The Law and the Ages

Well Basstian (LOL),

Now that you put that way, good point! (why didn't you say so in the foist place? nyuck nyuck nyuck) :D

I'm teasing, but seriouly that made sense to me.

Humor is like sugar...sometimes it make the "medicine" go down easier.

v/r

Q;)
 
Well Basstian (LOL),

Now that you put that way, good point! (why didn't you say so in the foist place? nyuck nyuck nyuck) :D

I'm teasing, but seriouly that made sense to me.

Humor is like sugar...sometimes it make the "medicine" go down easier.
Thanks Q

I laugh at my Kids sometimes when I set up rules and such. It can be the simplest concept that they do or will do by nature as they mature but if I call it a rule. LOOK OUT

I.E. Turn out the lights in the bedrooms. We have 5 children so the electric bill can get pretty large without this rule but they all seem to think it infringes on their freedom to make them turn it out. As if flipping that little switch is a burden and consumes way to much of their valuable time.
It wont be until they mature and start paying a bill with their name on it that this rule will make perfect sence to them.

Now it seems they missuse scripture to justify breaking my rules.
God Said "Let There Be Light" who is Dad to tell us to turn it out :D
 
Dear Basstian

Maybe if you taught your children how important it is to conserve GOD's energy for the most important things in life, they might appreciate and value the wastage of energy, and its importance to the smooth running of the planet and GOD's creation.

When we love GOD's planet the planet loves us right back.

Children love to learn about energy and how it works, the sheer power and recognition of GOD's good works. From experience this can really help strengthen their relationship with GOD and all creation.

being love

Kim xx
 
Dear Basstian

Maybe if you taught your children how important it is to conserve GOD's energy for the most important things in life, they might appreciate and value the wastage of energy, and its importance to the smooth running of the planet and GOD's creation.

When we love GOD's planet the planet loves us right back.

Children love to learn about energy and how it works, the sheer power and recognition of GOD's good works. From experience this can really help strengthen their relationship with GOD and all creation.

being love

Kim xx
I think you missed the point :D
Until we mature we look at simple rules that work only for our benefit in a negative light. When we mature in Christ theses rules no longer become a burden but further evidence of a loving Father who truely cares about our well being.
If I can get my Children to learn that I will Have Done well.
 
Dear Basstian

Well I am probably speaking at a tangent again but GOD as taught me that it is all very simple indeed and it is man that makes it complicated.

'Parents are the guardians of the soul, it is the guardians responsibility to ensure that gem is not reshaped but allowed to be its natural state'

Equality for all, I look forward to the day when humanity honours children as equals instead of inferior beings that have no wisdom. As Jesus said 'Let the children come to me'.

Love beyond measure

Kim xx
 
Here is what Leo Tolstoy, in The Kingdom of God Is within You, has to say about this subject:


The animal existence of a man does not constitute human life alone. Life, according to the will of God only, is also not human life. Human life is a combination of the animal life and the divine life. And the more this combination approaches to the divine life, the more life there is in it.

Life, according to the Christian religion, is a progress toward the divine perfection. No one condition, according to this doctrine, can be higher or lower than another. Every condition, according to this doctrine, is only a particular stage, of no consequence in itself, on the way toward unattainable perfection, and therefore in itself it does not imply a greater or lesser degree of life. Increase of life, according to this, consists in nothing but the quickening of the progress toward perfection. And therefore the progress toward perfection of the publican Zaccheus, of the woman that was a sinner, and of the robber on the cross, implies a higher degree of life than the stagnant righteousness of the Pharisee. And therefore for this religion there cannot be rules which it is obligatory to obey. The man who is at a lower level but is moving onward toward perfection is living a more moral, a better life, is more fully carrying out Christ's teaching, than the man on a much higher level of morality who is not moving onward toward perfection.

It is in this sense that the lost sheep is dearer to the Father than those that were not lost. The prodigal son, the piece of money lost and found again, were more precious than those that were not lost.

