Godless Asians and Hinduism

[DynoMight]

It seems to me that the title and description of this forum is seriously in error. When I say forum I mean Eastern Thought not the Hinduisn subforum. Not only does the title of the forum leave out religion altogether but its description "Buddhism, Confucianism, Tao and others" doesn't even mention Hinduism. Nearly eight hundred million Hindus in the world and we're not recognized by name or as a religion.

I have to wonder why the creators the Comparative-Religion website chose this peculiar way to design their forum. Looking at other peculiar aspects of the forum it seems that it might be the case that this direspect was afforded to Hindus in order to placate Muslims.

Take for example the fact that the Baha'i Faith isn't listed as an Abrahamic religion. This is unsual as the Baha'i Faith is well known and well documented as an Abrahamic tradition. Muslims are however offended by the mear existence of Baha'is because they recognize a prophet after Muhammud. Considering that the moderators have recently claimed to be taking a more hands off approach and lowering the walls of gardens it is telling that they more recently removed a post from the Abrahamic Religions forum that mearly stated that the Baha' Faith is an Abrahamic tradition.

I think that as Hindus (and in my case a person of Hindu heritage) we should be offended by this slighting. And if by chase it was done in the interest of appeasing Muslims the I believe the offense is double.

 

[wil]

hmmm While not being creator or anything else of these forums but a user...

I see Hinduism as a Sub forum under Eastern Thought...and some of these are without G-d, and I think some of them even don't consider themselves religion. Hard to please all the people all the time.

So if you were creating your forum you would list it how? So as not to elicit complaints?

I wonder if the Hindus who have been posting for a while feel dissed...

 

[Vajradhara]

Namaste Dynomight,

thank you for the post.

You are, of course, free to be offended by anything that you wish. It is, however, not the case that the Sanatana Dharma was put under "Eastern Thought" to appease those of the Abrahmaic faiths.

the various paradigms from Asia, such as Jain Dharma, Sanatana Dharma, Buddha Dharma and more, have more aspects to them than what we find as typical fare for the Abrahmaic faiths. as such, the best method to include religious as well as philosopihcal discussions which are focused on the various Eastern paradigms was to have a general "Eastern Thoughts" folder.

that is, in and of itself, a bit of a culture thing.. from the point of view of one from Japan, the Buddha Dharma is a Western thing!

If you had read about the reasons for moving the Baha'i into the modern religious section, you would discover that the reason for this was to allow the Baha'i members here the ability to discuss their faith and point of view without having to deal with fundamentalists of the other Abrahamic faiths.

Each one of these sections is what we call a "walled garden". everyone is free to come and look and participate in any garden provided that the rules of the garden are followed. This, too, is to allow people of a more moderate pursuasion to discuss their faith without feeling undue pressure from other groups.

In the end, of course, you are free to be upset if you wish

metta,

~v

 

[DynoMight]

I think that Dharminic Religions would be a much better title than "Eastern Thought".

I think that something like Dharminic Religions is not only more descriptive but also speaks to the real depth of the philosophies involved. I mean anyone might have a "thought" but to have a world view and a creed is something much larger.

No matter how you slice it; Offended. Not Offended. "Eastern Thought" is a pretty weak description.

 

[wil]

II think that something like Dharminic Religions

So that is inclusive of Hindu, Buddhist, Jain and Sikh...yes?

Leaving out Shinto, Confucious, Tao and....

That is where it gets tough...you can please some of the people some of the time...

 

[DynoMight]

So that is inclusive of Hindu, Buddhist, Jain and Sikh...yes?

Leaving out Shinto, Confucious, Tao and....

That is where it gets tough...you can please some of the people some of the time...

It's simple enough Shinto, Confucianism and Taoism should have their own forum. Of course Eastern Philosophy would be a better title for it than Eastern Thought.

Come on. Admit it. Eastern Thought is a weak name and a lame description.

 

[Vajradhara]

Namaste Dyno,

thank you for the post.

not all of the so-called Eastern paradigms are Dharma traditions. If we would go down the route that you are proposing, i suspect that we'd have endless divisions and sub-divisions of the forum making for an administrative nightmare!

it seems that the title was sufficient for you to know what the various subjects here would be

metta,

~v

 

[Agnideva]

Namaste All,

Hmmm… an interesting thread.

It seems to me that the title and description of this forum is seriously in error. When I say forum I mean Eastern Thought not the Hinduisn subforum. Not only does the title of the forum leave out religion altogether but its description "Buddhism, Confucianism, Tao and others" doesn't even mention Hinduism. Nearly eight hundred million Hindus in the world and we're not recognized by name or as a religion.

Dyno, I do understand the points you raise here, and I know you’ve brought up this issue with the site administrator as well. Let me, if I may, say a few words about Hinduism and religion. As Hindus, we do use the term “religion” quite freely to describe the Sanātana Dharma system(s). However, whether Hinduism is a “religion” in the classical sense can and has been debated.

