Jesus Died A Natural Death.

[Dor]

[font=Times New Roman,Times,Times NewRoman]The greatest Person Who ever lived – measured by anyone's standard -- said, "I am… the truth." (John 14:6)[/font]

[font=Times New Roman,Times,Times NewRoman]This Person, Jesus Christ, is the only Being who has ever claimed such a thing… and He backed His words with many infallible proofs, based upon physical reality. He healed the sick, gave sight to those blind from birth, cleansed the leper, gave hearing to the deaf, and speech to the dumb. He raised the dead. As a homeless Man, foresaken by His family, He befriended the poor, the fatherless, the widow, and the child. He denounced false religion. He denounced hypocrisy. He denounced materialism. He denounced racism. He denounced divorce. He denounced perversion and corruption and dishonesty. He approved of loving God with all of your heart, mind, strength, soul, and body, and your neighbor as yourself.[/font]
[font=Times New Roman,Times,Times NewRoman]Jesus Christ was intolerant of wickedness. He said the world was wicked and that He had come to show us the way to God. He said that He Himself was THE Way to God… the ONLY way! "I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." (John 14:6) He did not accept any other belief system as valid. He condemned every lie, and He proclaimed the truth.[/font]

[font=Times New Roman,Times,Times NewRoman]Is the belief system of Jesus Christ just as valid as any other?[/font]
[font=Times New Roman,Times,Times NewRoman]He said he would be crucified by the religious leaders of His day. He was crucified by them. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman,Times,Times NewRoman]He also said that three days after his crucifixion He would rise again from the dead. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman,Times,Times NewRoman]His tomb is empty.[/font]
[font=Times New Roman,Times,Times NewRoman]Today... right now... the empty tomb of Jesus Christ stares Post-Modernism in the face. I am not aware that any person denies any of the above facts with any credibility. So then, what does the Post-Modernist do with these facts?[/font]

[font=Times New Roman,Times,Times NewRoman]Did Jesus Christ not really die? Just faint up there on the cross? Did the seasoned Roman centurion call Him dead before He was? Did Jesus somehow, after being beaten, scourged and crucified, three days later... with no food or water or help from anyone, somehow force his way out of a sealed tomb, overcome the fearless Roman guards, and escape? That was not how He lived. Why would He change?[/font]

[font=Times New Roman,Times,Times NewRoman]Or did the frightened, bewildered disciples, who could not even stand with their Messiah in the garden of Gethsemane when He was still alive... and fled from Him in terror, somehow steal Chirst's body? And did they all, without exception, fearlessly lay down the rest of their lives for a lie? Something they KNEW was a lie? Were they totally insane?[/font]

[font=Times New Roman,Times,Times NewRoman]Five hundred people saw Jesus Christ alive after the crucifixion at the same time. They saw Him ascend into heaven, and they put their lives on the line to proclaim that fact to those who killed Him. That fact would stand as incontestable proof of the resurrection of Jesus Christ in any courtroom today.[/font]

[font=Times New Roman,Times,Times NewRoman]Why is this so hard for us?[/font]
[font=Times New Roman,Times,Times NewRoman]Jesus Christ said He would rise again from the dead.[/font]
[font=Times New Roman,Times,Times NewRoman]He did.[/font]
[font=Times New Roman,Times,Times NewRoman]The spiritual realm is actually real, it does have characteristics, and Jesus Christ is real and alive and the Son of God – just as He said. [/font]

[font=Times New Roman,Times,Times NewRoman]Even with the facts available to them, few made the effort in Jesus' day to seek Him, even with the prospect of eternal damnation staring them in the face. Instead of seeking Him, they hated Him. They killed Him. I expect the same today… people have not changed. We are sinful. We do not have an intellectual problem with the Bible, or with Jesus Christ. Our problem is a spiritual one.[/font]

 

[Faithfulservant]

But, I was not slamming him! I was asking a question, and I was hoping for an heartfelt answer.


STOP! For Jesus Christ's sake, let him answer...

Thats fine if you want him to answer your question.. That doesnt stop me from being angry over the manipulation of scripture that hes using to argue his point. He also accused Dor of lying which alone was rude..

when I said enough said I meant enough said from ME. I made my point.

 

[Quahom1]

Thats fine if you want him to answer your question.. That doesnt stop me from being angry over the manipulation of scripture that hes using to argue his point. He also accused Dor of lying which alone was rude..

when I said enough said I meant enough said from ME. I made my point.

You know my job...You can have it if you wish, but until such time I do exactly as the COC states. No more, no less. Understand that.

very respectfully,

Q

 

[smkolins]

There are many other faiths that also believe that Jesus was man not god and that he died naturally:

• Ba'hai
  ...
  
  These are some of the faiths that i have found that believe in the fact that Jesus was not God and therefore not crucified. (Although some of these faiths have a belief that Jesus was neither God or Man)​
  
  
  But yet i have proved you wrong. Islam is not the only faith that challenges Jesus' crucifiction.​

• 
  
  Without completely disagreeing with you and not wholly agreeing with your characterization of the Baha'i Faith I offer the following, as a Baha'i. I have never seen an inherent link that because Jesus was not God (full stop) He was not crucified. Baha'is accept that Jesus gave His life, ending because of the Cross He was nailed to, in the path of the love of God, and that thereby a tremedous spiritual force was released into the world entirely changing how the world was to grow - think of the world before and after Jesus!
  
