Confused by a book on Perennialism

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I acquired a copy of a book called Annotations: Philosophical Religious, Cultural, Historical: The Early British Perennialist Authors
Compiled by William Stoddard copyright 2019

I'm not sure what to make of it.
It is a slim volume of short essays by various authors.
I think maybe getting this kind of anthology was a mistake, as it lacks context. And is possibly too shaped by the biases of the compiler/editor.
From the preface and from some of the essays, I get a flavor of complaints. Complaints about modernity.
Complaints about "political correctness" Complaints about Vatican II. Complaints about ... the Enlightenment, of all things.
This is just in the author's brief intro.
The essay about the so called "tyranny" of so called "political correctness" is very brief, doesn't really define its terms of support its claims, and I don't really know what they are talking about.
Don't get me wrong, so called "political correctness" has all sorts of weird bits that can be picked apart if someone wanted to go into detail.
But this little book -- not a great intro to Perennialism, I'm afraid.

What is a better intro? Any recommendations?
 
I am not a specialist, but for sure, early perennialist authors didn't complain about political correctness because they published before this term was even established.

I recommend to read originals like Schuon's De l'Unité transcendante des religions, which has certainly been translated into English as well.
 
I read "Perennial Philosophy" by Arthur Versluis. I found it to be a decent introduction.
 
I am not a specialist, but for sure, early perennialist authors didn't complain about political correctness because they published before this term was even established.
That's what I thought too.
Could be the compiler/editor just has his own agenda and complaints and cherry picked items for his anthology, which included some more recent material, despite the title.
 
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I wonder if it (complaining about the modern world) is a theme though with some traditionalists? Seeing this while perusing:


After all the modern world does challenge tradition in many ways. So I suppose traditionalists would be living up to their name.
I guess I'm not really getting my head around what it is that makes perennialism equivalent(?) to traditionalism, or why traditionalism is another name for it, when I would more likely have associated it with modern pluralism.
 
Maybe you came onto someone who is close to the Pius Society who are also called traditionalists but, in contrast to the Perennialists you search for are not open to anything.
At least Schuon, of whom I read long time ago from a book from a library, is very open to any religion, but he's rather closed to "modern" science (in quotation marks because he wrote that book in 1948)
 
Maybe you came onto someone who is close to the Pius Society who are also called traditionalists but, in contrast to the Perennialists you search for are not open to anything.
At least Schuon, of whom I read long time ago from a book from a library, is very open to any religion, but he's rather closed to "modern" science (in quotation marks because he wrote that book in 1948)
Yeah that is what I find confusing about Perennialists calling themselves Traditionalists. They must have a reason, but there are other kinds of groups that have the name Traditionalists too.
 
From the preface and from some of the essays, I get a flavor of complaints. Complaints about modernity.
Complaints about "political correctness" Complaints about Vatican II. Complaints about ... the Enlightenment, of all things.
Yes, in general the Trads do take issue with modernity.

What is a better intro? Any recommendations?
As @talib-al-kalim mentioned, Schuon's "Transcendent Unity" is a good place.

The Sword of Gnosis is a collection of essays by those I'd refer to as the primary Traditionalists.

Schuon's From the Divine to the Human I recall as being particularly inspirational.

The language is that of the metaphysician. I'd dip into Schuon and, if you can't get on with it, then at least know his voice is constant across his works.

Réne Guénon – considered to be the founder of the Traditionalist school, is in many ways a tougher read. His "The Reign of Quantity and the Signs of the Times" is the benchmark work on the Trad's critique of modernism.

"Many of Guénon's books, notably The Reign of Quantity, are such potent and detailed attacks on the downward drift of Western civilisation as to make all other contemporary critiques seem half-hearted by comparison."
(Jacob Needleman in The Sword of Gnosis).

