Visions of Hell

[NewAgeNerd]

As a Jew, I am totally unfamiliar with the Christian conception of Hell. Christianity happens to be the one religion I skipped out on during my spirtual cycle. In any case, I was hoping to get some clarification on this issue.

1) Do most Christians feel that Hell is a real place?
2) If so, what is the story behind it(its creation, etc)?
3) Where is it located?
4) Who controls it and how absolute is his power?
5) What is his power on earth?
6) Who goes there?

Thats quite a number of questions, but I am trying to get a real sense of this thing known as hell.

 

[didymus]

NAN, I don't know a whole lot about the origins of hell. I do know that it is not just a christian beleif and the christians adopted it from somewhere else. Possibly Greek and Egyptian beliefs.

As far as I know the concept of the devil is attributed to Zoroastrianism. This definitely had an impact on Christianity. As you study you'll find there isn't much in christianity that didn't exist in one form or another in other religions and cultures previously.

 

[Bandit]

Hello Newage . I took about an hour and pulled some of this together for you. I think it is more complex than we will ever know in the flesh. I cannot say it is a vision for sure, but more or less, there is something to a subtle understanding of it all. This is one of my least favorite topics, but I also have not ignored it. A small portion of my reply was pulled from another site with a link for reference I hope this helps a little bit.

Do most Christians feel that Hell is a real place?
I think so at least I do. It can be a condition on earth also, just as heaven can be a condition on earth. The Old Testament seems to be types and shadows of this such as bondage and freedom. The New Testament brings a little more light on the subject.

There are some pockets of people claiming it does not exist. But some of them are the same who claim evil, sin, fallen angels, repentance and judgment do not exist.

1 John 3:8
8. He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.

If so, what is the story behind it (its creation, etc)?

From what I can see there are 3 certain definitions.

Hell the pit and natural grave.

Hell/ Hades a place of departed souls.

Hell the place after judgment also known as the second death in Revelations.

While there is no literal expounded teaching on this outside of the sheol physical grave or Haides in the OT, there is also no literal expounded teaching on eternal life that I am aware of. So I am seeing parallels of that which is earthly in the OT and that which is spiritual in the NT..

While the Holy Land Cana was a type of promise of heaven which was acquired through faith and tribulation, Egypt was a type of bondage, hell with no escape except for that which God delivered them through His might power.
I think Job offers some understanding on this sheol, however they seem to be more or less in reference to himself. It seems sheol refers to the pit and grave as two different places, with divided territory, depending on where it is used. Some say 7 up and seven down.
It seems to be used in the sense of God anger at times where an earthquake or earth opens and closes swallowing the disobedient.





Where is it located?

I don’t know. Some suggest the center of the earth due to the nature of scripture in description. I don’t think it is in terms of literal fire as in liquid melting heat that scorches the flesh, rather in a spiritual sense of being scorched from the presence of God and this would be a dark and lonely state of being. But the center of earth is most likely. How permanent in duration , I cannot say.

All signs of hell in the OT and NT point toward a downward, lower, enclosed state. The signs of heaven point toward an upward, outward, free state. Sometimes there appears to be different compartments.

Matt 25:41
41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: (Jesus speaking)

You will also find scripture with the goats on the left and the sheep on the right, so there is a seperation there to consider.




1. Genesis 37:35 And all his sons and all his daughters rose up to comfort him; but he refused to be comforted; and he said, For I will go down into the grave <07585> unto my son mourning. Thus his father wept for him.

This verse tells us in which direction to look for sheol; it is located down.



2. Genesis 42:38 And he said, My son shall not go down with you; for his brother is dead, and he is left alone: if mischief befall him by the way in the which ye go, then shall ye bring down my gray hairs with sorrow to the grave <07585>.



3. Genesis 44:29 And if ye take this also from me, and mischief befall him, ye shall bring down my gray hairs with sorrow to the grave <07585>.



4. Genesis 44:31 It shall come to pass, when he seeth that the lad is not with us, that he will die: and thy servants shall bring down the gray hairs of thy servant our father with sorrow to the grave <07585>.



5. Numbers 16:30 But if the LORD make a new thing, and the earth open her mouth, and swallow them up, with all that appertain unto them, and they go down quick into the pit <07585>; then ye shall understand that these men have provoked the LORD.



6. Numbers 16:33 They, and all that appertained to them, went down alive into the pit <07585>, and the earth closed upon them: and they perished from among the congregation.

