I Am That I Am

[Ben Masada]

I Am That I Am

When Moses was chased out of Egypt, he fled to Midian where he married the firstborn daughter of Jethro and became his main sherperd. (Exo. 2:15,21; 3:1)

One day, as Moses led the flocks to the backside of the desert, he came to the "Mountain of Adonai," reclined for a rest and slumbered. In his slumbering, he had a vision of a burning bush which just would not burn itself up.

In Moses' vision of the burning bush, Adonai would talk to him and, after identifying Himself as the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob, He spoke to Moses about His concerns for Israel's plight in Egypt, and comissioned Moses with the job to deliver Israel from slavery. (Exo.
3:4-7)

Startled by being Divinely chosen for such a task, Moses was wondering what answer he would give to questions about God's name as a token of creditation to his mission. Adonai answered and said, "I Am That Am." Just tell them that "I Am" has sent you. (Exo. 3:13,14)

"God Is," that's the bottom line. God is never to be said that He has, but that He is, what one has can be taken away; what one is, he is, no matter what. We have what we think we are, but God is what we think He has.

"To be or not to be; that's the question." The answer is in the difference between God and man. What we have, it has been granted to us to be developed and to grow into what God is. And this is a task of a lifetime. (Gen. 1:28)

To man, only parts of what Adonai is has been granted. Attributes, that is. Hence, the creation of man in the image of God's attributes, so that with man, Adonai would share His power of control over the universe. (Gen. 1:26)

With the acquisition of knowledge, we have become almost one with God, were not for the attribute of eternal life, which was denied us. (Gen. 3:22) Although like gods we are to be, like men we are supposed to die. (Psalm 82:6,7)

In conclusion, as Jesus dared to define God, he said that God is Spirit. (John 4:24) To man, the spirit was granted with the breath of life breathed in his nostrils, as to make of him a living soul "till death do us part," when the breath of life goes back to Adonai and the body returns to the dust. (Eccl. 12:7) Then, the soul which man had become be no more. (Gen. 2:8)

Ben

 

[Lunitik]

First, Spirit means breath.

We die as men to realize we are God, we must first realize we are not the body.

Certainly, we are only part when in the body, this is the distinction Buddha makes between nirvana and paranirvana. I think the point is valid though, because there is no more relativity now, no more personal being in paranirvana.

Who is the one that says "I am" within you though?

Can you find even the one who observes this statement?

This is what is intended by "I am that I am", this is the whole mystery, to find out who it is that claims it. What is the nature of that awareness within you?

When you discover this, can it be taken away?

Again and again I ask: Who are you?

 

[donnann]

First, Spirit means breath.

We die as men to realize we are God, we must first realize we are not the body.

Certainly, we are only part when in the body, this is the distinction Buddha makes between nirvana and paranirvana. I think the point is valid though, because there is no more relativity now, no more personal being in paranirvana.

Who is the one that says "I am" within you though?

Can you find even the one who observes this statement?

This is what is intended by "I am that I am", this is the whole mystery, to find out who it is that claims it. What is the nature of that awareness within you?

When you discover this, can it be taken away?

Again and again I ask: Who are you?

The body is included. I thought you believed in JESUS. Saying the body isnt included makes it like his resurrection has no meaning.

 

[Lunitik]

The body is included. I thought you believed in JESUS. Saying the body isnt included makes it like his resurrection has no meaning.

What meaning does it have if you take it as physical?

No, it only has meaning in the spiritual sense, for the crucifixion is of ego, and the resurrection is in God.

You still identify with the body, but it is simply an arising in the energy of God, all physical things are simply dense energy. You are that energy, but you are not this instance of it. You are the totality of it, your being is not limited in any way, it is infinite.

You must find out what you are not though to see what you are. Jesus himself has said you must hate your own life, yet you say he upholds identification with the body?

I am not Christian because I love Jesus, what has happened to his expressions of love is sickening to me. For instance, the whole metaphor of the sheep, it has become something about following absolutely but this isn't the intent at all. The intent is that you should trust, that the Shepard will not permit you to go astray so you should drop all your worries and trust in him. Just go on eating your grass, you will not come to any harm.

In this, there is a let go, but in following you are still there, you still have something to do. Jesus has said the only law is love, yet you go on trying to fix this and that. Religion is a love affair with the whole, yet you continue to seek a single man.

 

[donnann]

What meaning does it have if you take it as physical?

No, it only has meaning in the spiritual sense, for the crucifixion is of ego, and the resurrection is in God.

You still identify with the body, but it is simply an arising in the energy of God, all physical things are simply dense energy. You are that energy, but you are not this instance of it. You are the totality of it, your being is not limited in any way, it is infinite.

You must find out what you are not though to see what you are. Jesus himself has said you must hate your own life, yet you say he upholds identification with the body?

I am not Christian because I love Jesus, what has happened to his expressions of love is sickening to me. For instance, the whole metaphor of the sheep, it has become something about following absolutely but this isn't the intent at all. The intent is that you should trust, that the Shepard will not permit you to go astray so you should drop all your worries and trust in him. Just go on eating your grass, you will not come to any harm.