"The Reign of Quantity is a brilliantly sustained and excoriating attack on modern civilisation ... The book is a controlled and dispassionate but devastating razing of the assumptions and values of modern science. At the same time it is an affirmation of the metaphysical and cosmological principles given expression in traditional culture and religions."
(Harry Oldmeadow, author of Traditionalism: Religion in the Light of the Perennial Philosophy)
 
A complete exposition of the metaphysical doctrine of the Trads can be traced to these works by Guénon:
(The link is to a combined file from which one can extract 22 titles)

Introduction to the Study of the Hindu Doctrines
Man and His Becoming According to the Vedanta
The Multiple States of Being
The Symbolism of the Cross
 
"The Reign of Quantity is a brilliantly sustained and excoriating attack on modern civilisation ... The book is a controlled and dispassionate but devastating razing of the assumptions and values of modern science.
Yikes.
Maybe I am not as interested in Sophia perennis as I thought I was.
At the very least I will have to see it as an opposing viewpoint and not as something which I expect to find commonality with.
 
LOL, you'd probably not enjoy The Reign then!

Extracts from a couple of reviews, for balance:
" ... The Degeneration of Coinage (Chapter 16) ... Guenon here demonstrates the trajectory of Western society through the concrete example of money. He begins with the origin of the coin as a sacred object made of a valuable material and covered with transcendent symbols. He follows the transformation of the coin – its loss of religious significance, its change from metal to paper, the idea of “inflation” – and then he predicts that eventually money will disappear altogether to be replaced by lists of numbers. Guenon was writing in the 1930’s and could not have known of electronic currency.

... Guenon was an astute critic of culture, able to present Hindu doctrine to the Western mind in a remarkably unbiased language.

I was also encouraged by Guenon’s fearless critique of nebulous “spirituality”. He is adamant that many of our modern spiritual movements are bogus. Simultaneously, his respect for and knowledge of the world’s Great Religions is unmatched. Religion is something real, necessary, revelatory and indispensable. Conversely, much of what passes for spirituality today is materialism couched in religious language.

Guenon helped me reject Modernism – a given in my habits of thinking. Whether or not we know it, Modernism is the lens through which we see the world, and this lens starkly-yet-imperceptibly colors whatever is viewed through it.

"... But considering Guenon’s specific thesis about coins helped me see history, philosophy, culture and religion as one, and the façade of their fragmentation was cracked. While American education gives us unrelated categories and disjointed specializations, a mirage of little cabinets, Guenon presents knowledge as a painting or a house or a tree, as a unity rather than as units.

Rather, Guenon was writing to prevent the further falling of humanity from the quality of ancient culture into the mere quantity of the modern world (hence the title).

Joshua Sturgill, on the CiRCE Institute website
 
"in the Reign of Quantity, Guénon sees history in terms of the Hindu concept of the manvantara, the cycle of manifestation composed of Golden, Silver, Bronze and Iron ages; … This cycle is an inevitable descent from the pole of Essence (or forma) toward the pole of Substance (or materia). […] Essence is qualitative while substance is quantitative; As the cycle progresses or descends, the very nature of time and space changes … In earlier stages, time is relatively eternal, as the cycle moves on, however, time begins to take over and accelerate, but this constant acceleration of time can’t go on forever. Time, the “devourer” ends by devouring itself. At the end of time, Time will be changed into space again … This ultimate timeless point is simultaneously the end of the cycle of manifestation and the beginning of the next … Before this ultimate transformation, in the latter days of the present cycle certain final developments must take place. Since quantity has particularly to do with matter, the Reign of quantity must also be the reign of materialism. The age of miracles ceases, the world becomes less permeable to the influences of the higher planes of reality."
(The poet and perennialist Charles Upton)

The Reign of Quantity and the Signs of the Times is René Guénon’s most prophetic work, which only becomes more relevant with each passing year. Having seen his telling analysis of Western culture, The Crisis of the Modern World, swiftly overtaken by events, Guénon based this his final and most profound critique squarely on changeless metaphysical principles. But to unite social criticism with metaphysics is to beget eschatology, and so, whereas in Crisis Guénon foresaw the end of Western civilization, in Reign he presents us with the end of a vaster world-age, or Manvantara, that began before the dawn of history as we know it.

