Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heaven?

[Lunitik]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Oh no you are gravely mistaken, I am very enlightened, way more than you have become. How do I know this? Well, I just stated it, didn't I?

Enlightenment is not in degrees, you have clearly experienced nothing based on your comments on this forum. Your religion is more of a rebellion than anything genuine, it is very clear. I simply say that attempting to split reality is not going to help, let alone trying to split the spiritual, it is utterly absurd. Enlightenment is to experience the totality, to experience the true nature of existence, it cannot be divided.

what the heck does that even mean? effort removing societal baggage to attain something is not attaining something?

It simply means that merely in removing the baggage, you are not assured of anything happening. It is by the grace of existence that you are shown reality but if you desire it the very desiring ensures it is impossible. Religion has began through an investigation into death, are you ready to die? If you are not it will not happen for you because enlightenment is exactly a type of death. That willingness to hand over your very being is what is necessary, but you are not willing to do that.

Really, I have never in my 50 yrs on earth listened to anyone not make sense so well.

This is truly shocking, I was thinking you were at most 20 years old.

 

[Etu Malku]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Enlightenment is not in degrees, you have clearly experienced nothing based on your comments on this forum. Your religion is more of a rebellion than anything genuine, it is very clear. I simply say that attempting to split reality is not going to help, let alone trying to split the spiritual, it is utterly absurd. Enlightenment is to experience the totality, to experience the true nature of existence, it cannot be divided.

But I am enlightened, more than you. And I don't have a religion . . . that's how 'clear' you are.

It simply means that merely in removing the baggage, you are not assured of anything happening. It is by the grace of existence that you are shown reality but if you desire it the very desiring ensures it is impossible. Religion has began through an investigation into death, are you ready to die? If you are not it will not happen for you because enlightenment is exactly a type of death. That willingness to hand over your very being is what is necessary, but you are not willing to do that.

Grace of existence? LOL, existence is Natural Selection, not any of the paranormal idiocy you are spewing. Hand over my Being . . . what are you talking about? These are the ravings of a Lunitik

This is truly shocking, I was thinking you were at most 20 years old.

Easily the most intelligent thing you have said, and a great attempt at humiliating me . . . didn't you say you were enlightened?

 

[Lunitik]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

But I am enlightened, more than you. And I don't have a religion . . . that's how 'clear' you are.

What, pray tell, is my religion?

Your own "title" states you are Luciferian, that is not a religion? You certainly cling to it...

Grace of existence? LOL, existence is Natural Selection, not any of the paranormal idiocy you are spewing. Hand over my Being . . . what are you talking about? These are the ravings of a Lunitik

You do not see the grace in natural selection? The playfulness of it? It has tried something and failed, it does not keep the experiment around to suffer, it simply does away with it so no other being need suffer as it has. Existence is not so serious that it needs to cling to this experiment, it can move on easily.

That is the problem with humans though, we become very serious. Even in your sarcasm there is a seriousness, you are offended that someone may have reached where you have not, that through all your studies nothing has happened at all. You know nothing has happened, and yet you are offended because I tell you something can happen and that it is a gift of grace. You are putting in much effort, but you expect too much. You will never attain to your desire until you drop the very desiring. Then, perhaps, existence will give to you, but you are not yet ready.

Easily the most intelligent thing you have said, and a great attempt at humiliating me . . . didn't you say you were enlightened?

I have attempted nothing, I have simply stated that it is shocking how immature you are considering your years. It will be a help to recognize how close death is for you, to admit the utter inevitability of it in your near future. Perhaps then you let go of your childishness and turn to something real, otherwise you will die still a child.

 

[Lunitik]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

It is your ego which says "more than you", that is your childishness, your immaturity - this need to compete. You try to bring me down to make yourself look bigger by comparison, it is humorous to watch. It is more difficult to raise yourself up, to see the truth of my words, you are more comfortable in the valley and the mountain seems steep. I say the mountain can be traversed with one leap, but it seems impossible and what is there to see at the top? I invite you to come and see but you make a scene in the valley instead...

