Thoughts about Trinity beliefs

A story from, if I recall, a Syrian monk around the 5th century. Probably apocryphal, but I'd like it to be true...

He was a theologian, locked in a dispute with two non-Christian philosophers, and the whole thing had become quite acrimonious and bitter.

One night he had a dream ... in the dream, he saw the two in a great pit, which he took to be the mouth of hell, or a figurative expression of their error, something like that. They were trying to climb out, but kept slipping back in. He thought such was their just desert, and was happily kicking loose stones over the lip of the pit to wash them away, when he saw a third figure with them, this one reaching out a hand to help them.
"Leave them!" He called, "This is what they deserve!"
The man looked up. The monk realised he was face to face with Jesus. "I came to save them from their sin, and you keep trying to push them deeper."

He woke up ... and the next day went and made peace with his opponents.
 
Yahweh kid said:
Jesus is just telling the Truth, warning the people that there are consequences for sinning against God.
What do you think will work? .........Lying to them?
Click to expand...
No ... I think speaking of God's love would garner more fruit than holding a gun to their heads.

I have experienced homilies warning of the dangers of sin, and and I have experienced homilies speaking of the indefatigable, unrelenting love of God, and, d'you know, there's always a longer queue for the Sacrament of Reconciliation after the love homilies than the dread ones ...
 
Thomas said:
No ... I think speaking of God's love would garner more fruit than holding a gun to their heads.

I have experienced homilies warning of the dangers of sin, and and I have experienced homilies speaking of the indefatigable, unrelenting love of God, and, d'you know, there's always a longer queue for the Sacrament of Reconciliation after the love homilies than the dread ones ...
Click to expand...
I agree, God's love is out of this world... He says that He does not anyone to perish..... He love us so much that He made a way for us to be Saved from eternal damnation...... the thing is, we have to mention the damnation and what God saves you from? We have to let people know that we are sinners and why we need God. If there is no fear for God why bother stop sinning? God loves you so much He does not care about sin...? really?

Did you know God hates? Proverbs 6:16-19
 
Yahweh kid said:
Jesus is just telling the Truth, warning the people that there are consequences for sinning against God.
What do you think will work? .........Lying to them?
Click to expand...
As much as we disagree about some fundamentals, you might still be a good person for me to share ideas with, if you're willing.

I have some ideas about what Jesus means by "salvation," "eternal life," and "the kingdom," but let's say that I don't actually know anything about them. I just think that whatever He wants for us is best for us, and I think that He's offering it to everyone free, without any conditions, including belief conditions. I don't think that He's requiring people to believe anything about Him, to receive His gift. I think that the way He died, and His resurrection, are part of what makes it possible for us to receive the gift, but I don't think that people have to know anything about that, to receive it. All we need is to see God in Him, see Him inviting us, and walk in. Okay, those are conditions, and a kind of belief, in fact maybe actually harder than what you're saying, so actually I'm just disagreeing with you about what the Bible says the conditions are.
 
Yahweh kid said:
Disagree.

So not all is going to receive the Gift? Some reject the invite...no?

😁 John 3:16 says it all.
Click to expand...
I'm disagreeing with you about what John 3:16 says. I disagree with what you think "believe in" means.

I'm not disagreeing with any of the verses that you've quoted, except the translation of Isaiah 53:5, which I think is grossly mistranslated. I'm disagreeing with what you think that they're saying.
 
Last edited:
God gave His son as a ransom to free us from slavery to the sinful side of our nature, so that we can enter His kingdom, if we see God in Jesus and are moved by that to want what He wants for us and to learn together as brothers and sisters to live the way He says to live.
 
Longfellow said:
God gave His son as a ransom to free us from slavery to the sinful side of our nature, so that we can enter His kingdom, if we see God in Jesus and are moved by that to want what He wants for us and to learn together as brothers and sisters to live the way He says to live.
Click to expand...
"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only Son, that whoever believes in him should not perish but have eternal life"
This is a condition/requirement. Sorry Long.
 
Merriam-Webster online
believe in
1 : to have faith or confidence in the existence of (something) Do you believe in ghosts?
2 : to have trust in the goodness or value of (something) She believes in (the value of) regular exercise. I believe in working hard to achieve success. She doesn't believe in using pesticides.
3 : to have trust in the goodness or ability of (someone) Despite his problems, his parents still believe in him.

A person needs to trust in the goodness and ability if Jesus.
 
Last edited:
Longfellow said:
A person needs to trust in the goodness and ability if Jesus.
Click to expand...
Yes, a condition.
Your words "I don't think that He's requiring people to believe(trust) anything about Him, to receive His gift" it contradicts scripture and your own words "A person needs to trust in the goodness and ability if Jesus."
 
Yahweh kid said:
Yes, a condition.
Your words "I don't think that He's requiring people to believe(trust) anything about Him, to receive His gift" it contradicts scripture and your own words "A person needs to trust in the goodness and ability if Jesus."
Click to expand...
Are you agreeing that “whoever believe in him” in John 3:16 means “whoever trusts in his goodness and ability”?

(later) I forgot, the point is not for you to agree, it’s to explain what I’m thinking. To me, Jonn 3:16 is saying that we need to trust in the goodness and ability of Jesus.
 
Yahweh kid said:
No, believe Jesus is the Redeemer who atones for sin. He is the One who got crucified.
Click to expand...
I don’t see that in anywhere in John 3:16. All I see in John 3:16 is “whoever believes in him,” meaning “whoever trusts in his goodness and ability.”

(later) I do believe that Jesus is the Redeemer who atones for sin, and that He is the One who got crucified, but I don’t see that in John 3:16.
 
Last edited:
Yahweh kid said:
No, believe Jesus is the Redeemer who atones for sin. He is the One who got crucified.
Click to expand...
I believe that Jesus is the Redeemer who atones for sin, and that He is the One who got crucified, but I don’t see John 3:16 saying “whoever believes that Jesus is the Redeemer who atones for sin, and that He is the One who got crucified.” All I see in John 3:16 is “whoever believes in him,” meaning “whoever trusts in his goodness and ability.”
 
Longfellow said:
I don’t see that in anywhere in John 3:16. All I see in John 3:16 is “whoever believes in him,” meaning “whoever trusts in his goodness and ability.”
Click to expand...
Who is "Him", because the name Jesus is not in the verse either?
It could be The Father, the Son or the Holy Spirit, they all have goodness and ability....
Longfellow said:
"I believe that Jesus is the Redeemer who atones for sin, and that He is the One who got crucified", but I don’t see John 3:16 saying “whoever believes that Jesus is the Redeemer who atones for sin, and that He is the One who got crucified.” All I see in John 3:16 is “whoever believes in him,” meaning “whoever trusts in his goodness and ability.”
Click to expand...
Why do you believe Jesus is the Redeemer if you cannot see it in John 3:16?
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top