Guénon bases his critique on ‘abstract’ principles, but his examples are satisfyingly concrete. His chapter ‘The Degeneration of Coinage’ could easily be updated to include the transformation of money into a web of electronically-stored information, while in its treatment of the occult dangers of metallurgy ‘The Significance of Metallurgy’ points directly to our own well-founded fear of such man-made elements as plutonium. And his ‘Fissures in the Great Wall’ gives solid metaphysical grounding to our twentieth-century century demonology, including the UFO phenomenon.

The Reign of Quantity presents a vision of the End Times that in no way contradicts traditional eschatologies, but is one key to their deeper meaning. Guénon sees history as a descent from Form (or Quality) toward Matter (or Quantity); but after the Reign of Quantity—modern materialism and the ‘rise of the masses’—Guénon predicts a reign of ‘inverted quality’ just before the end of the age: the triumph of the ‘counter-initiation’, the kingdom of Antichrist. This text is considered the magnum opus among Guénon’s texts of civilizational criticism, as is Symbols of Sacred Science among his studies on symbols and cosmology, and Man and His Becoming according to the Vedanta among his more purely metaphysical works.

(Path to the Maypole of Wisdom: A Choice for Spiritual Ethics,Virtues and Uprightness in our times)
 
I wonder if it (complaining about the modern world) is a theme though with some traditionalists? Seeing this while perusing:
Not so much a theme as a recognition of a metaphysical principle at play.

Modernism is under the glamour of its own surface, if you like, we're bedazzled by our achievements, and that deludes us into thinking we are in every respect superior beings with regard to those who went before, when actually, we're not that much different, and take away all our tech, and we'd devolve pretty rapidly ... we are 'hothouse' flowers, in that regard.

By modernism they mean the refutation of the religious and the spiritual – it's hard to see, but if you've been raised in a religion, and then taken the trouble to look into and interrogate your own beliefs, you come to see that so much of what passes for 'common sense' with regard to comments on religion are not the product of any real thought at all, and are largely spun out of thin air, prejudice and ignorance...

After all the modern world does challenge tradition in many ways. So I suppose traditionalists would be living up to their name.
The meaning of tradition is 'that which is handed down'.

What 'tradition' is not, is the more contemporary reading of the term to imply a "nostalgia for the past”, in the words of Schuon, 'a particularly reprehensible arbitrariness' which utterly devalues its proper meaning. His reasoning for arguing the 'idiotic' and 'dishonest circumlocution' being that the same can be applied to well-founded logical processes – mathematics is a tradition; that mathematical theorems exist today is not the result of such a 'nostalgia' but rather the recognition of their versimilitude.

With regard to religion, modernity tends to reproach these ideas simply because they are found in the past, or because one would like to situate them there “irreversibly”, so as to remove from them any contemporary value. They become trivialised and are reduced to novelties.

+++

The Enlightenment introduced the opinion that we are other-than nature, something we are somehow apart from and superior to. Famously nature was portrayed as a wanton woman who needed to be tamed by (male) science – it was not so much enlightened as patrician privilege and entitlement bolstering itself on its own interpretation of scientific principles.

As the Native American commentator might have said, "If you're so enlightened, how come you shit in your own tent?"

So for all its benefits, and they are many, there is an underlying downside which we do not see and refuse to acknowledge – it's taken us to approach the brink of catastrophe, an extinction event, to recognise that we cannot control nature, and it's a dangerous game thinking that way. Better is working in harmony with, but that is not the 'male' way ...

If there was any more example sought for the idea of the decline spoken of by the perennialists, I'd point to our current batch of political leaders.

I guess I'm not really getting my head around what it is that makes perennialism equivalent(?) to traditionalism, or why traditionalism is another name for it, when I would more likely have associated it with modern pluralism.
The distinction between 'traditionalism' and 'pluralism' can be seen in the case of comparative religion.

The Traditionalist, that is the follower of the Sophia Perennis, holds that all truth is one, and works from a set of top-down principles, to highlight the essential sameness and the formal differences between religious traditions, and thus offers a means of reconciliation for those for whom the differences become an impediment.

