Here's the thing ...

Thomas

So it goes ...
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In a discussion between myself an @otherbrother, he made this comment:
What you said is consistent with Bohr’s (father of Quantum Physics) inviolable wall, which I think was wrong too.

So not knowing what 'Bohr's inviolable wall' is, I put that phrase into a search engine, and that led to cosmic-core.org.

Specifically a page mentioning the aforesaid 'wall', and my eye alighted upon this text:

Bohm and his ‘Quantum Potential’ Field
Dr. Bohm assumed particles do exist in the absence of observers.
He assumed a reality beneath Bohr’s inviolable wall.
He called his field the ‘quantum potential’. It pervaded all space like gravity; but did not diminish with distance. In essence, it was the Aether.
The behavior of the parts were actually organized by the whole.
He suggested wholeness was in some ways the more primary reality.
In Dr. Bohm’s interpretation of quantum physics, location ceased to exist. “All points in space became equal to all other points in space.”
Nonlocality became a central part of his work.


This sparked off many correspondences, as fruitful ground for a theology/quantum cosmology debate ... it was quite exciting, and there seemed to be a vast range of reference across the fields of Quantum research.

So after a brief dip into science, I looked to see if the site had anything to say about religion, and found a religion and cosmology section, and dived into that.

And here, it all went wrong ... what I read was a standard variation of a New Age melange of ideas intermixed with a views of religion that are frankly naive and fundamentalist to the point of offensive.

Whereas the science writings refer to scientists and scientific development without resort to pejorative language, the religious narrative is shallow, ignorant and ill-informed, and littered with pejorative opinion from the get-go – and this despite soundbites from people whom I hold is high regard – Keith Crichelow, Rupert Sheldrake. The fact is the commentary on religion is just a crock.

And notably, not one reference to a viable theology or theologian ...

Shame. It's hard enough to argue religion and science need not be at loggerheads, but a religious website as dismissive of science, as this site is dismissive of religion, would raise hackles ...

If anyone knows of sites where religion and science are presented as complementary, without prejudice, I'm interested.
 
Just one example:

As we have discussed several times before, The Word means Logos in Christianity.
OK

The word Logos means ratio, or ‘vibration in ratio’, that is: harmonic sound. In other words, ‘vibration in ratio’ means vibration with a geometric form where the structure of the geometry has a harmonic proportion, as proportion is the natural evolution of ratios.
No, it does not.

The Greek term at core means 'word' or 'reason' – the term 'ratio' can be applied, but only in a very broad sense, along with other terms – 'word', 'speech', 'statement', 'discourse', 'refutation', 'ratio', 'proportion', 'account', 'explanation', 'reason', 'thought'. (A Greek-English Lexicon compiled by Henry George Liddell and Robert Scott. Revised and augmented throughout by Sir Henry Stuart Jones with the assistance of Roderick McKenzie (Oxford at Clarendon Press, 1983).

Remember that ratios and proportions are not about specific numbers, but are about relationships between numbers.

They can be, and are when used so contextually, but 'ratio' and 'proportion' are also used, by the Greeks, conceptually with regard to reason in discourse. Ratio and Proportion in this sense refers to the qualitative relation between statements or propositions, for example, in a rational discourse – geometry is not a primary reading.

In proportions, there are no fixed quantities, only fixed relationships.
What about making bread – in making bread there are determinate fixed quantities in relation.


So, we have The Word = Logos = “Vibration in Ratio” = Harmonic Sound = Standing waves of Geometry = Fluctuations/Oscillations of the Aether = Movement/Vibrations of Divine Thought.

As shown, we actually don't, beyond the model in the author's mind. The point here being that for the likes of Plato, Aristotle, Philo of Alexandria, John the Beloved Disciple, Plotinus, Clement and Origen and the Church Fathers, etc, Logos means something else altogether.


This process of Divine Thought creating rippling patterns in the Aether causes the creation of photons and the corresponding gravitational inflow of Aether that leads to the creation of matter and life.

That rather suggests a continuity of substance between Divine Thought and Aether and aether and the emergence of energy – it necessitates common qualities that can relate proportionately.

In the minds of those mentioned, there is always the Absolute beyond all forms, and 'ratio' etc., presupposes a form, and the author makes the classic category error of applying a rule here, to there, where in fact the rules do not apply.
 
