What is heaven like

[Seekeraftertruth]

Assalam-o-Alaikum Seekeraftertruth,
Assalam-o-Alaikum Faithfulservant,
A correction: to my understanding, WAHABI constitute a sect, not a school of thought. A friend of mine who knows more than me regarding these issues said the same. I think there was a thread about sunni and shia sects;these are like Protestants and Catholics in Christianity. This is different from the four 'schools of thought', which are related to Islamic Jurisprudence and issuing Fatwa. Again, I suggest a seperate thread for this.

Wa Alaikum Salam, brother Thipps.
I trust you have had a blessed 'Eid ul-Adha. Actually, I've been checking the Suras and Hadiths quoted in your posts; I was unaware that you were near the Sacred Mosque. You are very fortunate.

I am not Wahabi, but I am Muslim, and as such I am very mindful of the beliefs of all others, whether I agree with them or not. According to mainstream Islam, Wahabi's school of thought is considered a sect. It was not accepted as mainstream. I included it for the sake of any Wahabis who believe it should be. And yes, I have been quite blessed to have received extensive education in all schools of thought, as well as all sects and branches of Islam. As I am certain you know, Salih Bukhari's Hadith is not the only Hadith accepted by some schools of thought, and your use of Yusuf Ali's English translation of the Holy Qur'an, as opposed to say, Muhammad Marmaduke Pickthall's, interested me. Rather than make assumptions I thought I'd ask.

 

[Seekeraftertruth]

Now Im curious as to what each "school of thought" teaches. Is it like different Christian denominations? How do they differ in their beliefs? maybe I should start a new thread with this.

Hello Faithful ,
So nice to meet you. I think starting a new thread on Islamic Jurisprudence would be excellent. I agree that it should not be elaborated on here. I'm really enjoying reading this thread. I was rather disappointed that none of my Muslim brothers and sisters mentioned that many descriptions of Heaven are very similar to those described in the Old Testament. I was also hoping someone might mention that the Holy Qur'an also speaks about heavens, multiple paradises, rather than one place where everyone goes after Judgement. I'm certain they'll get around to that.

I do want to say that Wahabism is to Sunni Islam roughly as The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints is to Christianity. I would not call the Church of Mormon, not Christian. It is not my place to judge the path of others. But the religious references used are, I believe, diverse. But that is for your new thread.

Kind Regards

 

[Faithfulservant]

Hello Seeker

Im very glad to see more Muslims joining since I think that there is much to learn and different views and experiences help to enrich our conversations! Im not surprised to learn how similiar our ideas of heaven are because our two faiths have generally the same origin. Yes the bible teaches that heaven is multi-level and Im excited to find out for myself personally. We as humans tend to limit things to our own perceptions or abilities to understand so I can only imagine how glorious it will be.

My purpose for asking questions on this board is to see how similiar our beliefs are and my question about heaven was one that is important to me. I still do not quite understand the concept of sexuality in heaven. For me, sex was a result of our fallen nature. I will not deny that its a pleasurable thing but I believe that pleasure was put in so that man would indeed populate the earth. Sex has been the cause for so much sin that other than conceiving children I dont see how it could possibly be something that edifies God or ourselves. Great cities have been destroyed over the result of it.

Im not asking for justification of this belief because its what you believe. I guess Im asking for clarification. Is it a reward? For a man to receive an amount of virginal brides how does that edify God? Do the men and wives procreate in heaven? Are there babies?

Thank you for your time

 

[thipps]

Wa Alaikum Salam, brother Thipps.
I trust you have had a blessed 'Eid ul-Adha. Actually, I've been checking the Suras and Hadiths quoted in your posts; I was unaware that you were near the Sacred Mosque. You are very fortunate.

I am not Wahabi, but I am Muslim, and as such I am very mindful of the beliefs of all others, whether I agree with them or not. According to mainstream Islam, Wahabi's school of thought is considered a sect. It was not accepted as mainstream. I included it for the sake of any Wahabis who believe it should be. And yes, I have been quite blessed to have received extensive education in all schools of thought, as well as all sects and branches of Islam. As I am certain you know, Salih Bukhari's Hadith is not the only Hadith accepted by some schools of thought, and your use of Yusuf Ali's English translation of the Holy Qur'an, as opposed to say, Muhammad Marmaduke Pickthall's, interested me. Rather than make assumptions I thought I'd ask.