The fulfillment of Christ's teaching consists in moving away from self toward God. It is obvious that there cannot be definite laws and rules for this fulfillment of the teaching. Every degree of perfection and every degree of imperfection are equal in it; no obedience to laws constitutes a fulfillment of this doctrine, and therefore for it there can be no binding rules and laws.

From this fundamental distinction between the religion of Christ and all preceding religions based on the state conception of life, follows a corresponding difference in the special precepts of the state theory and the Christian precepts. The precepts of the state theory of life insist for the most part on certain practical prescribed acts, by which men are justified and secure of being right. The Christian precepts (the commandment of love is not a precept in the strict sense of the word, but the expression of the very essence of the religion) are the five commandments of the Sermon on the Mount--all negative in character. They show only what at a certain stage of development of humanity men may not do.

These commandments are, as it were, signposts on the endless road to perfection, toward which humanity is moving, showing the point of perfection which is possible at a certain period in the development of humanity.

Christ has given expression in the Sermon on the Mount to the eternal ideal toward which men are spontaneously struggling, and also the degree of attainment of it to which men may reach in our times.

The ideal is not to desire to do ill to anyone, not to provoke ill will, to love all men. The precept, showing the level below which we cannot fall in the attainment of this ideal, is the prohibition of evil speaking. And that is the first command.

The ideal is perfect chastity, even in thought. The precept, showing the level below which we cannot fall in the attainment of this ideal, is that of purity of married life, avoidance of debauchery. That is the second command.

The ideal is to take no thought for the future, to live in the present moment. The precept, showing the level below which we cannot fall, is the prohibition of swearing, of promising anything in the future. And that is the third command.

The ideal is never for any purpose to use force. The precept, showing the level below which we cannot fall is that of returning good for evil, being patient under wrong, giving the cloak also. That is the fourth command.

The ideal is to love the enemies who hate us. The precept, showing the level below which we cannot fall, is not to do evil to our enemies, to speak well of them, and to make no difference between them and our neighbors. (fifth command)

All these precepts are indications of what, on our journey to perfection, we are already fully able to avoid, and what we must labor to attain now, and what we ought by degrees to translate into instinctive and unconscious habits. But these precepts, far from constituting the whole of Christ's teaching and exhausting it, are simply stages on the way to perfection. These precepts must and will be followed by higher and higher precepts on the way to the perfection held up by the religion.

And therefore it is essentially a part of the Christian religion to make demands higher than those expressed in its precepts; and by no means to diminish the demands either of the ideal itself, or of the precepts, as people imagine who judge it from the standpoint of the social conception of life.

A bit later on he elaborates on the distinction between our lower, animal self, and our higher, divine self, God in us. Our life is a stuggle to move as much possible from the lower self (which I always think of as our ego self) to the higher self (life in Christ). We die to self and live in Christ.

The difference between the Christian doctrine and those which preceded it is that the social doctrine said: "Live in opposition to your nature [understanding by this only the animal nature], make it subject to the external law of family, society, and state." Christianity says: "Live according to your nature [understanding by this the divine nature]; do not make it subject to anything--neither you (an animal self) nor that of others--and you will attain the very aim to which you are striving when you subject your external self."

The Christian doctrine brings a man to the elementary consciousness of self, only not of the animal self, but of the divine self, the divine spark, the self as the Son of God, as much God as the Father himself, though confined in an animal husk. The consciousness of being the Son of God, whose chief characteristic is love, satisfies the need for the extension of the sphere of love to which the man of the social conception of life had been brought. For the latter, the welfare of the personality demanded an ever-widening extension of the sphere of love; love was a necessity and was confined to certain objects--self, family, society. With the Christian conception of life, love is not a necessity and is confined to no object; it is the essential faculty of the human soul. Man loves not because it is his interest to love this or that, but because love is the essence of his soul, because he cannot but love.

The Christian doctrine shows man that the essence of his soul is love--that his happiness depends not on loving this or that object, but on loving the principle of the whole--God, whom he recognizes within himself as love, and therefore he loves all things and all men.

