Clear teaching by Jesus

[Thomas]

I would offer that we need to let go of the word Trinity, as that doctrine has become a cause of great division amongst humanity.

I would offer requiring everyone to think like me is a greater cause of division.

You think I am wrong / I think you are wrong / And, as Vonnegut says, 'so it goes'.

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I would assume, once you've rolled-up Trinitarian Christianity, that the object of attention will be the next doctrine down the line, that eventually Judaism, Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism, etc., will be obliged to let go of the core doctrines that don't fit your model or accept your governance.

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Better, all round, I would have thought, we agree to live and let live, and delight in the different ways of coming to 'It'.

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

I would offer requiring everyone to think like me is a greater cause of division.

You think I am wrong / I think you are wrong / And, as Vonnegut says, 'so it goes'.

+++

I would assume, once you've rolled-up Trinitarian Christianity, that the object of attention will be the next doctrine down the line, that eventually Judaism, Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism, etc., will be obliged to let go of the core doctrines that don't fit your model or accept your governance.

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Better, all round, I would have thought, we agree to live and let live, and delight in the different ways of coming to 'It'.

I am happy to let that be so Thomas, yet I would be neglectful of my spiritual obligation to share a Message, if I did not share the message. Thomas, they are not my teachings. They were given by Baha'u'llah, who I see is the Father, the 'Glory of God', the promise all Christians await, and the promise fulfilled by all other faiths that await.

I see It is God that asked us to drop the Trinity firstly in the Message given by Muhammad.

Surah An-Nisa - 171
So believe in Allah and His messengers and do not say, “Trinity.” Stop!—for your own good. Allah is only One God. Glory be to Him! He is far above having a son!

This to me is saying that we should not make a material connection, as Christ is Spirt and Jesus came in the Station of the Son.

So unity will require compromise, only God knows what compromises we will choose to embrace.

I can already embrace all religions in the same light of One God, so I ask, what will it take for Jews, Christians and Muslims etc, to do the same. It will require us as a majority to embrace our oneness before the Kingdom can come.

Regards Tony

 

[Thomas]

I am happy to let that be so Thomas, yet I would be neglectful of my spiritual obligation to share a Message, if I did not share the message.

Oh share, fine ... but tell others to dump theirs? Not so fine.

I've had discourses with Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Brahmins ... very, very fruitful, very collegiate, and we all accepted each others' way.

That's the way to true unity.

I see It is God that asked us to drop the Trinity firstly in the Message given by Muhammad.

Well clearly I don't, and having read the relevant texts in Baha'i archives, I see the argument if flawed – so you will excuse me.

urah An-Nisa - 171
So believe in Allah and His messengers and do not say, “Trinity.” Stop!—for your own good. Allah is only One God. Glory be to Him! He is far above having a son!

You see, that's an anthropomorphic argument.

So unity will require compromise, only God knows what compromises we will choose to embrace.

No. Unity will require compassion, respect and understanding.

Christ understood that and applauded it.

I can already embrace all religions in the same light of One God, so I ask, what will it take for Jews, Christians and Muslims etc, to do the same. It will require us as a majority to embrace our oneness before the Kingdom can come.

Is that their oneness, my oneness, or your oneness?

Because it still seems to me you require your oneness.

Whereas for me, living in the real world, the greater way is to embrace our oneness, only then will we find peace.

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

Oh share, fine ... but tell others to dump theirs? Not so fine

The Message of Baha’u’llah offers the opposite, it encourages us to look at our Faith with new eyes and hear with new ears, embrace our Faith in the Oneness of all Faiths, as they have all come from God, either as the Truth, or as a test of Truth.

By their fruits we shall know them.

It is just logical observation that if one decides their Faith has the only True source to God, then it is apparent that view needs to be dumped, it will never be able to foster the oneness of humanity.

The Oneness of the Messengers is the only way we will find that God is the Author of all the Faiths, the Christ's of each 'Day of God'. Christ is the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End, the Alpha and Omega.

The flesh amounts to nothing.

As people embrace this principle, it is foretold that the opposition will commence, I hope Thomas, that you will consider the fruits of the Baha'i as this progressively unfolds.

I wish you nought but strong Faith in Christ, a happy life and may all good be yours. Regards Tony

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

I've had discourses with Jews, Muslims, Buddhists, Brahmins ... very, very fruitful, very collegiate, and we all accepted each others' way.

That's the way to true unity.

Yes indeed it is Thomas, but we can not be hypocritical in doing this.

We have to acknowledge that the source of their Faith, is the source of our own.

Regards Tony

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

Is that their oneness, my oneness, or your oneness?

Because it still seems to me you require your oneness.

I can only be part of the Oneness Thomas, I am but a man like you, I need to be born again.

God's Oneness given to us by God's 'Annointed' Messengers. 'The Christ's'.

All the best, Regards Tony

 

[Thomas]

The Message of Baha’u’llah offers the opposite ...

I have the Message of Christ, so I really don't need another ... a man cannot serve two masters

It is just logical observation that if one decides their Faith has the only True source to God, then it is apparent that view needs to be dumped, it will never be able to foster the oneness of humanity.

But your faith claims to supersede all others, and indeed 'correct' the errors of others, so logically you're making that same claim.

is the Author of all the Faiths, the Christ's of each 'Day of God'. Christ is the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End, the Alpha and Omega.

