they can't understand certain things Jesus spoke of, the reason being they haven't studied the Old Testament.Notice Matthew5:5 "Blessed are the meek for they shall inherit the earth."What?If everyone ether goes to heaven or hell when they die ,who are the meek?The answer comes from the Old Testament Psalms 37:11'But the meek shall inherit the earth,:and shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace"Also Psalms 38:18 "The LORD knoweth the days of the upright:and their inhreritance shall be forever"The meek are a part of the righteous class not all of the righteous but part of it and the earth will be thiers forever in the future.Footnote to if Jesus is God ,Jesus is not God please look at this verse John 20:17"Jesus saith unto her,Touch me not;for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren,and say unto them.I ascend unto my Father and your Father:and to my God and your God". Jesus says my God and your God,now Jesus says his father is his God and his Father is our God so who is God?Jehovah! and Jesus tells us to only worship God Matthew 4:10.Very simple but Satan has confused mans thinking and once you learn the truth you see like at new born day at sunrise.....;)
 
Bruce said:
Very good question and the answer lies in the New Testament 2nd Timothy 3:16":
All scripture is given by inspiration of God and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness":
So we use the whole bible not just the New or Old Testament.
Click to expand...

That's assuming that the whole Christian Bible is scripture....
 
Actually, 2 Tim 3:16 is an issue of extreme contention, and simply cannot be interpreted in the manner as you've described. :)

The first fact of the matter is that the Greek word translated as "scripture" is graph - which in itself is usually applied to writing in general, so far as my own reading goes (I've had Strong's out on this, you can be sure :) ).

Of course, someone can then object that 2 Tim 16 actually refers to just religious writings. Fine.

However, the big problem here is that not only was there no New Testament Canon, but there was no canonical representation of Judaic Scripture until the end of the first century AD (97 AD, I believe).

As the classic JW (and general mainstream Christian view) is that Revelations was the last NT text to be compsed - around 96 AD - then as there was no agreed NT canon and no agreed Judaic canon at the time, then 2 Tim 3:16 can refer to absolutely anything.

CR has a list of over 80 New Testament Apocrypha - texts never included in the NT canon - and this includes works such as the Shepherd of Hermas, and I Clement, which were rather surprisingly left out from the final NT canon (they exist in extant Bible from the 4th century AD - Codex Sinaiticus for one, if I remember right). In fact, even Revelations itself wasn't added to the canon until the very end of the fourth centuty itself - somewhere around 396 AD. There are at least a similar number of Old Testament Apocrypha that I'll soon be adding to the site.

So, overall, 2 Tim 3:16 absolutely cannot refer to the whole Bible, because the whole Bible did not exist - and most certainly not in any agreed state - until after 2 Timothy was actually written.

Of course, it should also be noted that as the Jehavah's Witnesses see the Roman Catholic position as essentially heretical and corrupted, it surprises myself that the JW's even accept the original canon chosen by this "corrupted" body. The only way to agree that the actual canonisation was correct is by a form of reverse engineering - ie, start off presuming the Bible to be inspired - therefore all of the books of the Bible must be inspired.

Although the point raised about connecting key phrases between the NT and OT is absolutely correct - there is a lot of purposeful referencing of OT texts in the NT - it needs to be reminded that without any form of accepted NT or even OT canon, and with NT canonisation effectively controlled by a political body centuries later, it therefore means that 2 Tim 3:16 absolutely cannot be taken to have the interpretation that so many Sola Scriptura adherents would like to push for - the position in that regard and in that manner is ultimately extremely flawed, illogical, and inapplicable.

:)
 
Damn it, I, Brian beat me to it. Trying to reconcile the various views--sometimes even within a single book of the OT/NT--leads to massive convolution. Thus the various sects of Christianity and Judaism. Among them, Jehovah's witnesses.

Eh, just read I, Brian's reply. He hit it on the head.
 
As a christian, I use the whole Bible...
because of the line of work that I am in, I often find myself reading the letters of the new testiment alot, just because they are a great encouragement, and they offer practical advice to living life as a true christian.
And, I enjoy reading the old testament... particularly parts that really illustrate how God was there, supporting his people.
My favourite verse at the moment is:
Do not let anyone look down on you because you are young, but be an example for other believers in your speech, behavior, love, faithfulness, and purity.
1 Timothy 4:12 (ESV)
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I am only 18, and I find that, being a christian volunteer worker, this verse really does apply to me.
 