 

[seattlegal]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Enlightenment is not in degrees, you have clearly experienced nothing based on your comments on this forum. Your religion is more of a rebellion than anything genuine, it is very clear. I simply say that attempting to split reality is not going to help, let alone trying to split the spiritual, it is utterly absurd. Enlightenment is to experience the totality, to experience the true nature of existence, it cannot be divided.

Why can't enlightenment be in degrees? If it isn't, then you make a duality out of enlightenment/ignorance.

It simply means that merely in removing the baggage, you are not assured of anything happening. It is by the grace of existence that you are shown reality but if you desire it the very desiring ensures it is impossible. Religion has began through an investigation into death, are you ready to die? If you are not it will not happen for you because enlightenment is exactly a type of death. That willingness to hand over your very being is what is necessary, but you are not willing to do that.

We die daily. What do you think aging is?

This is truly shocking, I was thinking you were at most 20 years old.

Methinks you need a paintball gun.

​

 

[Lunitik]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Why can't enlightenment be in degrees? If it isn't, then you make a duality out of enlightenment/ignorance.

It is a duality because you are interpreting with mind, and of course I am communicating through language which is the foundation of mind. Every concept must be dropped, every duality transcended because they are all simply false. Then, how to point at truth?

It has to be understood, speaking of enlightenment, samadhi, satori, nirvana, moksha, heaven, paradise - these are all devices. They are attempts to motivate the audience, to create curiosity which they will want satisfied, to take advantage of one of the primary aspects of mind: greed. You have to trick the mind into becoming trusting so that it will allow you to work on it. In humanity today, all are slaves to mind, spirituality is really the path of discovering who the true master is. It is you, it has always been you, but who are you?

This is the fundamental question, and yet it has no answer... the question is simply dropped upon reaching.

We die daily. What do you think aging is?

How many go deeply into this fact though? Most are utterly ignorant to it, it is never really acknowledged deeply that yes, one day I will die. What do you suppose has happened to Buddha though? He has clearly acknowledged deeply, but he has also inquired into it. That is ultimately the purpose of religion, you cannot be born again unless you first die. If you can die before your body ceases to function, then you reach to the deathless... this is what Buddha has encountered.

The state of deathlessness is the other shore, the river is death itself.

 

[Lunitik]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Are you ready to die? If you are not, religion is naught but a game, something to keep you busy. Perhaps you can gain something from the man that has crossed the shore, but you will gain only intellectually. Without embracing and going deeply into the phenomenon of death, you have accomplished nothing, religion is just another accumulation of knowledge - utterly pointless. Embrace death, go into it, then you can claim enlightenment - coming out the other side IS enlightenment. Death is the fundamental nature of all fear, without encountering it directly how can fear be transcended? Without knowing what you will be once you are dead, you will remain in fear of that. Enlightenment is the knowledge of what is after death, yet you cannot call it a knowledge. Even after enlightenment, mind will argue, mind will continue to assert itself. Making it a tool is the goal, removing its power over you then the ultimate happens, not before. Since mind fears death the most, it is the most direct way to confront that... until you have experienced death, you cannot say anything meaningful about life.

 

[Etu Malku]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

What, pray tell, is my religion?

I'm not clear as to your religion, I'd guess Zen Buddhism?

Your own "title" states you are Luciferian, that is not a religion? You certainly cling to it...

Luciferianism is not a religion it is an agnostic philosophy . . . and I do cling to my Beliefs.

You do not see the grace in natural selection? The playfulness of it? It has tried something and failed, it does not keep the experiment around to suffer, it simply does away with it so no other being need suffer as it has. Existence is not so serious that it needs to cling to this experiment, it can move on easily.

Yes, we agree on this.

That is the problem with humans though, we become very serious. Even in your sarcasm there is a seriousness, you are offended that someone may have reached where you have not, that through all your studies nothing has happened at all. You know nothing has happened, and yet you are offended because I tell you something can happen and that it is a gift of grace. You are putting in much effort, but you expect too much. You will never attain to your desire until you drop the very desiring. Then, perhaps, existence will give to you, but you are not yet ready.