Sorry this is so long. I know we are not supposed to post big blocks, but I think this, with my highlights and brief comments, is pertinent to the topic. Plus, how could I ever say it better than Tolstoy. :)

Peace,
lunamoth
 
lunamoth said:
Here is what Leo Tolstoy, in The Kingdom of God Is within You, has to say about this subject:




A bit later on he elaborates on the distinction between our lower, animal self, and our higher, divine self, God in us. Our life is a stuggle to move as much possible from the lower self (which I always think of as our ego self) to the higher self (life in Christ). We die to self and live in Christ.



Sorry this is so long. I know we are not supposed to post big blocks, but I think this, with my highlights and brief comments, is pertinent to the topic. Plus, how could I ever say it better than Tolstoy. :)

Peace,
lunamoth
Вы смогли поговорить их, на русском языке...:D

"Vwee smoglee pogovareet ichx, na russkom yazeekye"

(you could talk about it, in Russian)

Sorry, I couldn't resist that one.

I do agree, that we must get past our own ego, if we want to see the wonder of God.

I like Lev NikolayevichTolstoy as well...

v/r

Q
 
Dear Lunamoth

Thank you for sharing Tolstoy expresses the divinity of the soul beautifully.

Dear Q

EGO Expressing GOD's Omnipotence

I will start a different thread on this as I cannot share the full story on this forum. But GOD certainly as a different view on EGO which at the time I found shocking, stunning, enlightening, humourous and very loving.

Arise!

Glory be to GOD

Kimxx
 
This is also interesting bearing in mind all of the conversations we have been having recently.

Rev:21:4 NIV He will wipe every tear from their eyes. There will be no more death or mourning, or crying or pain, for the old order of things has passed away". 4 He who was seated on the throne said:

I am making everything new! (That includes the law) Write this down, for these words are trustworthy and true."

Onwards and upwards through the eye of the needle into the Kingdom of Love.

being love

Kim xx
 
Isa 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
Isa 66:23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.

Humm the I see the 4th commandment ?????

Wonder if thou shalt not Kill will be there too?

GOD DOESNT CHANGE!!!
 
Basstian said:
Isa 66:22 For as the new heavens and the new earth, which I will make, shall remain before me, saith the LORD, so shall your seed and your name remain.
Isa 66:23 And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the LORD.

Humm the I see the 4th commandment ?????

Wonder if thou shalt not Kill will be there too?

GOD DOESNT CHANGE!!!

Hi Basstian,

What I see in the verse above is a state of continuous worship, where every thought, word and deed 24/7 praises God. :)

Have a good day!
peace,
lunamoth
 
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lunamoth said:
Hi Basstian,

What I see in the verse above is a state of continuous worship, where every thought, word and deed 24/7 praises God. :)

Have a good day!
peace,
lunamoth
Hmmm, reminds me of a story my parents told me about heaven. Music, singing and praises fill the air before the throne, for every 23 and 1/2 hours of a solar day, followed by 1/2 hour of silence. Also before the throne are two choirs, that of the Angels, and that of Man. While the Angels sing, Man will be brought to tears at the beauty, power, and wonderment of the sound of the Angels profession that God is eternal. And when Men sing, the Angels will be in awe and astoundment of the song of salvation the voices of men will proclaim, for salvation is the one thing the Angels cannot comprehend...

I think that fits in nicely with Isa 66:23 .

v/r

Q
 
SacredStar said:
Woe betide people that do not honour GOD's creation and continue to destroy the earth, for its states in the bible those that destroy the earth will themselves be destroyed.
ScaredStar said:
IME it is only man that judges and it is man that wrote the words above for they are not inspired with love and GOD's grace.
:D
Hey Luna & Q

I believe we will be in continuous worship But just the fact that God mentions the Sabbath in this verse also supports that when He says something is forever and He says he will not change and He says His promises are true and faithful He can be trusted to keep his word.
I dont want to serve a God that might change His mind at anytime I like the fact that what I read has stood from the beginning and will stand forever because that is what God said I can build faith on this. I see a just loving God who remains true even when I dont.

