My faith

[pghguy]

I'm Catholic in that I attend a Catholic Church and have done so since childhood. However, I question several aspects of the faith and feel that perhaps it has lost meaning in becoming to mechanical and legalistic.

Although many if not most small children inherently have a slight aversion to religion - for example kids by nature are sort of ancy and sometimes play around during church or fidget anxiously until the weekly ceremony is done so they can go about their lives - it seems as more mature people we should be more in touch with our faith.

This being said, over the years and especially recently, church services and dogma have seemed to bring about more of a sense of unhappiness, despair, and having felt far less meaningful.

I always thought that in the practice of worship, we should be inclined to at least feel comfortable if not in a state of zeal for life and love and the good things of this world and the wonders of God. In me, this seems to have all but died.

I long to go to church again or some sort of worship service an experience the feeling of joy and hope rather than fear and anxiety.

 

[The Word]

The created man is in God as thoughts so he's always in obedience but the flesh of man, in order to be at one with God, needed to obey his commands. The problem was that his flesh was formed with genetic sins in each cell that gave power to deceive his thoughts in God. So Adam and Eve were potential sinners as soon as they disobeyed God's commandments. God commanded them not to eat of the tree of good and evil because it would bring death to them. This death meant they would be blinded and deafened to the thoughts of God they were created with. This means they wouldn't be able to hear the truth the whole time they were alive in the flesh.
　
God said man's flesh was dust and to dust they shall return but their created image, the heart, mind and soul, would stay alive as thoughts in God for eternity. This death was never intended for the soul of a man, only his flesh. The sinful flesh is the battle against the Word of truth and the end of this age would be the biggest battle called the Battle of Armageddon, when all the rest of the flesh alive at that time will be killed in hot molten lava. This battle was the result of God's curse of Satan, which is the symbolic name for the sins of the flesh, against the Word, the created thoughts of Jesus, prophets and us saints.
　
Whenever the flesh of a prophet, Jesus or saint was living on earth, the Word was using them to give them life as all people in the flesh need. That's why we're all created as thoughts first. It's the only way we can function in the flesh as a living being. The prophets were born sinners like everyone else because of genetic sins but when they heard the spoken Word from their thoughts, they responded in obedience and God gave them faith. Now they could obey God's commandments so he could get them to speak for him.
　
God told the prophets about a messiah who would die for their sins so when they died, they knew they would be forgiven of their sinful flesh as promised. When Jesus came preaching the gospel, he needed to find one man to replace him and preach the same gospel after he died for the sins of all people. Peter happened to be the only disciple who God revealed himself to with a message. This gave Peter faith and he would recognize God when he came to give him commands to obey. After Jesus died, then the Word, or Holy Spirit began to give Peter commands to confess and repent of all his sins so he could be completely forgiven and become a sinless saint. Then Peter received the knowledge of God and began to preach the gospel. But this time, God would use Peter's voice since he was the voice of God. Potential saints had to obey this voice of Peter until they were mades sinless saints themselves and receive the knowledge to preach the gospel with.
　
This is how the true church of God was built and no sinner around them suspected anything. All they saw was a few men gathered together and talking about things they couldn't understand. These saints weren't out building physical churches or idols to look at. They never collected a penny of tithes and offerings because God kept them supplied with his miracles. God wanted them to keep preaching the gospel and not messing around with money the world loved more than him.
　
Now you can see how the true church of saints operated and the way God communicated his Word of truth through them. All these saints except me, so far, were killed by the Romans who were pagan worshippers. The Romans were sinners who didn't know or obey the true God. The curse by God was taking place with the killing of the saints by these sinners. Most of the prophets were killed by their own people who became pagan worshippers while they were captives of the Babylonians. Jesus was killed by both the jealousy of the Jews and the pride of the Romans who were pagan worshippers.
　
After all the saints were killed by the pagan worshipping Romans within the first three hundred years, there were many followers of the saints who were still in their sins but they had been obeying the gospel, which is the spoken Word. Those who were given faith by God would be created in the Word with the rest of us saints and prophets but the Romans didn't want them to become saints. They needed to keep them from having anything to do with the true God. Their leader Constantine, who was a pagan worshipper, was commissioned to figure out a way to keep these followers from the truth and they did it by mixing pagan beliefs with writings from the saints. Most of them were destroyed after the Romans confiscated them when they arrested the saints. They were trying to avoid any followers from reading them.
　
They introduced these followers to their pagan churches but they had to make idols that looked Christ-like to sell them of this major deception. No one had the truth in them so they were easily convinced by the Romans of their new church, which was called the Roman Catholic church. So the idols helped convince them but the main course was the new testament that was written by the Romans using some writings by the saints. This was a total rewritting so they could write in all their pagan beliefs and thoughts and remove anything that could help the followers from understanding the way to the Kingdom. That was the main reason for producing the new testament. This was not the original writings of the saints and far from the truth of God.
　
These followers were given the name, Christians, because that's what the pagan worshipping Romans called the true saints who would never did use a group name. They always used their first name with saint, christ, or any names describing who there created image of the Word was. This name of Christian was used for the name of the religion they started by using Christian and adding "ity" to it. Christianity had a nice ring to these pagan worshippers so that's what they called these followers as a group name.
　
At that time, the Roman government and all the leaders and people used in this scam, had to keep all this to themselves as much as they could. There were all kinds of lies involved in this deception of the true church of Christ so they would have killed anyone exposing them. Eventually, it was all in the past and not one new Christian became a new sinless saint after that deception. Any Christian who questioned the Vatican or religious leaders, would be tortured to stop him from asking or even killed if he didn't. The Romans ruled over this false religion very carefully and in time, the new generations learned the discipline of the Vatican and to keep quiet.
　
The Bible got in the hands of outsiders but the Romans killed them all because they didn't want anyone to figure out a way to being a sinless saint. They had great fear of these saints to make them kill so many people but that's how pagan worshippers maintain there power and control of people. The Protestant churches used different types of control such as the hell belief, Satan, the fruits of God which are all added into the scriptures to make God appear like a wimp who would never touch their sins. Their Jesus allows them to keep sinning if they want to. They use selfish love to love people into their churches and tell all their congregation that love is the way to heaven. These are all power trips to control people and have them fill their pockes with tithes and offerings that are a pagan belief. God doesn't need money because he knows how to perform miracles.
　
All of Christianity with it's 40,000+ denominations and all the other religions of the world are only pagan worshipping religions of man. They are all run by the sinful flesh that is selfish and disobedient to the spoken Word. Pagan worshipping keeps everyone in their sins and makes it almost impossible for them to hear the truth of God. These pagan religions may be helpful to the flesh while they're living but once they're dead, their created hearts, minds and souls will be eternally separated from the love of God. The love of God is knowledge and only the prophets, Jesus and us saints will understand this love, even though all the former sinners and pagan worshippers will get new bodies in paradise and live forever. They will never know what it's like to have all of God available to them but they will enjoy a life with a new language of truth to keep them from ever having fear again.