Here we see that some went down to sheol that were still alive.



7. Deuteronomy 32:22 For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell <07585>, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains.

Sheol is divided into different parts. To get to the lowest you must go through other compartments.



8. 1 Samuel 2:6 The LORD killeth, and maketh alive: he bringeth down to the grave <07585>, and bringeth up.

There is traffic both ways in sheol.



9. 2 Samuel 22:6 The sorrows of hell <07585> compassed me about; the snares of death prevented me;






Who controls it and how absolute is his power?

God has all absolute power yet will allow all to choose. This is tricky because it gets into the creation of angels and how they fell. I believe the angels were created with free will. It seems Lucifer and fallen angels are being squeezed into a tighter and smaller space, within the dispensations, where there power and freedom is less and less, and becoming more limited.




What is his power on earth?

If you are thinking of it in the sense that Lucifer controls it with a pitchfork, I don’t think so. The one true God controls everything while He seems to allow both good and evil to be present at the same time. I believe the day will come when there they will be separated completely and only good will prevail and all that is undgodly will be destroyed.

It seems in Gen 1 the first part of creation seems to be a distinct separate creation from that of the days in which man and animals are mentioned. Where he divides light from darkness is more apt to mean where he divided good from evil (angels, which we know God did make them, but they were all created good) rather than literal light from darkness. It was the forth day of a later description of creation we see literal light(s)

At the present time I do believe the devil does have power on earth, but no more power than what God will allow him and only what we will allow him to have in our lives. I also feel without God in our lives and that hedge of love about us through obedience, the devil can have complete access and influence over us without us realizing it.




Who goes there?

Revelations8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.



Brimstone has something to do with volcano. Figuratively it supposed to represent punishment.





Peter2:4 For if God sparednot the angels that sinned, but cast them down to hell, and delivered them into chains of darkness, to be reserved unto judgment; (KJV)

Jude 1:6
6 And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day. (KJV)

Rev 12:9
9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him. (KJV)



sorry for the mispellings, this is a very long, dreadful topic

 

[Bandit]

"How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! [how] art thou cut down to the ground, which didst weaken the nations! For thou hast said in thine heart, I will ascend into heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God: I will sit also upon the mount of the congregation, in the sides of the north: I will ascend above the heights of the clouds; I will be like the most High. Yet thou shalt be brought down to hell, to the sides of the pit. They that see thee shall narrowly look upon thee, [and] consider thee, [saying, Is] this the man that made the earth to tremble, that did shake kingdoms;"
Isaiah 14:12-16

"Thou hast been in Eden the garden of God; every precious stone [was] thy covering, the sardius, topaz, and the diamond, the beryl, the onyx, and the jasper, the sapphire, the emerald, and the carbuncle, and gold: the workmanship of thy tabrets and of thy pipes was prepared in thee in the day that thou wast created. Thou [art] the anointed cherub that covereth; and I have set thee [so]: thou wast upon the holy mountain of God; thou hast walked up and down in the midst of the stones of fire. Thou [wast] perfect in thy ways from the day that thou wast created, till iniquity was found in thee. By the multitude of thy merchandise they have filled the midst of thee with violence, and thou hast sinned: therefore I will cast thee as profane out of the mountain of God: and I will destroy thee, O covering cherub, from the midst of the stones of fire. Thine heart was lifted up because of thy beauty, thou hast corrupted thy wisdom by reason of thy brightness: I will cast thee to the ground, I will lay thee before kings, that they may behold thee."
Ezekiel 28:13-17


For better understanding, There are about 20 different words and phrases to consider in proper context (outside of the word hell, sheol ) death, torment, damnation, second death, punishment, sin, judgment etc. Everlasting and Eternal can also have a limited or indefinite period of time. It is also important to keep the order of events in perspective. I am estimating about 150 scriptures between the OT and NT. I am also thinking that rather than an eternal (without end) state of punishment, God would be able to destroy what He makes as easily as He creates it, that is of course if we understand that God does indeed have all power and authority, this applying to those who hate, spread mischief and greed, relish in disobedience etc. or feel they can rise above God, which was the original disobedience of Lucifer. This appears to be more of the way God operates toward those who will forever blaspheme Him. Instead of using a garbage can with a lid and literal fire, destroy them completely and take them out of existence and they can no longer influence or posess any potential deceit or bondage of sin. Similiar to the earthly destruction and death of Pharaos army in the Red Sea after the 10th attempt and God hardened Pharoas heart but he would not stop. (this is just one way I see it)