I am offended that someone 'believes' they have attained some kind of nirvana state and feels the need to 'reach out' to those he considers 'less fortunate' . . . proselytizing bothers me, but I'm working on that.

I have attempted nothing, I have simply stated that it is shocking how immature you are considering your years. It will be a help to recognize how close death is for you, to admit the utter inevitability of it in your near future. Perhaps then you let go of your childishness and turn to something real, otherwise you will die still a child.

I am immature because I challenge your silly beliefs and condescending attitude (which by the way I am not the only one here to have acknowledged this attitude) . . . you make for a poor argument here.

And now I will die an immature child?
A statement by comedienne Cathy Ladman comes to mind . . . "All religions are the same: religion is basically guilt, with different holidays"

 

[seattlegal]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

I'm not clear as to your religion, I'd guess Zen Buddhism?

I would guess far from it!

{Too much obsession with "self" and "ego" for Zen, imo}

 

[Etu Malku]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Are you ready to die? If you are not, religion is naught but a game, something to keep you busy. Perhaps you can gain something from the man that has crossed the shore, but you will gain only intellectually. Without embracing and going deeply into the phenomenon of death, you have accomplished nothing, religion is just another accumulation of knowledge - utterly pointless.

I couldn't agree more . . . it IS utterly pointless and merely a placebo affect for consolation, comfort and generating togetherness. Ultimately, religion is a huge waste of energy and is too extravagant.

Embrace death, go into it, then you can claim enlightenment - coming out the other side IS enlightenment. Death is the fundamental nature of all fear, without encountering it directly how can fear be transcended? Without knowing what you will be once you are dead, you will remain in fear of that.

Don't you think we all already know this? Death & taxes . . . blah blah blah, it's inevitable, it comes when it comes, we can prolong its arrival but it's coming . . . now that we know this, let's move on to the Real importance of our Life . . . living.

Enlightenment is the knowledge of what is after death, yet you cannot call it a knowledge. Even after enlightenment, mind will argue, mind will continue to assert itself. Making it a tool is the goal, removing its power over you then the ultimate happens, not before. Since mind fears death the most, it is the most direct way to confront that... until you have experienced death, you cannot say anything meaningful about life.

This is utter nonsense . . . you know nothing more about death than anyone else still living, how could you?

 

[Lunitik]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

I'm not clear as to your religion, I'd guess Zen Buddhism?

I have no religion, no philosophy, nothing which you can define under a particular banner.

Luciferianism is not a religion it is an agnostic philosophy . . . and I do cling to my Beliefs.

This is why you have not experienced the ultimate.

I am offended that someone 'believes' they have attained some kind of nirvana state and feels the need to 'reach out' to those he considers 'less fortunate' . . . proselytizing bothers me, but I'm working on that.

I am not proselytizing at all, there is nothing to convert to and in most traditions I can show you how to attain to it. Once it is attained, you will drop your previous beliefs, but if you pick up new ones you are again trapped. No, I have experienced something which I want all to experience, it is more an attempt at giving than converting.

I am immature because I challenge your silly beliefs and condescending attitude (which by the way I am not the only one here to have acknowledged this attitude) . . . you make for a poor argument here.

You challenge nothing, you simply look like a child.

And now I will die an immature child?
A statement by comedienne Cathy Ladman comes to mind . . . "All religions are the same: religion is basically guilt, with different holidays"

Could not be more wrong, I will say guilt itself is a concept, it is utterly unnatural. Christianity has invented guilt because that is what it attempts to save us from... create the disease so you can cure it, it is stupid.

 

[Lunitik]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

I couldn't agree more . . . it IS utterly pointless and merely a placebo affect for consolation, comfort and generating togetherness. Ultimately, religion is a huge waste of energy and is too extravagant.

There is something to every religion, but most of it is utterly nonsense, you are correct.

Don't you think we all already know this? Death & taxes . . . blah blah blah, it's inevitable, it comes when it comes, we can prolong its arrival but it's coming . . . now that we know this, let's move on to the Real importance of our Life . . . living.

