Thoughts....

wil said:
Yeah, the theory goes that men are in less control of their libido than women...hence the need for women to cover up, rather than men put their animal instincts in check.

But from my research and anecdotal evidence....um...er...I am thankful that women also have urges and needs to be fulfilled. I'ma goin to the hell I don't believe in!
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It is really just an excuse to place a woman in a lower station than a man. To me its an abusive man that requires this.
 
The bible is actually worse...the Quran much more enlightened toward women than the bible (the part about ye without sin cast the first stone is not in any early texts and is thought an addition today).

With Paul saying women shouldn't speak in church....that has repercussions that have lasted 2000 years... women weren't even counted in a census... men could have a number of wives and concubines....women not so much. Oldest male inherited... the list of misogynist scripture goes on and on....but again, a product of an unenlightened time.
 
Whoah I totally missed any more discussion after my last post... (probably a glitch that didn't show highlight)

wil, the Hadith you mentioned is widely debated. Most Scholars accept it, but many find it weak (mind you not all). I side more with one of the poster's, The "right" path is the one who is not named. The one who focusses on Quran, Hadith, (and they mentioned the companions although I consider them just men, and capable of error) and does not bother with these divisions. I have heard many Hadith similar. Some say there are 72 schools of thought, 71 will be in hell, 70 will only be there for a time. Some say 72 schools of thought and 71 are going to heaven, but varying levels.
 
donnann said:
It makes no sense to me to cover your face. It makes a good point though on how if women do it men should.
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Convering your face, if chosen by the woman, I can see as a beneficial thing. She does not have to worry what people think about her looks, nor does she have to endure men who do nonsense like catcalling, or those that are really bad that are just looking for a beautiful woman to have their way with. That being said, I disagree in that noone can identify the person. Which means there is no chance for actual social constructs outside of the home.

I personally believe it is a choice. I'm not a big fan of the "I'm right because this person told me this" crowd that is all too common in the Muslim community. (I know it is not exclusive to Muslims).

wil's point about the libido is probably the most common explanation. I could come up with a few more, including the one before about a woman's confidence,etc. To be honest the only safe explanation is given in Quran. "...It is better for you". If the other explanations don't work, it is just faith that Allah is telling you the best practice. As for men, to cover to that degree would hinder and be unsafe for most work environments. If you take the Libido example as reason, I doubt many women will be enticed into forcing a man into marital relations outside of marriage, especially women who are not conversing or watching movies involving sexuality daily.

Donna, your other statement is true IMO also. If it is forced, it is dispicable. It must be the woman's choice.
 
I would say when you look for an answer you are bound to find it. Both of the sites you have listed are anti-Islam by a clear margin. If you can read any page on there without thinking so, you are trying to find error.

Top 10 Countries With Highest Rape Crime

10 Shocking Sexual Violence Statistics - Wonderslist (for a more updated list)

Countries Compared by Crime > Rape rate. International Statistics at NationMaster.com

Which country has the highest reported incidents of rape? [DATA] | GlobalPost

Rape Statistics | Statistic Brain

What does this show? News that is biased is everywhere, same as uninformed news. Now we can also look to how they defined rape. Many define it as reported rape, some as convicted. Rape is generally not caused by attraction. (I'm not saying it hasn't happened, but generally not). It is however usually a hate crime. India for instance has a very high rate of rape both reported and even higher non-reported. Why is that? The Hindus, Muslims, Christians, etc. have been at odds for hundreds of years. This longstanding hatred makes one group feel the others are beneath them or that they are non-human. This is where a majority of rape happens, where people feel the woman they see is less human than the "right" man is. Look at Fraternities in the US. I'm sure I cold get a statistic to back up this old claim I heard from a professor in college, 1/4 women in college will be raped. Why? It's not hatred for the most part as it tends to happen at parties. It is usually greed. young (high horomone) males drinking and making the best decisions sees a girl they think looks good and think they believe she SHOULD BE HIS or THEIRS. 10 minutes later the frat runs a train on her while she is drunk or drugged or beaten (last being the least common in this scenario).
 
wil said:
Tis why I asked....about both of them... thanks for the links supporting that they are wrong...
lapping it up? hilarious.
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Funny ... only took me five minutes to find out for myself, why you needed someone to do this for you I have no idea... :rolleyes:
 
Thanx BJN, yeah, I found it and posted it...

You know...once you are on a page....ctrl c, ctrl v... it is a simple thing to do.

Sure while I am in the kitchen, I'll get you a glass of water...

or "NO, it only took me a minute to get up and get my glass, why should you need me to do this for you I have no idea"

I'd much rather bitch slap you to keep the perceived feud going than be helpful...
 
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