Walaikum salam,
The Sacred Mosque is on the western side, im on the opposite side.
I used both Sahih Muslim and Bukhari and other material. Please go through the posts. I dont see why my choice of translation interests you. I have to choose one translator.. cant paste translations by all translators obviously. And Pickthall uses old english style that makes readability go down. So, i chose Yusuf Ali.
And its good to have someone here who is learned. You could contribute a whole lot. May God guide you.
Eid Mubarak to you too.

 

[Seekeraftertruth]

Assalam u Alaikum Brother Thipps,
Amazing. You stand on the Peninsula where the most holy place in our faith is located and you are correcting me about direction? From where you stand you are but a small physical distance from Mecca, and the Masjid al Haram. I may never see the Holy Cities of Mecca and Medina again. Many deserving Muslims will end their lives and never experience the humbling power of 3 million people praying to God in unison. Brian, who was hoping to at least retrace the holy Prophet’s (PBUH) steps to Medina can never see it. That is what I mean by fortunate.

I really don't believe it is correct for us to discuss the appropriateness of translations and a reference on this thread.This thread is after all, opened for the purpose of discourse on Paradise. I was interested in your opinion since you are using these translations; I have received feedback from native English Speakers who've tried to decipher diverse English translations, and found Pickthall's more straightforward. Sadly, I fear I've placed you on the defensive. That was not my intent. I read your posts along with everyone else’s when I enter the appropriate threads. I wonder why would you assume I would be disrespectful enough to not read thoroughly before even venturing speaking? If I felt you were misquoting, I would have countered Surah and Ayat. Note I have yet to feel the need to quote anything.

May God Guide us All

 

[Basstian]

Thank you Thipps
As a Christain I learned alot from your posts about your beliefs.
I am not in agreement with Servent on the views of sex Adam and Eve etc.
I wonder had sin not entered the world would God have formed the entire population out of clay taking a rib from each man to make another female?
The Bible plainly States that the Marriage bed is undefiled and there for sex between a husband and wife is not something to be looked at as a "Sin"
We are also as Christians in the same Boat as our Muslim friends in that
we have only small little glimpses written in text describing what heavon will be like.
The concept of more than one wife should not offend anyone male or female because even though in this day in age in this culture it is frowned apon No where is it discouraged in the bible other than spiritual leaders.
I am willing to let God work out those Details though
I somehow think that in the presence of God details of marriage and how many Virgins your neighbor has living in his mansion will matter much.
I would like to say this and hope it offends no one of either religion.
I believe in the promise written in my Bible made to Abraham I believe his Children will be in paradise as many as the number of stars in the heaven.
I firmly believe the diferences between our religions will be sorted out and the paradise we speak of is one and the same.

Peace

 

[Faithfulservant]

Hello Basstian.. I think I may need to clarify something. Im in agreement that sex in marriage is sacred and cannot be defiled. Im going under the presumption that there is no marriage in heaven because I have yet to read anything in the bible that contradicts that thought. I could very much be wrong in that only because I base my beliefs on the Word if that Word hasnt been shown to me then how can I possibly add my own beliefs to it. I also have no problem with a man having many wives.. many cultures have held that practice successfully. Im not here to judge.. just to learn.

 

[thipps]

Assalam u Alaikum Brother Thipps,
Amazing. You stand on the Peninsula where the most holy place in our faith is located and you are correcting me about direction? From where you stand you are but a small physical distance from Mecca, and the Masjid al Haram. I may never see the Holy Cities of Mecca and Medina again. Many deserving Muslims will end their lives and never experience the humbling power of 3 million people praying to God in unison. Brian, who was hoping to at least retrace the holy Prophet’s (PBUH) steps to Medina can never see it. That is what I mean by fortunate.

Assalam-o-Alaikum brother,
I was correcting on your use of 'near' just in case you might have overlooked that i was in Eastern part which is on the opposite of Makkah. This is something that is relative to a person's understanding of 'near' and i dont understand why we are focusing on how i perceive things to be near or far. Yes, i agree with you that I am fortunate to be on the same Peninsula. Lets focus on the important issues.

I really don't believe it is correct for us to discuss the appropriateness of translations and a reference on this thread.This thread is after all, opened for the purpose of discourse on Paradise.

Well, then im surprised cause you are the one who brought it up. You can click on the little icon on the right side of my nick and send me a private message for such things. I will inshallah answer such questions there.

