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Faithfulservant said:
There are other ways to get meat than from a grocery store...Most people do not own guns to shoot people despite opinions from anti-gun people.
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Certainly this is true of rifles, but what purpose does a handgun have other than killing people?


Faithfulservant said:
You give two people a gun.. one person knows gun safety the other one doesnt.. which do you trust more to handle it.
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I simply wouldnt give anyone a gun

Faithfulservant said:
Its the same with driving a car.. one person was taught how to drive the other one wasnt... which do you trust more to drive it.
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The person who was taught to drive, of course, but cars have a purpose other than killing.

Bandit said:
some of my friends & everyone in my family owns a gun & so do I. i do not shoot people.
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(working on the assumption that you are talking about handguns)
Why do you own guns then?
 
Awaiting_the_fifth said:
Certainly this is true of rifles, but what purpose does a handgun have other than killing people?


I simply wouldnt give anyone a gun

The person who was taught to drive, of course, but cars have a purpose other than killing.

(working on the assumption that you are talking about handguns)
Why do you own guns then?
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Apples. I like to shoot juicy apples. I place big shiny red apples on top of peoples heads while they balance them, then at about 15-20 yards make a clear shot & blow the apple off the top. Now I could use my bow & arrow or sling shot, if you prefer no guns, but it takes longer to load.:D :D :D

BTW- cars are most definately used today to kill people quite often & on purpose. Just like bare hands & bare feet can be a deadly weapon & you have a much better chance of killing someone with a rifle/shotgun than a hand gun. But i dont shoot people, & one of them is from my redneck Grandpa after he passed away.

once again, this combat for christ is not about shooting people & hurting people & creating war, it is about spiritual warfare & the full armor of God, which in reality has nothing to do with physical weapons. but it appears only bible believers will understand this.
 
Bandit said:
once again, this combat for christ is not about shooting people & hurting people & creating war, it is about spiritual warfare & the full armor of God, which in reality has nothing to do with physical weapons. but it appears only bible believers will understand this.
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ah... sort of like Jihad.

interesting...
 
I would NOT send a child there. If I felt my children needed to learn how to use guns, I would take them to an instructor and I would be present at all times. And I would not mind if that instructor happened to be a Christian, but this is backwards.

If I send my children to a Christian church camp, I expect the "weapon" they will be taught to use against the enemy (Satan) to be God's Word.

There is something quirky about this, in my opinion--there is just too much emphasis on firearms. And I agree with Faithfulservant on this one--the firearms course description is enough for me to keep my kids and grandkids away. If they want to join the military someday, or learn law enforcement, then that is something they can do when the time comes.

To me, this seems highly irregular for a missionary Baptist church. I am pretty familiar with Baptist "stuff" and this just doesn't sound right to me--although it is getting harder and harder to know what people will do "in Jesus' name."

By the way, where did you say the "teacup" camp was?:)

InPeace,
InLove
 
I guess I would feel better about sending my children to a camp where they would learn military tactics and has church during the night time to balance it out instead of a military tactic camp that uses Ephesians 6 as a head starter (which really doesn't appear to be the case).

But one thing's for sure, I don't live in that area of the country, which seems to think quite differently than city folk do. That camp couldn't thrive here in Southern California because we don't use guns like people out in rural areas do. In the rural areas of the U.S., it's a major accomplishment to graduate high school and go straight into a military career. In the cities, a military career is an option if you can't cut it doing anything else. My point is, while my city thinking doesn't agree, the camp may be very productive activity for rural area children and the religion aspect may be very enticing to the parents.
 
it sounds like the 'MOM' coming out in some of the ladies:) . Moms never were real crazy about guns & stuff. My son was not even aloud to have a squirt gun or darts growing up.

I know my church would not use any weapons for any of this, not even a sword matched up with the bible. On the other hand, I would rather see them learn about it in safety, than later with the street gangs or problem kids in school, in a bad way. You guys are right, there is no reason for guns in any of this.

There is a Community Baptist around here that always has real way out outings. I had a friend from school who went there & when I went on the church trips with him, they were a blast!
 
Vajradhara said:
ah... sort of like Jihad.

interesting...
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No, not even like that. It is all about spirit & in the spirit & learning how to walk in spirit, through faith & prayer & peace & studying the bible for victory in spirit through Jesus etc... where all you have to do is stand & God fights for us:) . kind of hard to explain. I think it is learned over time.

No raids, military action or Holy Wars or literal COMBAT.

hard telling what some people are thinking today in all religions.. i think some keep crossing the line between flesh & spirit w/o even realizing it.
 
Hi all!

Peace--

Well, I come from a long line of rural folks, and know a lot about that life, even though I don't live in the country now. Yup--got children and grandchildren, and as I said, I am pretty "well-versed" (pun intended) in the theology and practices of different kinds of Baptist churches. Know what else? I can shoot a fly off a can on a fencepost 20 yards away!:) :) :) (Okay, maybe I'm not that good.)

But I still say there is something wierd about that camp idea. Maybe nothing inherently evil, but terribly unwise, somehow.