It is a rather complex, involved study NewAgeNerd. I feel it cannot be answered completely but only understood in part and over time.
Rest assured God has made a way of escape for those who love Him and keep His commandments, remaining faithful to the end.
A couple of links I found interesting:


http://philologos.org/bpr/files/s019.htm
http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&rls=GGLD,GGLD:2004-31,GGLD:en&oi=defmore&q=define:Sheol

 

[JJM]

As a Jew, I am totally unfamiliar with the Christian conception of Hell. Christianity happens to be the one religion I skipped out on during my spirtual cycle. In any case, I was hoping to get some clarification on this issue.

1) Do most Christians feel that Hell is a real place?

Hell is a state of complete separation from God. So if this takes place somewhere then that place is Hell.

2) If so, what is the story behind it(its creation, etc)?

As far as Christians are concerned it is the place of the unrighteous dead Jesus spoke of. In the OT the righteous went to Sheol and the unrighteous went to hell. Now those who would have went to Sheol can go to heaven but those who refuse to accept the gift God wants to give them go to Hell.

3) Where is it located?

This is unimportant

4) Who controls it and how absolute is his power?

God controls all. However the people here are those who have cut themselves off from God.

5) What is his power on earth?

I guess your looking for Satan here but he is simply the leader of those who have rejected God and his plan. Umm like any demon he has the ability to tempt people when God allows.

6) Who goes there?

Those who reject God.

 

[Basstian]

I think I will just give you my views as a Christian I feel that is more what you are looking for rather than scripture from a Bible you dont use

1) Do most Christians feel that Hell is a real place?
I am not most Christians I feel hell is a spiritual place but not really one to torment people for being Bad etc.
2) If so, what is the story behind it(its creation, etc)?
I see it more like a storage place for evil till it is destroyed at the final judgment Soloman said the dead know nothing
3) Where is it located?
Where is Heaven? I cant answer that either I dont think you have to to believe.
4) Who controls it and how absolute is his power?
A red guy with horns and a fork type tail...No! Satan was castdown to earth is called prince of this world He is not in control of anything other than the evil he creates here. God would be in control of all.
5) What is his power on earth? Answered last question
6) Who goes there? I see in the last book of our bible that the sea and the grave and hell gave up thier dead to be judged and whoever is not in the lambs book of life will be cast into a lake of fire and destroyed hell will also be cast into the lake of fire thus ending all evil from before God.

We as Christian serve a merciful God alot of times that is forgotten. My general take is that the end result will be those who dont accept God will be snuffed out of existence I see in revelations the dead being judged. If they truely know nothing than they dont know pain. Some teahers in our faith take the hell thing to far in order to scare people into believing alot of mythical/pagen influence on the devil along with good old holywood knowhow give him way more credit than he really gets in the bible. I dont believe the Bible is God -vs- Satan but rather God -vs- evil.
The absolute truth is like heaven we will have to wait and see how it all works. I just know my belief in Christ keeps me from having to worry that much about it.
Read chapter 20 of Revelations if you get a chance.

 

[Sacredstar]

Dear NewAgeNerd

Well there is a broad range of belief within Christianity. I agree with the Pope and other liberal Christians that say that heaven and hell are within especially as all is one in group and universal consciousness.

There was a time when I thought earth was hell until I discovered that we humans create our own hell and that is not necessary anything to do with GOD or being seperated from GOD. Our own negative thoughts, judgements and prejudice can take us to hell because all negativity is darkness. Mental health patients and people with severe depression describe it as the black hole, a place with no light. A pit that one falls down into.

If we read Genesis and what GOD created it does not mention hell. But it does say GOD said Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night: and let them be for signs and seasons, and for days and years. And GOD made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night:

So GOD created light and lesser light but no darkness as such, darkness is a manifestation of man's dark thoughts. If we look at the original translations of hate and evil we find the same, hate means to love less and evil means less good. There is a mention about Dante's influence on Hell/Purgatory on the GOD thread in the alternative forum.

So we have a choice hell or heaven on earth.

blessings in abundance

Kim xx

 

[Marsh]

Are you sure about this, JJM? To the best of my knowledge Hell is never mentioned-- literally at least-- in the OT. Jesus' sermon on the mountain is the first time that Hell is referred to, isn't it?