I was interested in your opinion since you are using these translations; I have received feedback from native English Speakers who've tried to decipher diverse English translations, and found Pickthall's more straightforward. Sadly, I fear I've placed you on the defensive. That was not my intent. I read your posts along with everyone else’s when I enter the appropriate threads. I wonder why would you assume I would be disrespectful enough to not read thoroughly before even venturing speaking? If I felt you were misquoting, I would have countered Surah and Ayat. Note I have yet to feel the need to quote anything.

My feedback has been the opposite. People dont like Pickthall for the same reason i stated earlier.
and no im not on the defensive or the like. If anything, i am thrilled that someone with extensive knowledge on religious matters has come here since i have received no such official schooling. Inshallah it will be most beneficial to muslims and non-muslims alike.

May God Guide us All

Ameen.

 

[thipps]

Hello Basstian.. I think I may need to clarify something. Im in agreement that sex in marriage is sacred and cannot be defiled. Im going under the presumption that there is no marriage in heaven because I have yet to read anything in the bible that contradicts that thought. I could very much be wrong in that only because I base my beliefs on the Word if that Word hasnt been shown to me then how can I possibly add my own beliefs to it. I also have no problem with a man having many wives.. many cultures have held that practice successfully. Im not here to judge.. just to learn.

Assalam-o-Alaikum Basstian & Faithfulservant,
I just wanted to emphasize that there will be marriage in heaven. That was clear from what i posted. Also, i stated that Islam is against celibacy. We dont consider it to be a form/state of higher worship or anything as such. It is often because of this difference of belief in this matter that these questions arise. Basstian, i personally like that we have not been told everything about paradise.. gives us all something extra to look forward to. And, yes it will not matter to the man in paradise how many wives does the guy next door have cause it is stated in hadith that even the one who has the least (i.e. 2 wives) will say that he has been given the like of which no other has been given. So, everyone will be happy there.
Basstian, you said "I firmly believe the diferences between our religions will be sorted out and the paradise we speak of is one and the same." I think you will be happy to hear that since Muslims and Christian believe that Jesus(peace be upon him) will return in the end times, my personal hope is that you are right. Yes,there are those who believe that this will actually happen and we will unite when he returns. I dont know how strong is this view among our scholars as i have not researched this enough to be sure if it is a majority or minority view or simply misinformation. Guess i will do that sometime and get back to you. Seekeraftertruth, if you can shed some light on this last part, i think we would all appreciate it.
Peace, love and happiness to you all,
and Allah knows best.

 

[thipps]

Assalam-o-Alaikum,

Found this hadith and ive underlined the two important things in it.
Narated By Anas: Um (the mother of) Haritha came to Allah's Apostle after Haritha had been martyred on the Day (of the battle) of Badr by an arrow thrown by an unknown person. She said, "O Allah's Apostle! You know the position of Haritha in my heart (i.e. how dear to me he was), so if he is in Paradise, I will not weep for him, or otherwise, you will see what I will do." The Prophet said, "Are you mad? Is there only one Paradise? There are many Paradises, and he is in the highest Paradise of Firdaus." The Prophet added, "A forenoon journey or an after noon journey in Allah's Cause is better than the whole world and whatever is in it; and a place equal to an arrow bow of anyone of you, or a place equal to a foot in Paradise is better than the whole world and whatever is in it; and if one of the women of Paradise looked at the earth, she would fill the whole space between them (the earth and the heaven) with light, and would fill whatever is in between them, with perfume, and the veil of her face is better than the whole world and whatever is in it."
[Vol. 8, Book 76, Hadith #572, Sahih Bukhari]
The multiple paradises are mentioned with the best one being 'Jannat al-Firdaus'. A little more light on the women in paradise... they will be veiled.

Faithfulservant, please see the Quranic verse below. In general it is important in itself; 'Friend' just mentioned it as a reference. But, in the explanation as well there is a hadith regarding the revelation of this particular verse which adds some background.