InPeace,
InLove
 
Namaste Bandit,

thank you for the post.

Bandit said:
No, not even like that. It is all about spirit & in the spirit & learning how to walk in spirit, through faith & prayer & peace & studying the bible for victory in spirit through Jesus etc... where all you have to do is stand & God fights for us:) . kind of hard to explain. I think it is learned over time.
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Jihad has several meanings, depending on the context in which it is used. the normaitive use of the term is one of "internal spiritual struggle" to overcome negative personality traits and so forth.

so, in that sense, it seems the same.

No raids, military action or Holy Wars or literal COMBAT.
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perhaps. nevertheless, Jihad also contains the non literal combat aspect. some beings, however, believe that they can simply declare it as such and engage in physical conflict. these beings are mistaken.
 
Awaiting_the_fifth said:
Certainly this is true of rifles, but what purpose does a handgun have other than killing people?


I simply wouldnt give anyone a gun

The person who was taught to drive, of course, but cars have a purpose other than killing.

(working on the assumption that you are talking about handguns)
Why do you own guns then?
Click to expand...
You have to acknowledge the fact that if people did not commit crimes with guns they would use something else.. Look at England.. With their strict gun control laws the criminals use knives and blunt objects. You cannot tell me that doesnt happen I have a good friend who lives in Hampshire and we discussed at great length the crime there.. Its easier to stab someone or knock them over the head than it is to pull a trigger rather than just threatening with it.

You have to admit that a lot of terrorism is carried out using automobiles. The same with guns.. Just because it has another purpose does not make it any less a weapon in the hands of a violent person.

I have the right to own a gun.. Even if its just for the purpose of defending myself against a corrupt government its still my right.
 
Faithfulservant said:
There are other ways to get meat than from a grocery store...Most people do not own guns to shoot people despite opinions from anti-gun people.

You give two people a gun.. one person knows gun safety the other one doesnt.. which do you trust more to handle it.

Its the same with driving a car.. one person was taught how to drive the other one wasnt... which do you trust more to drive it.
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You DON'T go hunting with a handgun! Not only are they inaccurate over about 25 metres, they generally are not powerful enough. Here in NZ we have guns in 1 out of every 3 households. 85% are rifles FOR HUNTING.

Goodness me!

Children+Christian fundamentalist mindset+Weapons = Great dollops of manure ready to fall on some one, some when.

Kiwimac
 
As for a right to defend oneself, I kind of thought the Sermon on the Mount took care of that once and for all?

Kiwimac
 
kiwimac--hello, and peace--

I think you will find that Faithfulservant's concern is with the spirit of what is offered at the camp--not the caliber nor the diameter of the bullets that come out of the handguns or any other specifications.

I cannot speak for her, but I think that the right to bear arms is an issue all of us here in the U.S. and around the world must ponder.

Does it mean something different in New Zealand?
 
In Love,

Nonetheless. Handgun related deaths per capita are at their highest in the US. Which is why I find the whole concept of a group of Christians offering to teach children to use them unbelievable. Teaching kids (of an older age) to hunt, OK, that I could accept especially if it included first aid, tracking, that kind of thing.

Handguns, however, have only ONE purpose and that is to kill folk.

As for NZ, there is NO right to bear arms here. We expect that those people who want to use Rifles etc will go through intensive training courses and be vetted thoroughly by the police. To own a usable handgun here you must go through a very careful process and you must be a member of a local handgun users group which sponsors you.

For me as a Wayfarer, I can think of no good reason for my fellow christians to own a handgun unless they are sports-shooters.

Kiwimac
 
Hi, kiwimac--

Yes, being properly instructed is very important--I think it might make a difference here in the U.S. if it were required and enforced. I no longer have guns in my house--I am not comfortable with them. But there was a time when there were several guns here because I was married to an former army artillery man who really enjoyed target practice with no real interest in hunting (he passed on at a young age, and I am married again--neither I nor my current husband want any guns around.) But I still think that my personal right to bear arms is important. The issue is certainly not easy to resolve when it comes to legislation and where the government and private citizens draw the lines. I certainly would draw them before introducing the program at this church camp.:eek:

InPeace,
InLove
 
Kiwimac if you read the earlier posts you can see that I was concerned with the COMBAT website and how strongly they were promoting guns with children... later on the topic got derailed to gun control.. Im a firm believer in my rights as an American and in my lifetime Ive slowly watched some of those rights get tampered with and taken away.


Considering we are the third most populated country in the world 300million people ... we are 8th on the list at .02 per 1000 people.. does it no way convince me that our firearm deaths per capita should be a reason to enforce gun control.
 
Can someone tell me what that "alert" next to the topic title indicates? I've figured out the "locked" thingie, but what is the "alert" about?

Is it like a "caution" sign?
 
Käthe said:
Can someone tell me what that "alert" next to the topic title indicates? I've figured out the "locked" thingie, but what is the "alert" about?

Is it like a "caution" sign?
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When you create a post or a topic you can select an icon to go with it. Basically, that's what the original poster did. This one should have the spy smiley next to it.
 
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