In this, there is a let go, but in following you are still there, you still have something to do. Jesus has said the only law is love, yet you go on trying to fix this and that. Religion is a love affair with the whole, yet you continue to seek a single man.

The physical becomes a spirit substance like a crystal.

 

[Lunitik]

Jesus does not seek any person to fulfill him.

He is utterly devoted to the whole, call it God or Father if you wish.

He has tried to show the world the nature of this love he has for the whole, he has tried to share his bliss. He has said nothing he does is of his own accord, but it is the father in him. He says he has no authority at all, goes on saying he is simply the vehicle for a message.

Stop looking at the flesh, it is not the point. All bodies are yours, all trees, all rivers, all mountains, yet you limit your awareness of this to a single body. Find out what you really are!

 

[Lunitik]

The physical becomes a spirit substance like a crystal.

I have explained this to you already...

The body is as ice, the soul as water, and the spirit as gas.

This depicts the relative subtleness, and implores you to become more and more sensitive. Yet that spirit is all around, it is breathed in and out every second, constantly you are dying and being born for only being filled with the spirit is life.

In the gaseous form, we call the spirit oxygen - quite dry I think you'll agree.

Soul is the mind, yet it is only an aspect of spirit, it amounts to your identifications with the limited state. You must merge soul back into spirit, this is the drop falling into the ocean which is often referenced by spiritual people...

Body is the most dense, yet if enough energy can be accumulated, then just as ice on the stove it melts into gas as well.

They are the same in essence, again oneness is absolute.

Body and mind will eventually disintegrate though, their energy cannot be lost, all things return to the whole eventually. Even Science tells us energy cannot be created or taken away, it can only change form, you are naught but the play of energy experiencing itself.

Know this.

 

[donnann]

Jesus does not seek any person to fulfill him.

He is utterly devoted to the whole, call it God or Father if you wish.

He has tried to show the world the nature of this love he has for the whole, he has tried to share his bliss. He has said nothing he does is of his own accord, but it is the father in him. He says he has no authority at all, goes on saying he is simply the vehicle for a message.

Stop looking at the flesh, it is not the point. All bodies are yours, all trees, all rivers, all mountains, yet you limit your awareness of this to a single body. Find out what you really are!

If you think that you dont know JESUS sorry to say. All males look for their opposites and he knows full well he has one. The ancient mystery is that each of us has one and we are only a complete being with one. Fallen angels tried to raise themselves up above the Creator(s) which is the two one male and one female and fell because of that. JESUS isnt a fallen one. He would never do that.

 

[Lunitik]

If you think that you dont know JESUS sorry to say. All males look for their opposites and he knows full well he has one. The ancient mystery is that each of us has one and we are only a complete being with one. Fallen angels tried to raise themselves up above the Creator(s) which is the two one male and one female and fell because of that. JESUS isnt a fallen one. He would never do that.

Has Jesus married? Has he had any children?

No, he was an Essene, a Jewish mystic, and part of their belief is that flesh should not be given in to. They also believe that all material luxuries should be avoided, this is why he says you should not value money.

I am not speaking of Christianity, I have no interest in what priests have to say. I speak from a place of knowledge, having experienced what Christ is pointing to. You debate out of ignorance, it is fine, I can only pray it will eventually click for you.

 

[Lunitik]

For 300 years, Christianity has been basically ascetic, all about overcoming the body. I do not approve of this, why punish it? It has done nothing wrong, but it is still not you, in this the Gnostics were perfectly correct.

Now a few priests have come in, and of course a priest wants to uphold his ego, his livelihood depends on certain things. If Gnosticism had grown, how could they make any money from it? Yet Gnosticism is more true of Jesus, you have brought up such a scripture earlier yet you have not seen this point - I have the complete collection of Nag Hamadi texts!

The body is not the point, it is the vehicle which that energy uses to experience, that is all. Do not cling to the body, for one day it will drop, and you can dig up any grave to see no Christians flesh has been sustained in the ground! Will you even want to go back into a body which is just a skeleton now? Even Jesus' body has not been repaired in his resurrection, he shows the apostles the scars remain!

This is an age old desire of man though, it is the same reason he has created Mummies, they have done a little better preserving it, but still not a very desirable prison I think you'll agree.

 

[donnann]

For 300 years, Christianity has been basically ascetic, all about overcoming the body. I do not approve of this, why punish it? It has done nothing wrong, but it is still not you, in this the Gnostics were perfectly correct.

Now a few priests have come in, and of course a priest wants to uphold his ego, his livelihood depends on certain things. If Gnosticism had grown, how could they make any money from it? Yet Gnosticism is more true of Jesus, you have brought up such a scripture earlier yet you have not seen this point - I have the complete collection of Nag Hamadi texts!

The body is not the point, it is the vehicle which that energy uses to experience, that is all. Do not cling to the body, for one day it will drop, and you can dig up any grave to see no Christians flesh has been sustained in the ground! Will you even want to go back into a body which is just a skeleton now? Even Jesus' body has not been repaired in his resurrection, he shows the apostles the scars remain!