For Muslim men and women,- for believing men and women, for devout men and women, for true men and women, for men and women who are patient and constant, for men and women who humble themselves, for men and women who give in Charity, for men and women who fast (and deny themselves), for men and women who guard their chastity, and for men and women who engage much in Allah's praise,- for them has Allah prepared forgiveness and great reward. [33:35] - Yusuf Ali's Quran Translation

Ibn Katheer in his explanation of the reason of the revelation of this Quranic verse, writes:
Imam Ahmad recorded that Umm Salamah, may Allah be pleased with her, the wife of the Prophet said, "I said to the Prophet , `Why is it that we are not mentioned in the Qur'an as men are' Then one day without my realizing it, he was calling from the Minbar[pulpit] and I was combing my hair, so I tied my hair back then I went out to my chamber in my house, and I started listening out, and he was saying from the Minbar:
(O people! Verily Allah says: (Verily, the Muslims: men and women, the believers: men and women...)) to the end of the Ayah [Verse].'' [This was also recorded by An-Nasa'i and Ibn Jarir.]

Oh, and just to provide a good resource; The following website has exegesis of Quran by Ibn Katheer. It is well-known. Inshallah will prove to be useful.
www.tafsir.com
And Allah knows best.

 

[Faithfulservant]

Heaven in Islam is the place where a Muslim will be reclining, eating meats and delicious fruits, drinking exquisite wines, and engaging in sex with virgins (surah 55:54- 56) & (surah 52:17,19).

Every Muslim will pass through Hell (surah 19:71).

Fate decides everyone's eternal destination (surah 17:13).

The majority of people in hell are women??

Mohammed said, "I was shown the Hell-fire and that the majority of its dwellers are women. " Vol. 1:28, 301; Vol. 2:161; Vol. 7:124

 

[thipps]

Assalam-o-Alaikum Faithfulservant,

Heaven in Islam is the place where a Muslim will be reclining, eating meats and delicious fruits, drinking exquisite wines, and engaging in sex with virgins (surah 55:54- 56) & (surah 52:17,19).

What is your question? You have paraphrased some verses of the Quran and written the source of your statement at the end but not asked a question. I am confused especially since this has been discussed already and this brings nothing new of note to the discussion. Please clarify.

Every Muslim will pass through Hell (surah 19:71).

Fate decides everyone's eternal destination (surah 17:13).

Again what is your question and what has this to do with the description of heaven which, i understood, the topic was about?
I dont like to leave things like this since you have asked. so, i will answer in short. In 19:71, they will pass over hell, not through it. And, to my knowledge and understanding of the verse, ALL will have to pass over it using a bridge that would be set up there(getting across to the other side is another matter). This bridge is mentioned in Sahih Bukhari & Sahih Muslim. In 17:31, the word fate has been used by Yusuf Ali, augury by Pickthall and actions by Shakir. Muslims would understand why Yusuf Ali has used the word fate because we understand that our fate is decided by our deeds which Yusuf Ali testifies to in his commentary of the Quran. Let me paste it for you:

Fate: Tair, literally a bird, hence an omen, an evil omen, fate [See 36:19].
The Arabs, like the ancient Romans, sought to read the mysteries of human fate from the flight of birds. And many of us in our own day seek to read our future fortunes by similar superstitions. We read in the previous verse that there are Signs of Allah, but they are not meant to subserve the vulgar purpose of disclosing our future destiny in a worldly sense. They are meant for quite other purposes, as we have explained. Our real fate does not depend upon birds or omens or stars. It depends on our deeds; good or evil, and they hang round our necks.
These deeds, good or evil, will be embodied in a scroll which will be quite open to us in the light of the Day of Judgment, however much we may affect to be ignorant of it now or waste our energies in prying into mysteries that do not concern us.[Yusuf Ali's Commentary]

The majority of people in hell are women??

Mohammed said, "I was shown the Hell-fire and that the majority of its dwellers are women. " Vol. 1:28, 301; Vol. 2:161; Vol. 7:124

This question has been asked in another thread, Ill leave it for there to be dealt with in detail. In short, Please read all those hadith you quoted & you will know the reason this was said because the women asked why after this was stated.
And Allah knows best.

 

[thipps]

Assalam-o-Alaikum Faithfulservant,

Heaven in Islam is the place where a Muslim will be reclining, eating meats and delicious fruits, drinking exquisite wines, and engaging in sex with virgins (surah 55:54- 56) & (surah 52:17,19).

What is your question? You have paraphrased some verses of the Quran and written the source of your statement at the end but not asked a question. I am confused especially since this has been discussed already and this brings nothing new of note to the discussion. Please clarify.

Every Muslim will pass through Hell (surah 19:71).

Fate decides everyone's eternal destination (surah 17:13).