Sacred Star you do away with the Law in one thread say God wouldnt judge punish and all the other negative things you attribute to the law and the Bible.
Than when it fits your Mythical Spiritualist Doctrine throw everything you have preached out the window in one quote. This is the kind of mind changing I dont believe God does and this is why I trust His Word ONLY
 
Basstian said:
:D

Sacred Star you do away with the Law in one thread say God wouldnt judge punish and all the other negative things you attribute to the law and the Bible.
Than when it fits your Mythical Spiritualist Doctrine throw everything you have preached out the window in one quote. This is the kind of mind changing I dont believe God does and this is why I trust His Word ONLY
I'm not sure I'd put Sacred away (her thoughts) immediately...as Jesus is her ground, or rod, of that I have no doubt...

Patience is in order here. Let us find out the truth.

v/r

Q
 
well said Q
I must say that looked alot like an attack and it was not intended that way. I apologize

My point is that we as men have a tendancy to daily forget what we have said inadvertantly go back on our word, change our minds or just be flat wrong and stubborn about it only to agree on the same issue at a later time.

I dont believe God has this type of flaw. I wish I didnt

One of the things that really makes me trust Jesus so much is that although He went against the legalism of the scribes and others He never Did go against anything of God. Showing He truely was one with the father and one we can trust to be just as steady through the ages as the Father.

Thats why I believe like the question at the beginning of this thread the Commandments mentioned in Rev. are the same as Exodus.
and I have to believe God and Jesus the same Yesterday Today and Forever.
and that they Change NOT.

I wont dismiss the person or their faith but I will fervently dismiss any teaching that goes against that.
 
Well GOD clearly states in the bible he will make everything new and the old heaven and the old earth will pass away.

Many people live in fear of this statement but yet we can reassure people by informing them in reality it is only our perceptions of reality that will indeed change in line with the evolution of the soul and consciousness.


New means different and it also means change. The planet does not the stay the same, humans do not stay the same we are in continual growth, development and evolution, it is when we are not willing to change that people get stuck and begin to create disease.

Now GOD says he made us in his image and so it is if we change it makes common sense that GOD does too for even GOD is part of the the consciousness that GOD created.

I have pondering a lot these last few days on how much the OT bible prophecies that are all about the middle east have had such a huge impact on the rest of the world but yet they are talking about specific people's, times, times and places and cities.

I would be interested in your view of this?

I know myself when I receive prophecy it is made very clear when it is for one person, one country or for all of humanity but yet the majority of the bible is also very clear most is concentrated on the middle east. This might be worth dedicating to a discussion on a different thread.


Hmm....

and yes Q you are right again Jesus as been my rock, the one that I have been able to lean upon, the one that showed me the way to salvation and GOD is my foundation of Christ Consciousness. And I agree with GOD no human can ever make me feel the way GOD makes me feel, human love just cannot compare.

Love beyond measure

Kim xx
 
Sorry Q I tried :(


SacredStar how can you with any logic say the Bible Clearly States anything than turn around and clearly state things that go directly against what the Bible Says.

It would be better for you to Claim Jesus but completely denounce the Bible than to use it in such a manner as this. You cant pick and choose like this and doing so only serves to make you look double-sided. Your riding a fence ,walking in the middle of the road, lukewarm.

I really feel sorry for you in this. As confusing as your doctrine looks to me. I am sure reading the truth of Gods word and seeing how it goes against what your mind is telling you and what it seems you desperately want it to say must be very disheartening for you.

I wonder sometimes if something so terrible has happened in your past that has left you with negative view of Love and Law combined or Justice and Judgement. Something so bad that you as an adult will refuse to see evil not because it isnt there but because you live in denial never wanting to accept its presence. If so I apologize for being so harsh.
But if you are preaching these things that go so directly against God and His word with the intent to lead others astray for profit or personal gain than God Himself will be your judge. The Bible says that too.