 

[horiturk]

a church and priests aren't needed to feel the presence of God,the kingdom of God is in you....the indwelling of the temple of your heart. i grew up going to catholic churches half the time and although the tridentine mass is a beautiful ritual i just didn't agree with it. i simply never agreed with the doctrines and practices of catholicism,i love jesus but i do not believe he was God. perhaps try a different church or just start praying in solitude,it's really between you and God anyways.

 

[Thomas]

I long to go to church again or some sort of worship service an experience the feeling of joy and hope rather than fear and anxiety.

I'm sorry, but I think you're treating Church and the Liturgy as some sort of medium in which you, the audience, expect to be entertained.

Thomas

 

[pghguy]

I'm sorry, but I think you're treating Church and the Liturgy as some sort of medium in which you, the audience, expect to be entertained.

Thomas

If you believe that is the case than aparently you are part of the probelm within the church rather tna the solution.

 

[pghguy]

a church and priests aren't needed to feel the presence of God,the kingdom of God is in you....the indwelling of the temple of your heart. i grew up going to catholic churches half the time and although the tridentine mass is a beautiful ritual i just didn't agree with it. i simply never agreed with the doctrines and practices of catholicism,i love jesus but i do not believe he was God. perhaps try a different church or just start praying in solitude,it's really between you and God anyways.