The pluralist, on the other hand, tends to work on bottom-up principles, and often such are founded on egalitarian ideas, which too often is an egalitarian idealism, founded on sentimentality and romance, rather than actual metaphysical principles.

All religions are not the same. This is a confusion of metaphysical principle. Each is unique and in its own way quite distinct from its neighbour. Its source and origin is One, and that One-ness exists above the level of forms. If you treat each religiuon at its exoteric and formal level, then Christianity, for example, refutes every other religion, or at best situates it beneath itself – "Jesus saith to him: I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No man cometh to the Father, but by me" (John 14:6) – that's pretty dogmatic.

You can't be a Zen Christian – or rather, you can identify as such, as long as you're not fully conversant with either Zen Buddhism, Christianity, or both. The 'way' of those paths contradict each other at the formal level.

You can delight in the correspondence between traditions that points to a common essence, that is what the Perennial Tradition is all about – but what the Traditionalists assert, is that to know a religion you have to do it – there are plenty of those who comment on or about religion from outside. You can't ride two horses, you can't serve two masters, and at some point you're gonna have to get off the fence.
 
Seyyed Hossein Nasr: On Tradition, Metaphysics, and Modernity
Interviewed by Taimur Aziz (TA): The mention of “Tradition” is extensive throughout your works with reference to a variety of ields including philosophy, religion and art. Moreover, you identify as belonging to the “Traditionalist school.” What is “Tradition,” and what role does it
play in perennial philosophy?


Seyyed Hossein Nasr (SHN): The meaning of “tradition” as used by traditionalists such as myself does not mean custom or transmitted habit, but principles of a divine order and their applications to various domains. I can quote for you from one of my own writings:
Tradition . . . means truths or principles of a divine origin revealed or unveiled to mankind and, in fact, a whole cosmic sector through various figures envisaged as messengers, prophets, avatars, the Logos or other transmitting agencies, along with all the ramifications and applications of these principles to different realms including law and social structure, art, symbolism, the sciences, and embracing of course Supreme Knowledge with the means for its attainment. ("Knowledge and the Sacred" SUNY Press, 1989, 67–68)

TA: Perennial Philosophy is distinct from religious syncretism in that it insists on maintaining the boundaries of individual religions on the external level. Can you elaborate upon this distinction between the two schools of thought?
SHN: There is a radical difference. Perennial philosophy as understood traditionally believes that each religion has an inward or essential and an outward or formal aspect or dimension. On the formal level religions are different and since these forms in orthodox and traditional religions are sacred and sacrosanct, they must be respected on their own level and not mixed together or neglected. Traditional perennial philosophy is therefore opposed strongly to syncreticism and pseudo-esoterism. Of course on the intellectual level a religion can borrow certain elements from another tradition to express its own truths as we see for example in St. Augustine and Christian Platonism in general but that is very different from using rites of the Greek religion as part of the Christian mass. As for religious syncreticism, as ordinarily understood, it is a mixing of different traditional elements into an amalgam, something that is completely opposed by traditionalist followers of the perennial philosophy.

TA: You argue that the differences in religions lie only on the formal level. However, in many cases major traditional religions disagree over fundamental tenets such as the unity of the divine being and life after death. Polytheistic and monotheistic religions do not claim to have room for each other’s ideas. How does perennial philosophy, then, reconcile such basic differences between religions that seem to penetrate deeper than the formal level?
SHN: No major traditional religion rejects the unity of the Divine Principle whether it be the Abrahamic religions, Hinduism, Taoism or Confucianism. As for Buddhism, although it does not speak to the objective Pole of Reality but the subjective one, it certainly does not
speak of multiple ultimate nirvanas or paranirvanas.

As for mythological and primal religions, behind the multiple “masks of the gods” there is always the presence of the one supreme Spirit, for example wakan-tanka in the Native American traditions. Let me also mention that in the case of Iranian religions such as Zoroastrianism the dualism between light and darkness involves the cosmic and moral battle between good and evil resulting in the final victory of the good. If you ask any Zoroastrian, you will find that he or she insists on being certainly a monotheist and not a dualist metaphysically and theologically speaking.

