An unconventional NDE!

Q

Quirkybird

Guest
When people talk of near death experiences they often mention seeing a light at the end of a tunnel or some such. This is explained by the brain shutting down or some such.

My husband, then 59, had a brain haemorrhage in 2006 which trashed half his brain. He was in a coma and on the brink of death for several weeks. During that time he says he had a weird experience. This convinced him, if he needed any convincing being an atheist, that there definitely was no deity or afterlife. Being a sceptic I don't think his experience had anymore credibility than those claiming their NDE convinced them there was life after death.
 
While in a coma, he had a weird experience - and this convinced him there is no afterlife. Could you elaborate some more on that? If it is not too personal. I am curious what sort of experience would cause him to believe even more that this is all there is.
 
Gordian Knot said:
While in a coma, he had a weird experience - and this convinced him there is no afterlife. Could you elaborate some more on that? If it is not too personal. I am curious what sort of experience would cause him to believe even more that this is all there is.
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I have no idea, he couldn't explain it, but whatever it was it more than convinced him this life is all there is, which pleases him greatly.
 
Quirkybird said:
When people talk of near death experiences they often mention seeing a light at the end of a tunnel or some such. This is explained by the brain shutting down or some such.
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It's not so much explained, as suggested. :)

NDE's tend to include a common set of imagery from a wider range - I haven't got a resource to list them here, but I remember finding D Scott Rogo's book on the subject very good - not so much trying to explain NDE's as much as cataloguing similarities.

One thing NDE's tend to have in common is that they tend to be culturally determined - ie, regardless of the basic features (light, tunnel, flying, etc) the final expression tends to be coloured by the culture of the person having the experience.

For example, a Christian might meet Jesus and rise into Heaven - but people who believe we return to live in this same world, but as spirits, saw that instead.

I suspect adamant Atheists meet Richard Dawkins. ;)

It's also worth noting, of course, that if half your brain shuts down after a brain haemorrhage, the person is likely to feel more immediate and confusing experiences than perhaps a NDE.
 
As my husband was an atheist before this happened, whatever it was just confirmed his atheism. The more usual NDE experience would confirm a believer's faith. Either way I am sure there is nothing supernatural about NDEs.
 
Quirkybird said:
As my husband was an atheist before this happened, whatever it was just confirmed his atheism. The more usual NDE experience would confirm a believer's faith. Either way I am sure there is nothing supernatural about NDEs.
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Hello Quirkybird

There are many studies such as this one (The Phase (OOBE/LD)OOBE Research Center | OOBE Research Center) regarding Obes and NDES which to me they seem similar or are the same. This research describes the intent of obe practitioners and gives them an area of focus, many of these participants end up seeing what they were told to look for, your husband on the other hand had no chance to build a predetermined after death vision due to his beliefs. I have had thousands of obes where my soul has spent time behind the veil, I have never encountered a light, wasn't and I am still not looking for it. I am an, and have always been an atheist but I also believe without a doubt something exists beyond this reality, just not a god. The experience your husband had must not have been one of a out of body type experience, because even this would have prompted him to believe in some type of after life. I have had really freaky experiences beyond the veil one's that would suggest a malevolent force but this is only a piece of the truth behind this great unseen reality. You say his experience left him with the feeling this was all there is, then I would say he did not have nor did he experience anything perhaps, this is the experience he mentions. Not all near death experiences are riddled with sensations of benevolence many have no experiences at all, just vision's of black nothingness.
 
powessy said:
Hello Quirkybird

There are many studies such as this one (The Phase (OOBE/LD)OOBE Research Center | OOBE Research Center) regarding Obes and NDES which to me they seem similar or are the same. This research describes the intent of obe practitioners and gives them an area of focus, many of these participants end up seeing what they were told to look for, your husband on the other hand had no chance to build a predetermined after death vision due to his beliefs. I have had thousands of obes where my soul has spent time behind the veil, I have never encountered a light, wasn't and I am still not looking for it. I am an, and have always been an atheist but I also believe without a doubt something exists beyond this reality, just not a god. The experience your husband had must not have been one of a out of body type experience, because even this would have prompted him to believe in some type of after life. I have had really freaky experiences beyond the veil one's that would suggest a malevolent force but this is only a piece of the truth behind this great unseen reality. You say his experience left him with the feeling this was all there is, then I would say he did not have nor did he experience anything perhaps, this is the experience he mentions. Not all near death experiences are riddled with sensations of benevolence many have no experiences at all, just vision's of black nothingness.
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My husband is a scientist and even if he had the classic NDE experience he would have looked for a natural explanation for it. He doesn't now remember the experience he had whilst in a coma, even though it was very real to him at the time. If he did remember it he would no doubt think as I do about its nature.

We have had the weirdest of experiences in our previous property, which was considered to be 'haunted' by others, but only after we moved in. The activity was incredible, and on a daily basis and continued for 11 years. We both believe there is a natural explanation for everything even if science has yet to catch up.
 
Is it possible that going to another plane of existence IS a natural explanation?