One of the better lines from the Timothys. :)
 
bruce said:
Very good question and the answer lyes in the New Testament 2nd Timothy 3:16"All scritpture is given by inspiration of God,and is profitable for doctrine,for for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:"So we use the whole bible not just the New or Old Testament.The reason I raise this question is there are mordern day churchs that will only use the New Testament and they can't understand certain things Jesus spoke of, the reason being they haven't studied the Old Testament.Notice Matthew5:5 "Blessed are the meek for they shall inherit the earth."What?If everyone ether goes to heaven or hell when they die ,who are the meek?The answer comes from the Old Testament Psalms 37:11'But the meek shall inherit the earth,:and shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace"Also Psalms 38:18 "The LORD knoweth the days of the upright:and their inhreritance shall be forever"The meek are a part of the righteous class not all of the righteous but part of it and the earth will be thiers forever in the future.Footnote to if Jesus is God ,Jesus is not God please look at this verse John 20:17"Jesus saith unto her,Touch me not;for I am not yet ascended to my Father: but go to my brethren,and say unto them.I ascend unto my Father and your Father:and to my God and your God". Jesus says my God and your God,now Jesus says his father is his God and his Father is our God so who is God?Jehovah! and Jesus tells us to only worship God Matthew 4:10.Very simple but Satan has confused mans thinking and once you learn the truth you see like at new born day at sunrise.....;)
Click to expand...

Our Lord Jesus Christ used the old testament as basis for teaching about his existence - spiritually and humanly. The Apostles also quoted the old testament. If what you asked is about which law we christians are following, let us consult the Bible.

James 1:25 But whoso looketh into the perfect law of liberty, and continueth therein, he being not a forgetful hearer, but a doer of the work, this man shall be blessed in his deed.

Galatians 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Leviticus 19:18 Thou shalt not avenge, nor bear any grudge against the children of thy people, but thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself: I am the LORD.

Galatians 6:2 Bear ye one another's burdens, and so fulfil the law of Christ.

THE LAW OF CHRIST IS WHAT WE ARE FOLLOWING.
 
The whole theme of the bible from Genesis to revelation is about GODS KINGDOM.And I shall put enmity between you and the woman and between your seed and her seed. He will bruise you in the head and you will bruise him in the heel. Genesis 3;15 yes this is the first ever prophecy in the bible. this is not talking about a litral woman , but it is a symbolic woman, and she is mentioned in the last book of the bible also.
And a great sign was seen in heaven, a woman arrayed with the sun, and the moon was beneath her feet, and on her head was a crown of twelve stars, 2 and she was pregnant. And she cries out in her pains and in her agony to give birth.​

3​
And another sign was seen in heaven, and, look! a great fiery-colored dragon, with seven heads and ten horns and upon its heads seven diadems; 4 and its tail drags a third of the stars of heaven, and it hurled them down to the earth. And the dragon kept standing before the woman who was about to give birth, that, when she did give birth, it might devour her child.​

5 And she gave birth to a son, a male, who is to shepherd all the nations with an iron rod. And her child was caught away to God and to his throne. revelation 12;1-5 yes the kingdom of God has been born , and the bible theme is now well established in this time of the end. yes the bible, the whole of the bible harmonizes throughout.
 
Old testament had many prophecies considerring the Messiah which are fulfiled in Jesus .Jesus came to fulfil the law and by doing so freed us from that law ,now we had to believe Jesus and follow his commandments ,they are

1.There shall be no other God other than YAHWEH ,whom we should worship and obey .

2. Love your neighbour as you love yourself.
 
We must always remember those were the two top commandments in Judaism at the time, Jesus invented neither, it was a test, he was asked what the number one commandment was, and he named what was conventionally considered number one and two out of the hundreds of commandments utilized.

As a Christian I use, read and enjoy both old and new testaments. And a ton of other books as well.
 
Well said ,If the two commandments were followed by all we can easily see a world of peace .
 
Always Right said:
Old testament had many prophecies considerring the Messiah which are fulfiled in Jesus .Jesus came to fulfil the law and by doing so freed us from that law ,now we had to believe Jesus and follow his commandments ,they are

1.There shall be no other God other than YAHWEH ,whom we should worship and obey .