Most people know it intellectually, this isn't what I mean...

This is utter nonsense . . . you know nothing more about death than anyone else still living, how could you?

Because I have gone into it...

 

[seattlegal]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

It is a duality because you are interpreting with mind, and of course I am communicating through language which is the foundation of mind. Every concept must be dropped, every duality transcended because they are all simply false. Then, how to point at truth?

It has to be understood, speaking of enlightenment, samadhi, satori, nirvana, moksha, heaven, paradise - these are all devices. They are attempts to motivate the audience, to create curiosity which they will want satisfied, to take advantage of one of the primary aspects of mind: greed. You have to trick the mind into becoming trusting so that it will allow you to work on it.

Remind me not to let you into my mind.

In humanity today, all are slaves to mind,

You really do like to paint with a broad brush, don't you?

spirituality is really the path of discovering who the true master is. It is you, it has always been you, but who are you?

It's all about you. Looks like you are also looking to exploit pride.

This is the fundamental question, and yet it has no answer... the question is simply dropped upon reaching.

Ahh--confusion leading to delusion--and resting there!

How many go deeply into this fact though? Most are utterly ignorant to it,

There you go with the broad brush again.

it is never really acknowledged deeply that yes, one day I will die. What do you suppose has happened to Buddha though? He has clearly acknowledged deeply, but he has also inquired into it. That is ultimately the purpose of religion, you cannot be born again unless you first die. If you can die before your body ceases to function, then you reach to the deathless... this is what Buddha has encountered.

Sounds rather like the undead to me!

The state of deathlessness is the other shore, the river is death itself.

Sounds like another one of your mind deception tricks, just with a fresh coat of paint.

 

[Lunitik]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Remind me not to let you into my mind.

lol... but you let Buddha into it, and Jesus...

You really do like to paint with a broad brush, don't you?

It is simply fact, you yourself prove it every time you point to a Buddhist text, that is the mind asserting, you cannot simply accept what I say.

It's all about you. Looks like you are also looking to exploit pride.

Pride is exactly what has to be moved out of the way to see your true self...

Ahh--confusion leading to delusion--and resting there!

Confusion is of mind, transcending mind confusion is not possible. Your understanding is so very limited currently despite your Buddhist studies, so such statements are fine just know that I point at something else.

There you go with the broad brush again.

Ramana Maharshi attained enlightenment upon the death of his relative. At a young age, he simply laid on the floor and willed himself to die. Just acknowledging death as inevitable is not enough, you have to surrender to it and let it happen.

Sounds rather like the undead to me!

And yet it is exquisite and beautiful, comparatively people are merely surviving, once you have gone deeply into death now life has a new dimension. That dimension is referred to by the many names I have listed in my last post to you.

Sounds like another one of your mind deception tricks, just with a fresh coat of paint.

No, your mind has deceived yourself, it fears death and so it has created a way to avoid my statement, to write off my words.

Every enlightened person has inquired into death, and it is a paradox because in that inquiry they have found a far more rich life. You will look at their words and try to learn from them, but will you go into what they have experienced? The fundamental reason for finding a master is because most will not want to, the master provides proof that you can come out of it, a type of support and trust grows which can allow you to go into it.

 

[Etu Malku]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Because I have gone into it...

I have diapers for you and a soft couch to lie upon

 

[seattlegal]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

In humanity today, all are slaves to mind,

You really do like to paint with a broad brush, don't you?

It is simply fact, you yourself prove it every time you point to a Buddhist text, that is the mind asserting, you cannot simply accept what I say.

Present your evidence that all are slaves to mind, or this unsupported proclamation will be tossed into the "delusional proclamations" basket with all the rest.

Pride is exactly what has to be moved out of the way to see your true self...

and I would say that pride needs to be transformed into the wisdom of equality in order to optimized mind.

Confusion is of mind, transcending mind confusion is not possible.

Another proclamation, although it appears there might be plenty of evidence to support the contrary.

Your understanding is so very limited currently despite your Buddhist studies, so such statements are fine just know that I point at something else.

