Father, Son?

[rocala]

I am hoping to ask a series of questions, alongside my reading, in order to gain a better understanding of Christianity. I have seen and heard Jesus Christ referred to as the "son of God." Is this correct (in trinitarian terms)? Should the term God be replaced with Father.

At my present stage of study, it seems that some who would describe themselves as Trinitarians do not express themselves as if they are.

 

[Faithfulservant]

We do refer to the Father as God as more of a title. Personalizing it we refer to Him as God the Father and Jesus as God the Son and then God the Holy Spirit. Jesus taught His disciples to refer to Him as The Father and as we pray like the Lords prayer we pray to the Father. Our Father who art in heaven and then Jesus this

John 14:13-17 NKJV And whatever you ask in My name, that I will do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If you ask anything in My name, I will do it. “If you love Me, keep My commandments.

The Holy Spirit works as a conduit of sorts as believers are indwelled with Him. He points us to Jesus and Jesus points us to the Father. All three are seperate and all three are God.

I wanted to add that all three can be prayed to in a single prayer I can ask the Father for help and ask Jesus for help and the Holy Spirit for help. I do this often.

 

[TheLightWithin]

I am hoping to ask a series of questions, alongside my reading, in order to gain a better understanding of Christianity. I have seen and heard Jesus Christ referred to as the "son of God." Is this correct (in trinitarian terms)? Should the term God be replaced with Father.

At my present stage of study, it seems that some who would describe themselves as Trinitarians do not express themselves as if they are.

I'm not sure if you are looking for something about the historical development of the idea, but the book "When Jesus Became God" by Richard Rubinstein When Jesus Became God: The Struggle to Define Christian… discusses how the idea evolved in the early centuries of Christianity and the politics (church and state) alongside the development of the theology in the growing church.

 

[Thomas]

I am hoping to ask a series of questions, alongside my reading, in order to gain a better understanding of Christianity.

OK

I have seen and heard Jesus Christ referred to as the "son of God." Is this correct (in trinitarian terms)? Should the term God be replaced with Father.

Sheesh! Start with a simple one!

Yes, in Trinitarian terms, Jesus is God, the Son of God – in that sense 'son' is only analogous, and refers to a relation within the Divine Nature.

At my present stage of study, it seems that some who would describe themselves as Trinitarians do not express themselves as if they are.

You'd have to tell me more about who is describing what as how, if you see what I mean.

St Augustine had a good analogy when he said that God knows Himself, and that His self-knowledge is how He knows Himself, and that self-knowledge is as perfect as Himself, so perfect that it is identical to Himself, and in that sense 'possesses' all that God is ...

And if you're looking for a rational answer, then it's worth remembering that God transcends our ability to determine things.

 

[Thomas]

Another reflection is that some would say my saying 'In essence it's a mystery' is a cop-out.

But then I would suggest that the view that 'I' can understand absolutely everything, there can be nothing beyond my powers of comprehension, and therefore if I can't comprehend it, it can't be true ... is somewhat dubious.

 

[rocala]

'son' is only analogous, and refers to a relation within the Divine Nature.

That does make things a little clearer.

And if you're looking for a rational answer, then it's worth remembering that God transcends our ability to determine things.

some would say my saying 'In essence it's a mystery' is a cop-out.

I can certainly see the problem here. I have had conversations where, IMO, "the beyond us" card is overused. If however, some effort at comprehension is made, I feel it is reasonable.

Thank you for your comments Thomas, they are most helpful.

 

[Thomas]

... but the book "When Jesus Became God" by Richard Rubinstein ...

I haven't read the book, but from what I gather, Rubinstein is by a specialist in conflict resolution rather than theology?

The issue raised with the book is that he focusses (dare I say it) on a particular conflict in the 4th century which led to the Council of Nicaea, which was not about the divinity of Jesus per se, but His relation to the Father.

 

[TheLightWithin]

I haven't read the book, but from what I gather, Rubinstein is by a specialist in conflict resolution rather than theology?

The issue raised with the book is that he focusses (dare I say it) on a particular conflict in the 4th century which led to the Council of Nicaea, which was not about the divinity of Jesus per se, but His relation to the Father.

I believe that is his specialty.
The book is a good introduction to the history of the topic. Great context.
Interesting in looking it up I found there is another Richard Rubenstein who was a theologian.

 

[rocala]

I have started reading "The Real Christ" by Bernadette Roberts. She says "... God transcends all gender, we have to be careful not to be caught up in the metaphors used for the Trinity as "Father and Son". Since God is neither mother, father, son or daughter, these metaphors must not be taken literally or understood as God ad intra."

I think this ties in with what you are saying Thomas. So far I am very impressed by the book. Are you familiar with it Thomas?

 

[Thomas]

No! Looks interesting ...