2. Love your neighbour as you love yourself.
Click to expand...
yes these two comandments sum it all up. and loving Jehovah (English) ,or Yahweh (Hebrew) means that we recognize the king that he has made king of his heavenly kingdom. this heavenly kingdom goverment is now well established in line with bible prophecy and chronology. very shortly Gods kingdom will step into the affairs of human rulership . and Jesus who is the one who has been given great aurthority. will soon go into action .
And in the days of those kings(human rulerships) the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be brought to ruin. And the kingdom itself will not be passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms,(human goverments) and it itself will stand to times indefinite; ...Daniel 2;44.....yes the heavenly kingdom goverment was established in 1914, just as the bible makes known inline with bible prophecy and chronology .its all happening in this time of the end thrilling times indeed.
 
mee said:
yes these two comandments sum it all up. and loving Jehovah (English) ,or Yahweh (Hebrew) means that we recognize the king that he has made king of his heavenly kingdom. this heavenly kingdom goverment is now well established in line with bible prophecy and chronology. very shortly Gods kingdom will step into the affairs of human rulership . and Jesus who is the one who has been given great aurthority. will soon go into action .
And in the days of those kings(human rulerships) the God of heaven will set up a kingdom that will never be brought to ruin. And the kingdom itself will not be passed on to any other people. It will crush and put an end to all these kingdoms,(human goverments) and it itself will stand to times indefinite; ...Daniel 2;44.....yes the heavenly kingdom goverment was established in 1914, just as the bible makes known inline with bible prophecy and chronology .its all happening in this time of the end thrilling times indeed.
Click to expand...
Doesn't YHWH suffice for all who believes that that tetragrammation is the ineffable Name of the Father?
 
wil said:
We must always remember those were the two top commandments in Judaism at the time, Jesus invented neither, it was a test, he was asked what the number one commandment was, and he named what was conventionally considered number one and two out of the hundreds of commandments utilized.

As a Christian I use, read and enjoy both old and new testaments. And a ton of other books as well.
Click to expand...

But Jesus said they were much more than just the two greatest commandments. He said that on these two commadnments hang all the law and the prophets (Matthew 22:40).

That elevates them to more than just a popularity contest. They basically fulfill the law.

"And the scribe said unto him, Well, Master, thou hast said the truth: for there is one God; and there is none other but he:

And to love him with all the heart, and with all the understanding, and with all the soul, and with all the strength, and to love his neighbour as himself, is more than all whole burnt offerings and sacrifices. And when Jesus saw that he answered discreetly, he said unto him, Thou art not far from the kingdom of God. And no man after that durst ask him any question." - Mark 12:32-34

"For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself." - Romans 13:9

"Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law." - Romans 13:10

"For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself." - Galatians 5:14

"If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:" - James 2:8

To ignore the Old Testament and only stick with the New Testament, which I've known people to do, will rob the deep riches of God's Word. How are we to know about the pillars of faith in Hebrews 11 if we don't read about them in the OT? How are we to properly interpret the NT if we don't start with the foundation of the OT? You gotta have both.

 
AMEN

We are eagerly waiting for that day when the King of Kings Jesus Christ rule all the world from Jerusalem .
 
Always Right said:
AMEN

We are eagerly waiting for that day when the King of Kings Jesus Christ rule all the world from Jerusalem .
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But the Jerusalem above is free, and she is our mother. Galations 4;26
(Revelation 12:1) And a great sign was seen in heaven, a woman arrayed with the sun, and the moon was beneath her feet, and on her head was a crown of twelve stars,............. yes its all happening in this time of the end, Jehovahs woman has given birth to her child , and this child is Gods heavenly kingdom goverment , and no one can harm that child because it has Jehovahs protection. yes the heavenly kingdom goverment was born in 1914 in the heavens , in line with bible prophecy and chronology.... Daniel 2;44...and Jesus is the king of that goverment. it is all happening in the heavens, Jesus is ruling right now in the heavens ,he will not come back to the earth in the flesh . but since 1914 his presence in kingdom power has been happening .
 
enton said:
Doesn't YHWH suffice for all who believes that that tetragrammation is the ineffable Name of the Father?
Click to expand...

That people may know that you, whose name is Jehovah,​

You alone are the Most High over all the earth..... psalm 83;18
 
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