Yes, that's what Christians believe ... it's our scripture ... so why should we jump ship?

I hope Thomas, that you will consider the fruits of the Baha'i as this progressively unfolds.

"Now this is eternal life: That they may know thee, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent." (John 17:3).
I have tasted – albeit fleetingly – that eternal peace, that joy, that rest, in Him – that is outside time. That is the sustenance I seek, and I know in whom it is found.

And I have walked with others who, on their own path, have sensed the same as I.

I am not declaring supremacy, you are.

I wish you nought but strong Faith in Christ, a happy life and may all good be yours. Regards Tony

Thank you. And Peace be with you.

 

[Thomas]

Yes indeed it is Thomas, but we can not be hypocritical in doing this.

Why do you see hypocrisy? I do not claim superiority, nor do they ... Rather, I see humility.

We have to acknowledge that the source of their Faith, is the source of our own.

So it seems to me it would be hypocritical to require them to abandon their faith and follow mine when both are the same.

"The Spirit breatheth where he will; and thou hearest his voice, but thou knowest not whence he cometh, and whither he goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.” (John 3:8)

My belief does not dictate what God can or cannot do, to whom He speaks and how. I delight in anyone who hears that 'still, small voice' in this clamorous world.

If people ask, I will speak, but I will not place them under obligation.

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

I have the Message of Christ, so I really don't need another ... a man cannot serve two masters


But your faith claims to supersede all others, and indeed 'correct' the errors of others, so logically you're making that same claim.


Yes, that's what Christians believe ... it's our scripture ... so why should we jump ship?


"Now this is eternal life: That they may know thee, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent." (John 17:3).
I have tasted – albeit fleetingly – that eternal peace, that joy, that rest, in Him – that is outside time. That is the sustenance I seek, and I know in whom it is found.

And I have walked with others who, on their own path, have sensed the same as I.

I am not declaring supremacy, you are.


Thank you. And Peace be with you.

Thomas.

It boils down to naught to do with me, I claim no supremany, it is all about our choices in embracing what has come from Christ. I am but a sinner, a human, as we all are.

The Message was given by Baha'u'llah. Either you accept it as you have with the Message of Jesus, or you do not. Either way, the Message of Baha’u’llah was addressed to every individual on this planet, just as the Message given by both Jesus and Muhammad were. It is a message of unity and Oneness in God.

Can a house divided find unity? I see a unity of diversity can be found in the same household, but I see no unity in division.

That peace is found in the Holy Spirit, true unity will be found when we acknowledge all the given sources of that Spirit. Until we do, there is only a superficial bond, as when times get challenging, there is nothing preventing a person from discrediting another person's faith and persecuting people because of their chosen faith.

Regards Tony

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

Yes, that's what Christians believe ... it's our scripture ... so why should we jump ship?

There is one ship, one ark of salvation.

There is an entire diversity of humanity on board that ship as all Names become One.

Regards Tony

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

Why do you see hypocrisy? I do not claim superiority, nor do they ... Rather, I see humility.

I am looking long term Thomas. Interfaith is a start, it is not the completed foundation for peace.

It is not about abandonment of our faith it is about embracing the fact that we are all motivated by the same Spirit, given of God, that to me is a strong foundation in humility.

As a Baha'i I am also a Christian, I have embraced Jesus as the Christ, I pick up the cross and follow him. Yet at the same time I embrace Noah, Abraham, Krishna, Moses Zoroaster, Buddha, Muhammad, the Bab and Baha'u'llah in that very same light, we can be One in the Light given of God, a Light where there is no darkness, just a desire to serve all the human race under One God.

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Zechariah 14:9 ►

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Verse (Click for Chapter) King James Bible And the LORD shall be king over all the earth: in that day shall there be one LORD, and his name one.

Regards Tony

 

[SalixIncendium]

Yes, that's what Christians believe ... it's our scripture ... so why should we jump ship?

There is one ship, one ark of salvation.

There is an entire diversity of humanity on board that ship as all Names become One.

Yes. This is the typical Baha'i MO.

"Look! Your faith is the same as mine! Same gods and everystuff! Baha'u'lah said it in [insert something from the Baha'i Reference library here]. So you see, there is no point in two religions when all of humanity should be united. Drop you religion and become Baha'i!"

I wouldn't say anything if this very sales pitch wasn't played on me...same player...different forum.

 

[Tony Bristow-Stagg]

Yes. This is the typical Baha'i MO.

"Look! Your faith is the same as mine! Same gods and everystuff! Baha'u'lah said it in [insert something from the Baha'i Reference library here]. So you see, there is no point in two religions when all of humanity should be united. Drop you religion and become Baha'i!"

Hello, good to see you. I hope you are well and happy.

It is a quandary of faith as to how the motivation to share the Message of Baha’u’llah, which to me is the Message of Jesus and all the Prophets, can be met with such opposition.

I see the Messenge given by Baha’u’llah is all about a motivation to embrace one's own religion, which is demonstrably inclusive of all that is of Christ, the first and the last. Jesus the Christ was more than flesh. Christ is all Names, all Attributes, found in all the Faith's given of God.

One could say the ultimate interfaith.org

Regards Tony