The Bible Says - Jesus the Same Yesterday Today and Forever.
Do you believe this?
The Bible says - I am the Lord I Change Not.
Do you believe this
The Bible says - My covenant will I not Break Nor alter a thing that has gone out of my lips.
Do you Believe this?

There will be a New Heaven and A New Earth.
God will make all things New
But His word endureth forever
IT will be the Same God It Will Be the same truth. The same Jesus

I pray that you will see this as truth. And that it will Light your way in the future.
 
Dear Basstian

You and others make so many assumptions about my truth but you do not know what my truth is for I have no doctrines, I love to share and discuss the bible and other religious texts. It is all part of sharing, and sharing is part of community and through sharing people come to better understand each other. But we cannot understand each other if you assume what is my truth and what I honour from your own perceptions of me, because your perceptions are not my reality no more then my perceptions are your reality for all is an illusion.

My truth changes daily because I evolve daily, change is the only constant, I am continually growing, developing and being one with the source. I love the adventure and being experiential with GOD so nothing from the past can hold me, anything other then my respect. For the past is gone, the future is an illusion the gift from GOD is the PRESENT moment for that is all that there is.

I honour all scripture and texts not just Christian but others too and find them fascinating both historically and spiritually, it is pure joy to compare and find the overlaps and similiarities, the core beauty and essence of GOD can be found everywhere in every flower, every seed and every religion.

Born and Baptised a Christian (mother a sunday school teacher) and also introduced to the Christian Spiritualists by my parents so I grew up with a natural acceptance of karma and life after death, my view is expansive and never restricted by limitation or boundary because Jesus as taught me there is no boundaries to love.

I love Buddhists and Muslims I guess you could say that I am interfaith and multi-faith. Jesus as shown me the way he wishes me to be and it is joyful for me to be with him in oneness moving forward into unity consciousness embracing all religions, peoples and cultures.

I honour your beliefs and all that you hold dear within your heart, I wish not to change anything about you, all I ask of anyone is that they honour every individual's right to choose, their individuality and uniqueness too.

Just because I post something does not necessary mean I hold it dear, I am just sharing a view for discussion.

For me strict beliefs would keep me stuck on a buoy and if I was on a buoy I could not embrace, surrender completely and fly in the arms of GOD. Because GOD continually challenges me to grow, rise and ascend higher in the love of GOD and to share that love and treasure with others.

The evidence of our experience is the treasure we have to share. it is the love, light and life I AM but yet I appreciate that others do not live as I do and do not necessarily wish to either, and thats fine for each have their own journey of discovery and relationship with GOD of which I honour totally.

What I hold dear is that every man, women and child have their own direct relationship with GOD and the holy spirit with no need/necessity for intermediaries, priests, guru's or spiritual teachers.

The sacred union with the divine.

Does that make sense to you?

Love beyond measure

Kim xx
 
Ok Sacred I see where your coming from I respect that but also remind you that God is not the Author of Confusion. The truth changing daily is something I would have a hard time building faith on. I was reminded as I read that post of a bit of scripture you also like Matthew.

Mt 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mt 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mt 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Mt 7:24 Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock:
Mt 7:25 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock.
Mt 7:26 And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:
Mt 7:27 And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.
Mt 7:28 And it came to pass, when Jesus had ended these sayings, the people were astonished at his doctrine:
Mt 7:29 For he taught them as one having authority, and not as the scribes.

Doctrine is not a bad thing. When it is Rock Solid it has the power to astound people. I ask where is your House is built? With truth changing daily carried by every wind of strange doctrine that blows.
I am amazed at the amount of faith it takes to believe some of the things you have posted. And I wonder if you ever did become anchored by the solid rock of Gods word how astonished people would be and what a powerful tool you would become within Gods people.

SS You have great potential great intellect and faith that could indeed move mountians. I respect you as a person and you may or may not care about my views. But in my view you need to look for the lighthouse and drop anchor drifting ships are sometimes refered to as lost.

God Bless
 
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