Yes, I agree with you here. I think that even when dealing only with what we can "detect and perceive" we have major problems. Who could have studied the 'Big Bang' and foreseen Shakespeare, Beethoven and Einstein on this little planet? The complexity of the known is on a mind-boggling scale.Who's to say the universe limits itself to what our own animal physical senses can detect and perceive? I think it's a ridiculous idea. Antitheists have no call to be smug in their certainty that there's no 'God' imo
Somehow...lolSomehow the existence of GOD has already been proven cientifically
Damn! I know this post was a year ago, but I feel so bad you went through that!I was explaining to someone (in another forum) that the double-slit experiment has nothing to do with consciousness, when a self-proclaimed gnostic atheist with a bachelor's in math decided to attack me, thinking that I was saying that it did have something to do with consciousness.
Several pages of arguing later, after other atheists initially joined his side (also being needlessly mocking and insulting), most of them realized he was wrong and slipped out, but not him. He continued sending me some of the most vicious and condescending messages I've ever received on a forum. It made me want to quit the internet altogether and almost convinced me that, even online, other people aren't worth talking to.
He never got the hint, either, I just stopped replying in that thread. It reinforced a valuable lesson that, up until then, I had mostly only known intellectually: Even if I arrive at a certain conclusion rationally, not everyone who arrives at that conclusion does so for rational reasons, and even if they do they might not be consistently rational.
To this day, I still see that user pop into threads from time to time to spout some one-liner to the religious, or to make some tangential joke at the expense of their posts. I think that guy in particular was just a total jerk and I have no idea why the other atheists on that board seem to have so much respect for him. It definitely lowered my faith in humanity as a whole.
In his argument, he also used his irrelevant credentials (in mathematics) as an argument from authority to accuse me of not understanding the complexities of quantum physics. He was so mean about it, essentially creating arguments for why I'm an idiot and incapable of any rational thought, that I ended up shaking and crying in real life.
That never happens to me, especially not over an internet altercation. That sole interaction is the major reason why I don't want to talk about science or technical fields online anymore, although I seem to be slowly getting over it. What a capricious bully.
ETA: Just revisiting this has made me upset again, and if I hadn't made so much progress on Stoic practices since then I think I'd cry because I feel like I'm choking back tears.
no, it is not somehow, though i wrote it; it is directly proven.Somehow...lol
IN 1998 PHILOSOPHER AND MATHEMATICIAN WILLIAM DEMBSKI published a book with Cambridge University Press that would forever change the debate about design and purpose in biology. The Design Inference: Eliminating Chance Through Small Probabilities provided a powerful conceptual framework for understanding the origin of complexity and purpose in living things. The second edition of this seminal work, co-authored with software engineer Winston Ewert, is a profound and long-awaited reflection on the design inference and its relevance to biological complexity, specification, and information.
For millennia, philosophers and scientists ascribed biological complexity and purpose to design. In the age of theistic faith, the awe-inspiring purposefulness and complexity of living things seemed as convincing an argument for divine providence as could be imagined. With the publication in 1859 of Darwin’s Origin of Species, and the accompanying tsunami of atheist ideology, a new age of atheistic faith inundated the scientific world. It seemed that biological design could be explained away by invoking Darwinian random heritable variation and natural selection.
In his book The Blind Watchmaker, Richard Dawkins famously summed up the Darwinian perspective. “Biology,” he admitted, “is the study of complicated things that give the appearance of having been designed for a purpose.”1 But, he quickly added, any such appearance of design is illusory: “Natural selection is the blind watchmaker, blind because it does not see ahead, does not plan consequences, has no purpose in view. Yet the living results of natural selection overwhelmingly impress us with the appearance of design as if by a master watchmaker, impress us with the illusion of design and planning.”2 Because all biological design is thereby explained away, Dawkins concluded, “Darwin made it possible to be an intellectually fulfilled atheist.”3
Of course, even after Darwin, perceptive scientists continued to point out that the complexity and purpose evident in living things still left atheists a bit short of intellectual fulfillment. Darwinian faith was de rigueur in the twentieth century, and this despite the discovery of a computer code in DNA and astonishingly elegant molecular nanotechnology in living things, including cellular organelles like the bacterial flagellum that work according to obvious engineering principles.4 Nonetheless, it took a brave soul to dare question the Darwinian paradigm in biology. Those scientists who did question atheist dogma tended to become unfulfilled in the sense of “unemployed.”
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How could the skeletal system evolve by a natural process? It's possibly the most complex mechanical machine known to man, a bunch of levers connected together for movement. Robotic engineers could look at how 500 muscles, 200 bones, 500 ligaments and 1000 tendons are linked together. Every advance in robotic engineering comes about by teams of engineers using intelligent design. Every future improvement will be a result of intelligent design and super computers.Bad Design, or Ultimate Engineering? Two Views of Biology
You mentioned 30 trillion living cells in human body. They are the engineers of human body. At work even now, to create our future generations (who may be different from humans of today).Our bodies are made up of about thirty trillion cells, they function and grow from a toddler to an adult; plus we pass our genes forwards. Engineers could never do this. How can blind nature develop a mechanical process that is more advanced than our best computers, engineers and scientists?
How could blind nature create the variety and complexity of life we see today; without God?
Design is mostly a compromise, but it still needs design. The greatest imperfection is death, and we all die. With God, there is a greater good life after death.Argument from poor design - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org![]()
Now you are showing me the lollipops. Deny death. Theists do not have courage to face death.The greatest imperfection is death, and we all die. With God, there is a greater good life after death.
You do tend to hyperbole ... but then I suppose we all do.Theists do not have courage to face death.![]()
This would be almost like saying its very complexity is proof against evolution or somethingHow could the skeletal system evolve by a natural process? It's possibly the most complex mechanical machine known to man,
..not a proof against evolution .. but that the process of evolution is not a mere coincidence,This would be almost like saying its very complexity is proof against evolution or something
????
Yeah, it is not coincidence. It always depends on environment, evolution or mutation... but that the process of evolution is not a mere coincidence,
that just happens "because it can".