Religious Tolerance gives the following comprehensive definition of what a religion is:

"Religion is any specific system of belief about deity, often involving rituals, a code of ethics, a philosophy of life, and a worldview." (A worldview is a set of basic, foundational beliefs concerning deity, humanity and the rest of the universe.) Thus we would consider Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Native American Spirituality, and Neopaganism to be religions. We also include Agnosticism, Atheism, Humanism, Ethical Culture etc. as religions, because they also contain a "belief about deity" -- their belief is that they do not know whether a deity exists, or they have no knowledge of God, or they sincerely believe that God does not exist.

While Hinduism qualifies the above definition in the fullest sense, we must also concede that it also over-qualifies … meaning that there are many distinct sets of the above qualifications within what we call Hinduism. Best definition for Hinduism is probably that it is a fellowship of multiple “religions” all sharing certain core beliefs, practices, texts, etc. Overall, it can be called a “religion” in the sense of religare - something that binds people together, but not in the classic sense of how Christianity or Islam are religions. Also remember that Hindu Dharma does contain a complex system of eastern thought which includes multiple inter-related philosophies, theologies, metaphysical, and ontological principles. Also, I'm sure you're familiar with a highly clichéd statement that many Hindus often make: “Hinduism is not a religion, it is a way of life.” (Actually you’ll hear this sort of statement from followers of almost every system, and is not peculiar to Sanātana Dharma adherents)

I have to wonder why the creators the Comparative-Religion website chose this peculiar way to design their forum. Looking at other peculiar aspects of the forum it seems that it might be the case that this direspect was afforded to Hindus in order to placate Muslims.

I fail to see how not listing Hinduism under a heading would placate Muslims.

It's simple enough Shinto, Confucianism and Taoism should have their own forum.

Wouldn’t you agree though Dyno that all the eastern systems have certain elements in common, especially in the way in which they view the world around them? I agree with Vajra here that creating more and more forums will lead to administrative nightmares!

Of course Eastern Philosophy would be a better title for it than Eastern Thought.

Every one of these eastern systems could equally argue that they are not mere philosophies, but there is a strong element of practice also involved in them, could they not?

No matter how you slice it; Offended. Not Offended. "Eastern Thought" is a pretty weak description.

Be that as it may, apart from technicalities of definition, I still think we all know where to find the Hinduism forum, don’t we?

So if you were creating your forum you would list it how? So as not to elicit complaints?
I wonder if the Hindus who have been posting for a while feel dissed...

I, for one, do not particularly feel dissed, Wil. Hinduism is quite complex and no single term can encompass all its expressions. Hinduism, in fact, could have its own CR board . Actually, there is such a thing in existence elsewhere.

AUM Shanti,
A.

 

[DynoMight]

I fail to see how not listing Hinduism under a heading would placate Muslims./quote]

It's simple enough Muslims generally think that Hindus are idol worshipping polytheists and according to their book it is open season on them. Just go into a opun Hindu chat room and you more often than not find a large group of Muslims throwing the most disrespectful and obscene remarks at Hindus. I believe it would placate them and thus attract more Muslims to this forum to refer to Hinduism as not a religion, not even a philosophy but rather just as a thought. Kind of like an after thought.

Keeping the Baha'i Faith out of the Abrahamic Religions forum is another good example of yielding to Muslim insensibilities.

It seems that the "Walled Garden Approach" has been taken in such a way as to yield to the prejudices of Muslims. All of this reveals probably what is the true purpose of this forum. It is not to have a free and open discussion about the subject of comparative religion. Rather the purpose of this forum is ween religious zealots (or at least the leaders of religious zealots) onto religious tolerance. If that is the case do the moderatots and administrators of this forum not respect our Hindu fundamentalists. They can be just as violent and intolerant as any Muslims.

 

[Agnideva]

Namaste Dyno,

It's simple enough Muslims generally think that Hindus are idol worshipping polytheists and according to their book it is open season on them.

Well Dyno, these sorts of ignorant opinions do exist among people. This could be because people who think thus: (a) don’t know much/anything about Hinduism or (b) choose not to know because they are convinced that only their particular system is correct. If the reason is (a), then we need more CR type forums so people can ask questions and get answers. If the reason is (b), then we really can’t help it.

Just go into a open Hindu chat room and you more often than not find a large group of Muslims throwing the most disrespectful and obscene remarks at Hindus.

Such may be the case in other forums. I can’t attest to this because I actually don't post in other forums, but I can tell you that in my experience this sort of thing does not happen here.

I believe it would placate them and thus attract more Muslims to this forum to refer to Hinduism as not a religion, not even a philosophy but rather just as a thought. Kind of like an after thought.

Dyno, the site staff is not trying to placate anyone, nor to put down some people and their belief system over another.

Keeping the Baha'i Faith out of the Abrahamic Religions forum is another good example of yielding to Muslim insensibilities.

I believe Vajradhara has addressed this issue and cited the reasons for the movement of Baha’i out of the Abrahamic Religions.

All of this reveals probably what is the true purpose of this forum. It is not to have a free and open discussion about the subject of comparative religion. Rather the purpose of this forum is ween religious zealots (or at least the leaders of religious zealots) onto religious tolerance.

You are free to believe this if you wish. In the time that I’ve been here I have never felt this way.

OM Shanti,
A.