LOL! What do you know of my understanding?

Ramana Maharshi attained enlightenment upon the death of his relative. At a young age, he simply laid on the floor and willed himself to die. Just acknowledging death as inevitable is not enough, you have to surrender to it and let it happen.

I certainly didn't surrender to it last time I faced it! But then again, I didn't will myself to die in that situation, either.

And yet it is exquisite and beautiful, comparatively people are merely surviving, once you have gone deeply into death now life has a new dimension. That dimension is referred to by the many names I have listed in my last post to you.

And yet it does not require all this drama to experience thusness or suchness.

Sounds like another one of your mind deception tricks, just with a fresh coat of paint.

No, your mind has deceived yourself, it fears death and so it has created a way to avoid my statement, to write off my words.

LOL, No, I think you are wrong.

Every enlightened person has inquired into death, and it is a paradox because in that inquiry they have found a far more rich life. You will look at their words and try to learn from them, but will you go into what they have experienced? The fundamental reason for finding a master is because most will not want to, the master provides proof that you can come out of it, a type of support and trust grows which can allow you to go into it.

Hey, it is good that you are seeking outside help.

 

[Lunitik]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

I have diapers for you and a soft couch to lie upon

What is the point of this? Do you think you are being funny?

Petty and immature is all it is.

 

[Etu Malku]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

What is the point of this? Do you think you are being funny?

Petty and immature is all it is.

Look, you are entitled to your beliefs here, and to explain them the best you can. You are NOT entitled to ad hominem attacks like calling me a child and immature, call my beliefs that, which is fine.

There is absolutely no reason or evidence that you have supplied to anyone here that your Way is The Way. Matter of fact I and others find your beliefs to be unfounded and based on your own perceptions (which is fine), but to project an air of superiority through enlightenment is just wrong.

I don't buy anything you are selling here, I find it mumbo jumbo and circular in every respect. I like your paradigm, it works for you, not me, get over it.

Everything you say is just as good as me proselytizing that I know the 'secret' and no one else does, it is Luciferianism, what you believe is completely incorrect, I will show you your errors, someday when you are a grown up spirit you will understand what I am saying, because I have been there and you have not.

LMFAO!!

 

[Lunitik]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Present your evidence that all are slaves to mind, or this unsupported proclamation will be tossed into the "delusional proclamations" basket with all the rest.

This very statement is my proof, but do you see why I say it?

and I would say that pride needs to be transformed into the wisdom of equality in order to optimized mind.

Pride is non-existent, it is a fabrication, a mere concept based on a certain attachment and identification. How can something which doesn't exist be transformed? What an absurd statement...

Another proclamation, although it appears there might be plenty of evidence to support the contrary.

Feel free to present any such evidence, you will likely show me psychiatric patients and prove you have utterly missed again.

LOL! What do you know of my understanding?

You have no understanding, you have only knowledge and that is a burden not an assistance.

I certainly didn't surrender to it last time I faced it! But then again, I didn't will myself to die in that situation, either.

You are not enlightened, so what point is there in this statement?

And yet it does not require all this drama to experience thusness or suchness.

You have experienced neither, so how do know what is necessary? You are still confined in mind, you show it in almost every post directed at me.

LOL, No, I think you are wrong.

That is fine, I am not wrong but it is ok.

Hey, it is good that you are seeking outside help.

You make another assumption...

 

[Lunitik]

Re: Was JESUS the only heavenly being to incarnate into the human community from heav

Look, you are entitled to your beliefs here, and to explain them the best you can. You are NOT entitled to ad hominem attacks like calling me a child and immature, call my beliefs that, which is fine.

There is absolutely no reason or evidence that you have supplied to anyone here that your Way is The Way. Matter of fact I and others find your beliefs to be unfounded and based on your own perceptions (which is fine), but to project an air of superiority through enlightenment is just wrong.

I don't buy anything you are selling here, I find it mumbo jumbo and circular in every respect. I like your paradigm, it works for you, not me, get over it.

Stop acting like a petty child and I will not have to point out your petty childishness... it is quite simple.