This is an age old desire of man though, it is the same reason he has created Mummies, they have done a little better preserving it, but still not a very desirable prison I think you'll agree.

What would the purpose of baptism of the body by the holy spirit be if it were not included. Its like the skin. Your skin protects your internal organs and what would your body be like skinless. Not function properly would it aside from looking weird. The body is included you cannot transcend it but merge it with spirit and soul.

 

[Lunitik]

What would the purpose of baptism of the body by the holy spirit be if it were not included. Its like the skin. Your skin protects your internal organs and what would your body be like skinless. Not function properly would it aside from looking weird. The body is included you cannot transcend it but merge it with spirit and soul.

Baptism of the Holy Spirit is not of the body, it is the merging of your soul back into God.

Jesus explicitly says he does not baptize by water.

What he does instruct is initiatic practice, this has been lost today in Christianity. He is baptized in the way of John as a way to honor him, the dove which descended signifies the Holy Spirit, but it did not happen while he was in the water, it happened as he walked away.

How could the water have brought him the Holy Spirit when he is born of it?

 

[Ben Masada]

First, Spirit means breath.

We die as men to realize we are God, we must first realize we are not the body.

Certainly, we are only part when in the body, this is the distinction Buddha makes between nirvana and paranirvana. I think the point is valid though, because there is no more relativity now, no more personal being in paranirvana.

Who is the one that says "I am" within you though?

Can you find even the one who observes this statement?

This is what is intended by "I am that I am", this is the whole mystery, to find out who it is that claims it. What is the nature of that awareness within you?

When you discover this, can it be taken away?

Again and again I ask: Who are you?

Now, Lunitik, perhaps you are right but according to Buddhism. According to Judaism, "I Am that I Am" is a prehogative that we attribute to God only as a result of our understanding of Theology. Man cannot claim to be what he is. Perhaps to have what he has. Because what one has is coditional and temporary. It can, by any reason, be taken away. But what One is, He is, no matter what.
Ben

 

[Lunitik]

Now, Lunitik, perhaps you are right but according to Buddhism. According to Judaism, "I Am that I Am" is a prehogative that we attribute to God only as a result of our understanding of Theology. Man cannot claim to be what he is. Perhaps to have what he has. Because what one has is coditional and temporary. It can, by any reason, be taken away. But what One is, He is, no matter what.
Ben

I have studied your Kaballah stream, and they seem to disagree with you. While the Hasidic stream differs in many ways, it too shares the same mystic conclusion: know ye not that ye are gods?

We are an expression of God, but identified with that expression. Waking up - which is the meaning of Buddha - means to realize you are the one expressing you. Still, during life, this is relative, but certainly in the Catholic train of thought, at least after death you will merge with God.

This means the part ceases to remain separate from the whole, and this is what all religion must aim for - anything less restricts it to make believe.

 

[Lunitik]

We may disagree, but then what is the point of Judaism? To continue serving God for all eternity? To what end? I don't see the point of it at all, and such trials to be an eternal slave!

For me, the Abrahamic notion of heaven is utterly idiotic, the only goal can be to realize you are God, you are the eternal and infinite. Anything less and I would rather death, for any distance does not suffice now that I have realized there is no separation.

Of course, the Buddhists do not call it God, they say it is Dharmakaya. It means simply the truth body, as apposed to the one you currently identify with.

The only valid religion is Truth, ideals merely console.

Yet I am not Buddhist either, for I cannot condone their repressions, their escapism, nor their strange morals relating to Karma - for instance, they will leave a man to die in a well, for they consider that if they help him and he later kills, this falls on them!

Love does not care about the consequences, nor the what ifs, for both are concerned with the future...

Love simply is, it only longs to be shared.

Truth does not even long for this, it is only love which tries to share truth. It is why truth does not suffer, it is content simply being. It is thankful that it is, and from this its joy and bliss.

Truth is the only place of peace.

That is Jerusalem, and it is found within.

All who meditate eventually find the same essence within themselves, the very source of life.

All who restrict themselves to learning find nothing.

 

[NiceCupOfTea]

"I Am That I Am"

to be me is like consciousness before the mind start labeling, it simply is.

 

[Lunitik]

This is the fruit of the Tree of Life, but you are born with only its seed.

You must water it and let it grow within you, love is its fertilizer.

Let it reach for the stars, do not remain in the desert of the mind, nothing can grow there.

This is religion if you can see.

 

[Lunitik]

Do not be content with mere knowledge, for what is its true worth?

Parkinson's and the like show the minds fragility.

Find that which is as a diamond within!

 

[Lunitik]

You must not treat it as a Bonsai tree either...

Do not clip its roots, for it can only climb as high as its roots are deep - they are its support.

Simply continue climbing!

As the Lotus flower, you need not touch the water, let alone the mud of the roots.

Sins need not be avoided, pursuing love does not even allow them to arise in the first place!

Yet you must come to realize what is pursued now is you.

Your own true potential.

"Know ye not that ye are divine?"

Realize it.

No amount of belief makes it so.

You only need to see it is already the case, and only experience makes this certain.

Arriving at this certainty is religion.

 

[Lunitik]

Allow your seed to flower.