I'm beginning to believe this more and more.

 

[wil]

a church and priests aren't needed to feel the presence of God,the kingdom of God is in you....the indwelling of the temple of your heart. i grew up going to catholic churches half the time and although the tridentine mass is a beautiful ritual i just didn't agree with it. i simply never agreed with the doctrines and practices of catholicism,i love jesus but i do not believe he was God. perhaps try a different church or just start praying in solitude,it's really between you and God anyways.

I'm beginning to believe this more and more.

Not needed, but darned handy when you need bolstering up....

 

[China Cat Sunflower]

You know... the people of all faiths that I find most friendly, intelligent, and fulfilled are those who have found meaning in every day goodness, kindness, and generosity toward others. There is a strong message toward this in most belief systems. Thomas said as much to me recently and I believe him. I'm pretty skeptical when it comes to theology and the rigmarole of ceremonialism, but helping others and living the golden rule seems pretty basic. Atheists do it too. I'm dating a woman who attends a liberal Lutheran congregation. She is a second grade teacher at a public school and also teaches Sunday school. I've been to her church a couple of times, and even though the service does nothing for me I like the fact that the church is engaged in coordinated charitable activities. I'm beginning to appreciate the force multiplier effect of a community coming together to do something positive in the world. It becomes so much more than any of us can do on our own. You don't need a church to do that, but this venue seems handy and available and not too dogmatic so I think I can hang with it. Plus, my lady friend like e going with her ad I don't absolutely HAVE to play golf EVERY Sunday!

Chris

 

[vizenos]

I'm Catholic in that I attend a Catholic Church and have done so since childhood. However, I question several aspects of the faith and feel that perhaps it has lost meaning in becoming to mechanical and legalistic.

And I am Catholic in that I, by God's grace, am a Greek Orthodox Christian. That is what I am no matter where I am, because that is what God has given me to be.

Although many if not most small children inherently have a slight aversion to religion - for example kids by nature are sort of ancy and sometimes play around during church or fidget anxiously until the weekly ceremony is done so they can go about their lives - it seems as more mature people we should be more in touch with our faith.

This is what you see, and therefore what you believe; yet Christ our God said, "Amen I say to you, unless you are converted and become as little children, you will by no means enter the kingdom of heaven."

Yes, time drags for a little child, when s/he is forced to sit still, be quiet, and pretend to listen to someone saying stuff s/he doesn't understand, but this doesn't mean the child does not love God, only that s/he does not love human customs that make no sense to a little child. Question: is it possible that God doesn't love such things, either?

This being said, over the years and especially recently, church services and dogma have seemed to bring about more of a sense of unhappiness, despair, and having felt far less meaningful.

Is it possible that you are reacting to these things the way a little child would? And if so, is that necessarily a bad thing?

I always thought that in the practice of worship, we should be inclined to at least feel comfortable if not in a state of zeal for life and love and the good things of this world and the wonders of God. In me, this seems to have all but died.

So you feel thirsty, and all you have is an empty cup?

Well, before a cup can be filled, it must first be empty. If it isn't, there's no room in it for anything new.

I long to go to church again or some sort of worship service an experience the feeling of joy and hope rather than fear and anxiety.

And that is precisely how I felt, too, over a long, dark period of time which suddenly ended when I walked into a place I'd never been before and instantly knew I had come Home.

If I could give you what I got, that day, I would; but the answer that worked for me might well do nothing for you. I'm sure you'll get a deluge of free advice in response to your message, and I'm equally sure it'll be worth what you paid for it. But as for me, I can only say that, when I didn't know where to turn or what to do, I just asked God to guide me, then did my utmost best to figure out where He was guiding me, and by God's lovingkindness that worked for me. Perhaps it could work for you, too.

Regards,
vizenos

 

[vizenos]

If you believe that is the case than aparently you are part of the probelm within the church rather tna the solution.

I can understand your reaction to Thomas' words, but I think the truth of it is that Thomas simply forgot, for a moment, that it's not enough to speak the truth as we see it; we must first, last, and always speak the truth in love, and that's something we most often remember after we've spoken, and then, of course, it's too late.

Regards,
vizenos