Concerning life after death, since time immemorial human beings have disposed of the body of the dead ritually and believed in life after death as the French traditionalist anthropologist Jean Servier has demonstrated amply in his L’Homme et l’invisible. Some religions like Confucianism have said little in their formal teachings about eschatology while others such as Buddhism, Christianity and Islam have spoken extensively about this matter. If, as some claim, in early Judaism there were no beliefs in immortality but later on Judaism adopted this idea from Zoroastrianism and Christianity, then why would early Jews follow the Divine Law so assiduously and even be willing to give up their earthly lives for it?

Polytheistic and monotheistic religions may not have room for each other’s ideas on the exoteric level, but they certainly do on the esoteric level. As for Islam, I only need to quote a verse from one of the most famous Sufi poets of the Persian language, Shaykh Mahmūd Shabistarī: If a Muslim were only to know what an idol is, He would know that [true] religion (dīn) is in idol-worship.

Perennial philosophy reconciles formal and external differences by first of all going from the form to the essence and secondly by viewing forms not just as external forms, but as gateways to inner meanings. As Rūmī has said: The differences between people arises from the name [form- nām]; When on goes to the inner meaning (ma‘nā), there is accord and peace.

Only the Absolute is absolute in the metaphysical sense but within a particular order of reality its manifestation is in a sense still “absolute” although it is not the Absolute as such. It is to this former reality that F. Schuon refers as “the relatively absolute.” In various religious universes many and sometimes most ordinary believers see the “relatively absolute” as the Absolute as such and therefore limit salvation to members of their own religion. A prime example is Christianity, which absolutizes the manifestation of the Divine in Christ resulting in the famous dictum extra ecclesiam nulla salus with which many Christian theologians are grappling today.

Islam has a less dificult problem with this issue because of the explicit universalism of many passages of the Quran. Particularism is, however,
present in all religious climes including Islam in one way or another and is a theological issue with which they all have to deal especially now that the traditional boundaries of the various religious worlds have been removed to a large extent if not completely throughout much of the world.
 
and then he predicts that eventually money will disappear altogether to be replaced by lists of numbers.
He might have been thinking of serial numbers that bills have and had then, and can be traced by, then wondered what it would be like to just have serial numbers to go by or something.
... Guenon was an astute critic of culture, able to present Hindu doctrine to the Western mind in a remarkably unbiased language.
That sounds interesting
Simultaneously, his respect for and knowledge of the world’s Great Religions is unmatched
That sounds interesting

I was also encouraged by Guenon’s fearless critique of nebulous “spirituality”. He is adamant that many of our modern spiritual movements are bogus.
What does he mean by that?

Religion is something real, necessary, revelatory and indispensable. Conversely, much of what passes for spirituality today is materialism couched in religious language.
Intriguing assertion but I do not know what it means

"... But considering Guenon’s specific thesis about coins helped me see history, philosophy, culture and religion as one, and the façade of their fragmentation was cracked. While American education gives us unrelated categories and disjointed specializations, a mirage of little cabinets, Guenon presents knowledge as a painting or a house or a tree, as a unity rather than as units.
This sounds interesting

Rather, Guenon was writing to prevent the further falling of humanity from the quality of ancient culture into the mere quantity of the modern world
Interesting, but I have no idea what this means.
 
As the cycle progresses or descends, the very nature of time and space changes … In earlier stages, time is relatively eternal, as the cycle moves on, however, time begins to take over and accelerate, but this constant acceleration of time can’t go on forever. Time, the “devourer” ends by devouring itself. At the end of time, Time will be changed into space again … This ultimate timeless point is simultaneously the end of the cycle of manifestation and the beginning of the next … Before this ultimate transformation, in the latter days of the present cycle certain final developments must take place. Since quantity has particularly to do with matter, the Reign of quantity must also be the reign of materialism. The age of miracles ceases, the world becomes less permeable to the influences of the higher planes of reality."
Does this propose that scientific theories of the age of the universe, and the idea that physical laws as we know them have been consistent through time... is not correct, and that at an earlier historical point there were magic, or miracles, or both or something, and only later for some reason did physical material scientific laws come into being? What is being said here?
 
but to unite social criticism with metaphysics is to beget eschatology, and so, whereas in Crisis Guénon foresaw the end of Western civilization
I've been hearing about things like "the end of Western civilization" and "then end of the world as we know it" and eschatology of some kind or another, sometimes with the idea of some sad decline, sometimes with the idea of the return of Jesus, the resurrection of the dead, the annihilation of evildoers, and the creation of a new heavens and a new earth... been hearing about that for as long as I can remember. And I'm assuming these books may predate my life by some time.

