Overcoming the moment of Doubt ^^

[Thomas]

Oh no. Not everything happens for 'a Reason'. Most of the time, the link between an event and an action are merely coincidence.

Or not there at all, but assumed as part of our self-affirming narrative.

Also humans have a tendency to see significance in much that is in reality coincidence.

Don't we, though!

... we tend to notice when an event seems to have a relationship because we take notice when the connection seems to be there. But we do not notice the thousands of times more often when nothing happens.

Once again, the value of Tradition, and Direction – taking on board your negatives re tradition – But doing it alone? You're kidding yourself: 'The last to see it is you.' Wise words.

In religious circles this concept is particularly abused.

And some.

A plane crashes and everyone dies, but somehow a baby survived. It's a Miracle!

That kind of thing always gets me. A hundred dead, one survives... some miracle. A better miracle would have been no crash.

+++

As in most things 'mystical', people really don't understand what's going on.

 

[Thomas]

I was taught by a Hindu Pandit that 3 things govern the universe. 'Fate', 'Free Will' and 'Stuff Just Happens' and that the important thing to remember is, any one of those can change the other two.

Wise words! But ... how do we discern between the first and the third, when it's a given – scientifically proven – that the human mind will create a narrative where in reality none exists! And as for 'free will', well there's a can of worms. A meta-'quantum entanglement' if ever there was one!

And I'm a believer!

 

[Thomas]

I read doubt as a sign that one's 'pushing the envelope'.

 

[Namaste Jesus]

Certainly worth a point to ponder, NJ. Though from my perspective I would word it that it is your subconscious reminding you. But then maybe 'powers that be' include what I am saying too!

I could live with that.

NJ,

There is a difference between anxiety-caused delay and divine-intervention-caused delay. With practice you can learn to differentiate the two. I have gotten to the point where I am pretty good at differentiating the two.

I would have to agree.

Wise words! But ... how do we discern between the first and the third, when it's a given – scientifically proven – that the human mind will create a narrative where in reality none exists! And as for 'free will', well there's a can of worms. A meta-'quantum entanglement' if ever there was one!

And I'm a believer!

For sure! It's one of those things that makes your head spin. "Well it must be this... oh no wait a minute, it must be that..., but then again it could be....."

As to 'Free Will' why should we give him a break? He stays here like the rest of us!...lol!

 

[Devils' Advocate]

That kind of thing always gets me. A hundred dead, one survives... some miracle. A better miracle would have been no crash..

Well, I wasn't going to say that, but since you did - AbsoPositutely!

As in most things 'mystical', people really don't understand what's going on.

Yes. This is the most frustrating part for me when I'm speaking with someone who believes in the mystical. They cannot or will not take the time to understand how this reality works. Such as the mystical coincidence that isn't we have been talking about. When I explain this a lot of people get this kinda 'crumpled' look, as if I have stolen the magic from their world.

And the really sad thing is that there is wondrous magic all over the place! Learning to tell the one from the other is, I would think, a good thing.

 

[Devils' Advocate]

As to 'Free Will' why should we give him a break? He stays here like the rest of us!...lol!

If I get your joke it should read "As to 'Free Wil' why should we ……."

I have been tempted to make this joke so many times I cannot tell you. lol.

 

[Namaste Jesus]

Maybe it should read, "Free W!l"

 

[Namaste Jesus]

No matter how strong we are, there always comes a time when we doubt ourselves. Whether the beliefs we are following are true or are we just following like blind sheep going into the well, one after another? So what should one do to overcome the moment of such doubts. Lets share our thoughts and experiences....

Since I've been instrumental in knocking the train off the tracks this time, let me see if I can guide it back on by actually answering the question.

Throughout my life I've had second thoughts and self doubt about nearly everything. Choice just doesn't come easy for me so I mull over, mull over and mull over again. I really don't know a good way to overcome that, but I don't necessarily think it needs to be overcome. To me, doubt is a good thing. It's our inner voice trying to keep us out of harms way.

Actually, the only time I did not have any doubt was when I decided to get married and that was the best decision I've ever made. So for me, doubt is there for a reason. Every time I've had it, there has been something else to consider that I hadn't thought of before.

 

[Devils' Advocate]

It is only natural for choice to be difficult for most of us. It is so because we almost never have all the information we need to make a choice with any comfort. Mostly we have to make choices knowing we don't have all the information we need to make that choice. So we have doubts. The more important the decision and the smaller amount of information available to us, the harder it is to make a decision.

A lot of people do not want to make that decision. Problem is not making a decision IS making a decision. The decision to do nothing! Which often can be the worst choice possible. Wisdom, in my humble opinion, is that no matter how something turns out, one is comfortable that with the information that was available, we made the best decision we could at the time. Easier said than done.

 

[wil]

I read doubt as a sign that one's 'pushing the envelope'.

questioning faith?

 

[Thomas]

questioning faith?

Pushing the envelope of faith. Do I question it? No, it's beyond that. Do I question me? All the time.

I would say if you have no doubts you're comfortable, and if you're comfortable, you're coasting ... but that's me ... and that doesn't mean one might not one day drift into deep or stormy waters.

Are saints and sages comfortable in their unquestioning faith? Or are they better at managing their doubts? Or do they understand that there are some questions that cannot be answered, and don't trouble themselves with concocting narratives to provide comfortable answers ... or is there something in faith that transcends doubt, something which, if one has not experienced it, one can only doubt.

I have met a few who are, I would have thought, beyond doubt. But I think there's more to it than that.

Give me the strength to change the things I can,
The fortitude in the face of those I can't,
And the wisdom to know the difference.

The Dark Night of the Soul of St John of the Cross, but then we're into a dimension of 'doubt' far beyond the kind of thing we're discussing here.

And yet the simple man, the widow at the temple, or the centurion with the sick daughter, are held up as paragons, and they none of them show doubt. Are we going to criticise them for not expressing doubt? Some would, but then some would elevate doubt to be a virtue, when perhaps, too often, it's a vice. A part of one's avoidance mechanisms ...

Doubt is not always a sign of wisdom.

Of course there are gurus who say 'question'. It's very fashionable, it's the zeitgeist. No-one will criticise you for that, it's a safe bet. And the evidence is there – books that tell you how to question sell. And opens up for the next book, which tells you how to find the answers.

+++

Doubt arises when one is suspended between two contradictory propositions.

It's worth questioning both propositions as open mindedly as one can. Often doubts tend to inflate, and become in themselves much bigger impediments than the thing that actually gave cause to doubt in the first place.

 

[Thomas]

Just an addendum here ...

Religions like Judaism, Christianity, Buddhism, Islam, have been around for quite some time, and in the course of time have amassed quite a considerable amount of wisdom, insight, and so on, with regard to the human condition.

So when someone says they questioned their religion and found it wanting, I would suggest some insightful reflection might lead one to the realisation that it's not the religion that's wanting. The Dalai Lama, as I have said before, is quite outspoken on that point. A serious study of the Sophia Perennis would highlight the error of that assumption. The saints and sages down through the ages seem to be of the same mind also.

It's a tough process, as one has to overcome the inculcated ideology of a consumer culture.

 

[Thomas]

And again ...

If one is under the umbrella of a tradition, then there is a 'golden treasury' of commentary on just this sort of question. Perusal of such texts quickly brings one to realise that one is not alone, one is not unique, probably what one thinks is one's own personal struggle is, in fact, not at all uncommon, and that there is nothing new under the sun ... and sometimes, even to the point of understanding that when we're afflicted by doubts, sometimes it's the tail wagging the dog!