I'm actually in the midst of writing an essay about the afterlife as depicted in the Bible, and what I'm finding is that traditional theology has simplified the afterlife into a Heaven-Hell dilemma, but this dualistic approach is not consistent with the Bible which refers to (by my interpretation) at least four completely different possibilities as to what can happen to a human soul after the first death.

In regards to your question, NAN, I think that the concept of Hell that most Christians believe in is the Lake of Fire that is depicted in the Revelation of Jesus Christ. This is a place that is described as the second death, which in my opinion means that it is where God sends souls that he wants to uncreate. Sort of a spiritual garbage dump. And God, rather than Satan, is in control of it; that Satan rules over Hell is a big misconception in my opinion.

As for who goes there, that isn't up to me to decide so I can't tell you. But I can tell you who definitely doesn't go there, and that's anyone who puts their faith in Jesus as saviour (i.e. That Jesus is able to forgive us of our sins, make us clean, and hence unsuitable to be destroyed).

 

[JJM]

Are you sure about this, JJM? To the best of my knowledge Hell is never mentioned-- literally at least-- in the OT. Jesus' sermon on the mountain is the first time that Hell is referred to, isn't it?

No hell isn't explicitly mentioned in the OT (scripture) I meant the OT as the old covenant before the Salvation of Christ. Kind of like how John the Baptist isn't mentioned in the OT but he is a last of the OT prophets the distinction between Sheol and Hell is made in the parable of the Rich Man and Lazarus Luke 16:19-31

I'm actually in the midst of writing an essay about the afterlife as depicted in the Bible, and what I'm finding is that traditional theology has simplified the afterlife into a Heaven-Hell dilemma, but this dualistic approach is not consistent with the Bible which refers to (by my interpretation) at least four completely different possibilities as to what can happen to a human soul after the first death.

can I read it when you’re done that sounds interesting.

 

[faithfull]

As a Jew, I am totally unfamiliar with the Christian conception of Hell. Christianity happens to be the one religion I skipped out on during my spirtual cycle. In any case, I was hoping to get some clarification on this issue.

1) Do most Christians feel that Hell is a real place?
2) If so, what is the story behind it(its creation, etc)?
3) Where is it located?
4) Who controls it and how absolute is his power?
5) What is his power on earth?
6) Who goes there?

Thats quite a number of questions, but I am trying to get a real sense of this thing known as hell.

Dear Friend,
There are many different degrees of glory we will put our selves in according to how we have lived our lives on this earth. Our father loves us so much that he is even going to put us in one of his kingdoms. But we should ultimatley try to make it back to him which is the Celestial Kingdom. In the end the only ones that end up in outer darkness (hell) are those who had a perfect knowledge of the Savior and then denied him. We may go through personal hell when we do something wrong and we feel great sorrow for it. Also when we die and wait for the resurrection depending on how we have lived our life here we will go to certain places in the spirit world to learn more while we are waiting for the resurrection. It explains below.
THE GOSPEL ACCORDING TO
ST JOHN

CHAPTER 14Jesus speaks of many mansions; says he is the way, the truth, and the life; that to see him is to see the Father—He promises the first and second Comforters.

document.write(drawVerse(1,85373));1&nbsp1 LET not your heart be atroubled•: ye believe in God, believe also in me.

document.write(drawVerse(2,85374));2&nbsp2 In my Father’s ahouse are many bmansions•: if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you.

document.write(drawVerse(3,85375));3&nbsp3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will acome• again, and receive you unto myself; that bwhere• cI• am, there ye may be also.

document.write(drawVerse(4,85376));4&nbsp4 And whither I go ye know, and the way ye know.

THE FIRST EPISTLE OF PAUL THE APOSTLE TO THE
CORINTHIANS

CHAPTER 15Christ died for our sins—He rose from the dead and was seen by many—All men will be resurrected—Paul speaks of baptism for the dead—The three degrees of glory—Victory over death comes through Christ.


40&nbsp40 aThere• are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the bcelestial is one, and the glory of the cterrestrial is another.

document.write(drawVerse(41,93636));41&nbsp41 There is one glory of the asun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the bstars: for one star cdiffereth• from another star in dglory
THE GOSPEL ACCORDING TO
ST JOHN

CHAPTER 1712&nbsp12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and anone• of them is blost•, but the son of cperdition•; that the scripture might be fulfilled.