I don't know if these things are truly meant literally or not. I do not know if they will happen swiftly enough for someone to notice in a lifetime. I do not know what the outcome is supposed to be.

I do know that all too often things like equality for women or minorities is somehow seen as part of the "decadence" of "modernity" and lumped into the idea of "decay and downfall mrrr mrrr mrrr" and I'm not sure what to make of that. It's never inspired me to be dubious about equality nor dubious of the many grand and wonderful things about the modern world that I and millions of others take for granted every day.

There are those of a certain outlook who talk about the downfall of society and have been for as long as I can remember -- but the self same people somehow mock the idea that a physical eventuality, like climate change or an asteroid, may be a real culprit in any massive changes and adaptations we may be facing... (I know that edges on the political so I will refrain from elaborating)

Guénon bases his critique on ‘abstract’ principles, but his examples are satisfyingly concrete. His chapter ‘The Degeneration of Coinage’ could easily be updated to include the transformation of money into a web of electronically-stored information, while in its treatment of the occult dangers of metallurgy ‘The Significance of Metallurgy’ points directly to our own well-founded fear of such man-made elements as plutonium. And his ‘Fissures in the Great Wall’ gives solid metaphysical grounding to our twentieth-century century demonology, including the UFO phenomenon.
Very interesting, and reminiscent of a few things I remember my grandfather and maybe my mom or grandma talking about, though they most certainly wouldn't have read Guenon, only read more mass market books by other writers who may have read him or his contemporaries.

The Reign of Quantity presents a vision of the End Times that in no way contradicts traditional eschatologies, but is one key to their deeper meaning. Guénon sees history as a descent from Form (or Quality) toward Matter (or Quantity); but after the Reign of Quantity—modern materialism and the ‘rise of the masses’—Guénon predicts a reign of ‘inverted quality’ just before the end of the age: the triumph of the ‘counter-initiation’, the kingdom of Antichrist.
I certainly remember a lot of talk about the End Times from my grandfather and the books and magazines and radio and tv broadcasts that came from the World Wide Church of God (his heterodox Armstrong church) I imagine some of the people involved higher up in that organization may have read Guenon. Or his contemporaries who may have said similar things.
 
"Many of Guénon's books, notably The Reign of Quantity, are such potent and detailed attacks on the downward drift of Western civilisation as to make all other contemporary critiques seem half-hearted by comparison."
(Jacob Needleman in The Sword of Gnosis).

"The Reign of Quantity is a brilliantly sustained and excoriating attack on modern civilisation ... The book is a controlled and dispassionate but devastating razing of the assumptions and values of modern science. At the same time it is an affirmation of the metaphysical and cosmological principles given expression in traditional culture and religions."
(Harry Oldmeadow, author of Traditionalism: Religion in the Light of the Perennial Philosophy)
I have my doubts about "the downward drift" as if we are worse off than people centuries ago, or objectively worse as people, or something.

I'm not thrilled about everything in the world around me, or culture around me, but I have really learned to appreciate what I have and the fact people haven't always had what I have, women haven't always had what I have, and I have always preferred the optimism of a progressive spirit that "things are going great, and they're only getting better"♫♪ (Timbuk 3 The Future's So Bright...)

Things like racial and gender equality, medical advances, other scientific and technological advances, the advance of liberal democracies, higher standards of living, etc etc etc.

I'm not thrilled by everything, far from it, but I do not expect to be, and I'm more dubious about the excessive pessimism than I am about anything else.

Esp since I think pessimism and optimism are at least partially self fulfilling prophecies.
 
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