I have issues with the word supernatural.

Starting a fire with a match or lighter would have been supernatural not to very long ago... "He summons fire with his fingers! Stone him!"
 
wil said:
Is it possible that going to another plane of existence IS a natural explanation?

I have issues with the word supernatural.

Starting a fire with a match or lighter would have been supernatural not to very long ago... "He summons fire with his fingers! Stone him!"
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I could buy the idea of different dimensions, I think.

Our experiences at our old farmhouse (1610), in which we lived between 1997-2012 were crazy, but not frightening. At first we considered we were experiencing a hoax as the property had not been known to have had any such activity until we moved there. If you can think of it in connection with a so called 'haunting' we probably had it! Apparitions, footsteps on the stairs and landing, strange noises, on the walls brown stains, which came and went, in the form of Welsh religious words/crosses, images of monks and girl's faces. The moving of heavy objects around the house, including a 4ft high wooden owl weighing about 14 stone, and a grave stone. We also had images on photos which weren't there when the photos were taken and much, much more! The media took a great interest in the property and we never lacked after dinner conversation! It all stopped abruptly in January 2008. Make of that what you will.
 
Quirkybird said:
I could buy the idea of different dimensions, I think.

Our experiences at our old farmhouse (1610), in which we lived between 1997-2012 were crazy, but not frightening. At first we considered we were experiencing a hoax as the property had not been known to have had any such activity until we moved there. If you can think of it in connection with a so called 'haunting' we probably had it! Apparitions, footsteps on the stairs and landing, strange noises, on the walls brown stains, which came and went, in the form of Welsh religious words/crosses, images of monks and girl's faces. The moving of heavy objects around the house, including a 4ft high wooden owl weighing about 14 stone, and a grave stone. We also had images on photos which weren't there when the photos were taken and much, much more! The media took a great interest in the property and we never lacked after dinner conversation! It all stopped abruptly in January 2008. Make of that what you will.
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Wouldn't that tend to prove the existence of some sort of afterlife?
 
Namaste Jesus said:
Ok, fair enough. One thing I've found over the years is, for true believers, there is no explanation needed. To non-believers, no explanation will do.
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I think doubt is much healthier than total acceptance.
 
That is quite a leap there, Nj! There could be many terrestrial alternate causes of this phenomenon. We know for a fact, for example, that Tibetan monks can raise their body temperature so that they can be comfortable in freezing conditions. Amongst a whole bunch of such ideas through meditation.

We know that ordinary people can, in extremis, accomplish feats of strength or endurance that would normally be completely beyond their 'normal' capabilities.

Such examples abound. All are caused by humans tapping into a part of themselves they normally do not have access to. Could this source be divine? Yea, it could.

It could also be a completely normal function of the human brain, body. Or, to my thinking, the energy force all living things generate, which I believe can be manipulated on purpose (as in the monks) or unconsciously (as in the average people accomplishing extraordinary feats in an emergency).

This entire realm of existence we call the universe is made up of matter and energy; which themselves are but two forms of the same thing. Energy can be turned into matter and vice versa. And there is proof that at least some humans can manipulate this force.
 
Gordian Knot said:
That is quite a leap there, Nj! There could be many terrestrial alternate causes of this phenomenon. We know for a fact, for example, that Tibetan monks can raise their body temperature so that they can be comfortable in freezing conditions. Amongst a whole bunch of such ideas through meditation.

We know that ordinary people can, in extremis, accomplish feats of strength or endurance that would normally be completely beyond their 'normal' capabilities.

Such examples abound. All are caused by humans tapping into a part of themselves they normally do not have access to. Could this source be divine? Yea, it could.

It could also be a completely normal function of the human brain, body. Or, to my thinking, the energy force all living things generate, which I believe can be manipulated on purpose (as in the monks) or unconsciously (as in the average people accomplishing extraordinary feats in an emergency).

This entire realm of existence we call the universe is made up of matter and energy; which themselves are but two forms of the same thing. Energy can be turned into matter and vice versa. And there is proof that at least some humans can manipulate this force.
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You are right. On some scale or the other nearly anything is possible, devine or otherwise. It is also true that there are those who would see all this as devine and require no explanation and there are those that will not accept any explanation divine or otherwise. Not a leap at all. Just my personal experience.
 
I would be a fool to think that it isn't just possible for there to be something outside of ourselves, like the divine, but I sincerely hope not.
 
Quirkybird said:
I would be a fool to think that it isn't just possible for there to be something outside of ourselves, like the divine, but I sincerely hope not.
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I'm curious ...
In your other post, you also hope for there not to be an afterlife ...
What is your concern if they are true?
 
Zinga said:
I'm curious ...
In your other post, you also hope for there not to be an afterlife ...
What is your concern if they are true?
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Having been unfortunate enough to have a Pentecostal church (Elim) upbringing where heaven and hell were described very graphically indeed, it put me off the whole idea of an afterlife as neither scenario filled me with any delight, certainly not heaven!
 
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