Again what is your question and what has this to do with the description of heaven which, i understood, the topic was about?
I dont like to leave things like this since you have asked. so, i will answer in short. First let me quote the actual verse:
Not one of you but will pass over it: this is, with thy Lord, a Decree which must be accomplished. [Yusuf Ali's Quran Translation, 19:71]
In 19:71, they will pass over hell, not through it. And, to my knowledge and understanding of the verse, ALL (muslims and non-muslim) will have to pass over it using a bridge that would be set up there(getting across to the other side is another matter). This bridge is mentioned in Sahih Bukhari & Sahih Muslim. In 17:31, the word fate has been used by Yusuf Ali, augury by Pickthall and actions by Shakir. Muslims would understand why Yusuf Ali has used the word fate because we understand that our fate is decided by our deeds which Yusuf Ali testifies to in his commentary of the Quran. Let me paste it for you:

Fate: (The arabic word used is) Tair, literally a bird, hence an omen, an evil omen, fate [See 36:19].
The Arabs, like the ancient Romans, sought to read the mysteries of human fate from the flight of birds. And many of us in our own day seek to read our future fortunes by similar superstitions. We read in the previous verse that there are Signs of Allah, but they are not meant to subserve the vulgar purpose of disclosing our future destiny in a worldly sense. They are meant for quite other purposes, as we have explained. Our real fate does not depend upon birds or omens or stars. It depends on our deeds; good or evil, and they hang round our necks.
These deeds, good or evil, will be embodied in a scroll which will be quite open to us in the light of the Day of Judgment, however much we may affect to be ignorant of it now or waste our energies in prying into mysteries that do not concern us.[Yusuf Ali's Commentary on Quran]

The majority of people in hell are women??

Mohammed said, "I was shown the Hell-fire and that the majority of its dwellers are women. " Vol. 1:28, 301; Vol. 2:161; Vol. 7:124

This question has been asked in another thread, Ill leave it for there to be dealt with in detail. In short, Please read all those hadith you quoted & you will know the reason this was said because the women asked why after this was stated.
And Allah knows best.

 

[Faithfulservant]

I apologize.. I forgot to ask the question *blush* Thank you for answering my question even though I didnt ask it.

I dont think I read the other thread about the majority of the ppl in hell are women.. What amazes me is that( I think I understood this ) That the reason for this is because they asked WHY? when this was said?? Could you please tell me what thread this is under? because I would like to know the logic behind this. Do women ask Why more than men do? What would have happened if it was reversed and it said the majority of dwellers in hell are men..? Would men then ask why and thus making it so?

My reason for posting the hell thing on here is because hell is the opposite of heaven.

Thank you thipps

 

[thipps]

Assalam-o-Alaikum Faithfulservant,
I got in my car and realized that i had made a mistake. Came back to correct it. I checked from hadith on the matter of the Bridge i mentioned related to 19:71 and i was wrong in one thing. Its not everyone who will try to cross it as i thought earlier... it will be the Muslims only [as stated in the your original post] who will try to cross it but yes, i still re-iterate that getting across is another matter. It is recorded in hadith that some will cross it as quickly as the wink of an eye and be safe, yet there will be those who will be scratched and injured by the hooks and thorns on the side of the bridge, others will fall down into hell (not necessarily forever).

I dont think I read the other thread about the majority of the ppl in hell are women..

It was you who pasted this same question in the 'Women and Islam P:I' thread among the many others in one single post. No one has answered this as yet. So, i just answered it in short here as i thought it was more relevant there. and i see it has created confusion. Sorry, my bad english .

What amazes me is that ( I think I understood this ) That the reason for this is because they asked WHY? when this was said?? Could you please tell me what thread this is under? because I would like to know the logic behind this. Do women ask Why more than men do? What would have happened if it was reversed and it said the majority of dwellers in hell are men..? Would men then ask why and thus making it so?

Umm.. no. Its not because they asked. I meant that when the Prophet Mohammad(pbuh) stated this, it is recorded in those same hadith that you quoted the reason for the statement cause he said it in front of the women and obviously, as you are curious as to reasons of the statement, the muslim women became very curious and asked 'Why?'. Then the Prophet(pbuh) answered them. I didnt write his answer (and i still havent) since you already had the references, you only needed to read the complete hadith. That is why i asked you to read all those hadith you quoted.
And Allah knows best.

 

[Faithfulservant]

Yes I realized that I posted this on the women in Islam post noone has responded to it yet. I wanted your interpretation of it because look what happens when I read it for myself I only see one part of it and dont understand the rest. Thank you anyways