If anyone knows of sites where religion and science are presented as complementary, without prejudice, I'm interested.
To start of I wanna say... I don't, dont know of such a site.

But as atated before i do believe both science and religionists seek the same thing. The answer. And i think they will find the same thing someday...

As i see it the issue is religion holds on to its ancient texts as gospel, it is written. Where as science, when it discovers a mistake, it rewrites the text book.

For religions, the updates are splinters, since they can't peer review and duplicate the experiment to the degreee to agree upon...they splinter into new denominations, sects, or religions.

We can run into similar with science, different factions battle and argue and work toward their proofs until one or the other theory wins out or in the process a new answer is found...once they agree...we have a new textbook.

Some things take ages.... I still see in museums pterodactyl and T-rexs with scales or leathery skins instead of feathers....but I anticipate the school books and museums will be making changes in the next couple generations and it won't stick to the old script for centuries or millenia.

Now yes, among theologians in whatever sect they have come to new understandings about allegory and parables and metaphor and realize that much of scripture cannot be read literally as it is not scientifically or historically accurate it is where every primary student has to start....which to me is like starting out teaching kids about leeches and humours instead of bacteria and bloodtypes...

Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road that leads to destruction, and many enter through it.

Seems to me science (right or wrong) keeps working on narrowing the path, eliminating the side roads that they find not worthy, but sometimes having to go back to reexamine.

The various holy books contain scripture that includes flawed science and history....trying to merge without updates seems forever problematic.
 
As i see it the issue is religion holds on to its ancient texts as gospel, it is written. Where as science, when it discovers a mistake, it rewrites the text book.
Theology does that all the time ... it just doesn't need to rewrite the core text, rather it understands the core text better ... the core text isn't wrong, whereas scientific theory often is.

hence why the Bible, the Quran, the Sutras, the Upanishads, etc., etc, will be read and read anew long after scientific tomes have been relegated to the museums.

Having said that, certain scientific statements do and will stand the test of time.

But science and religion are not the same thing, and to suppose one should act like the other is to do a disservice to both.

The closest analogy I can give is the Laws of Nature were written, entire and complete, at the Big Bang. We're unpacking that still – but its our understandings that change, not the Laws.

Now yes, among theologians in whatever sect they have come to new understandings about allegory and parables and metaphor and realize that much of scripture cannot be read literally as it is not scientifically or historically accurate it is where every primary student has to start....which to me is like starting out teaching kids about leeches and humours instead of bacteria and bloodtypes...
Well here I question your understanding of metaphor, allegory and parable ... you seem to dismiss them as as without substance.

The various holy books contain scripture that includes flawed science and history....trying to merge without updates seems forever problematic.
As you know, I think that's a false, rearward-looking view – they were not written as science, and history was a different order of narrative.
 
If anyone knows of sites where religion and science are presented as complementary, without prejudice, I'm interested.
I'm not sure yet about entire sites devoted to the topic, but I found the following (some are just articles)

And then of course Max Planck
Max Planck’s religion: Church elder, deist, founder of quantum theory THIS ARTICLE IS PART OF A SERIES - SCROLL TO THE BOTTOM FOR LINKS TO OTHER SCIENTIFIC FIGURES AND THEIR RELATIONSHIP TO RELIGION
Home MAX PLANCK INSTITUTE FOR STUDY OF RELIGIOUS AND ETHNIC DIVERSITY
Max Planck - Thoughts Upon Religion - Via Hygeia THIS IS A HOLISTIC SPIRITUALITY SITE WITH AN ARTICLE ABOUT MAX PLANCK


Front Page | Yale Forum on Religion and Ecology YALE FORUM ON RELIGION AND ECOLOGY So this site IS about religion and science unified, I'm not sure if this is the kind of thing you mean?

This one seems to be a forum in the sense of the organization holding live conferences rather than a discussion forum like this but they seem to be all about taking science and religion both seriously
The Science and Religion Forum Science and Religion forum
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1111/zygo.12882 This is an article about the group above, and the links on the side of the article to other articles seem very pertinent to this too:

Catholics and Science

CATHOLIC SCIENTISTS WEBSITE - THIS MAY BE WHAT YOU HAD IN MIND (catholicscientists.org)
 
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