  This is similar to the idea that Baha'is, while glorifying Jesus, the Holy Spirit, and God, do not call Them as a trinity. Certain it is that Jesus, the Holy Spirit and God are more unified than we can imagine - but there is a confusion of focus to refer to Three when only One is above and beyond all. But to turn these teachings around and say that because God is above and beyond all one aught not notice Jesus or the Holy Ghost is a misunderstanding, just as while noting that Jesus' soul and spirit were untouched by the nails that pierced His flesh it would be improper to not take careful, reverent, acceptance of the profound love proven by His physicial death on the Cross.

 

[Bandit]

This is similar to the idea that Baha'is, while glorifying Jesus, the Holy Spirit, and God, do not call Them as a trinity. Certain it is that Jesus, the Holy Spirit and God are more unified than we can imagine - but there is a confusion of focus to refer to Three when only One is above and beyond all. But to turn these teachings around and say that because God is above and beyond all one aught not notice Jesus or the Holy Ghost is a misunderstanding, just as while noting that Jesus' soul and spirit were untouched by the nails that pierced His flesh it would be improper to not take careful, reverent, acceptance of the profound love proven by His physicial death on the Cross.

right. this all looks right to me too but there was more than just love being shed there. there was reconciliation & obedience to a commandment also.
i believe there is more in the scriptures for why Jesus had to go to Calvary when we really start to ask. but we cant change 1700 years of written doctrines & pounding people with them. it is like interbred into the thoughts or something & we still have to love each other reguardless of a belief.

i have read your writings on God & Jesus smkolins, seeing each other in a mirror & that is how i see it too, but we cannot make Jesus any less than what the scriptures say he is, because in reality through essence Jesus is God in authority & in power, so he may as well be God

the problem i see when people make him just a man is they make him less than who he really is. I believe he was just a man like us all, but there is way more to it....how ,when , what & where.

Calvary & his birth, Jordan, the resurrection & his preeminence is where things get mixed up sometimes.

Without Calvary, no man or woman could inherit eternal life. Everyone goes through Jesus & no sin can enter the Kingdom of God.
Without the shedding of blood there is no remission of sin.
Jesus said, you can blaspheme the Son & it shall be forgiven, but to blaspheme the Father, it shall NOT be forgiven.
that tells me right there, there is more to it.


Jesus did not die a natural death. he laid down his life & they crucified him that we may have life & have it more abundantly.
Without Calvary, God would not have reconciled with man & there would have been no outpouring of the Holy Ghost to us, & it all would have gone right down the tubes.

that is in part how i see it

 

[Bandit]

i made a mistake with this one so i wanted to correct it, it is the Holy Ghost that we can not blaspheme. but it appears to me to be the same thing as blaspheming God.


And whosoever shall speak a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but unto him that blasphemeth against the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven.

 

[InLove]

Bandit--I have not read through the whole thread--at least this time, but are you searching for Mark 3:28-29?

"I tell you the truth, all the sins and blasphemies of me will be forgiven them. But whoever basphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; he is guilty of an eternal sin."

Just wondered if this was what you were looking for.

InPeace,
InLove

 

[earl]

Bandit--I have not read through the whole thread--at least this time, but are you searching for Mark 3:28-29?

"I tell you the truth, all the sins and blasphemies of me will be forgiven them. But whoever basphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; he is guilty of an eternal sin."

Just wondered if this was what you were looking for.

InPeace,
InLove

Hmm-this raises an interesting interpretation of the terms Son of Man & Holy Spirit as well as "blasphemy." If we take the Holy Spirit to be the actions of "God" on a person perhaps "blasphemy" of it is in essence to turn away from its transforming effects-to turn away from the "kingdom of heaven." It would not be forgiven in the sense that we are turning away from the opportunity to grow into that kingdom, whereas to blapheme the Son of Man perhaps implies not responding to a particular embodiment of the Holy Spirit. Whatcha all think? Take care, Earl

 

[Bandit]

Bandit--I have not read through the whole thread--at least this time, but are you searching for Mark 3:28-29?

"I tell you the truth, all the sins and blasphemies of me will be forgiven them. But whoever basphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; he is guilty of an eternal sin."

Just wondered if this was what you were looking for.

InPeace,
InLove

yes that is it. but i cant check right now for sure to see if, when & where it was confirmed & established in another place to get the whole meaning. i have been doing paraphrasing a lot & i dont want to make mistakes with it.

 

[Bandit]

Hmm-this raises an interesting interpretation of the terms Son of Man & Holy Spirit as well as "blasphemy." If we take the Holy Spirit to be the actions of "God" on a person perhaps "blasphemy" of it is in essence to turn away from its transforming effects-to turn away from the "kingdom of heaven." It would not be forgiven in the sense that we are turning away from the opportunity to grow into that kingdom, whereas to blapheme the Son of Man perhaps implies not responding to a particular embodiment of the Holy Spirit. Whatcha all think? Take care, Earl

i think that is very possible Earl but more or less prior to being filled with the Holy Ghost & before entering the Kingdom.
to deny God after we have already recieved the Holy Ghost. (which i dont understand how that is even possible)
blaspheme is to reject or deny or speak against.

i see the Holy Ghost here as God & the Father being the same entity yet manifested to us in this generation as the indwelling of the spirit of God, through Jesus.

i have to think more on it (& someone in the bible) as to how it would apply that we would speak against Jesus (son of man), yet not against God & be forgiven. I am thinking of Paul at the moment, on the road to Damscus. Possibly the Jews also who reject him.

Now, I also see the man Jesus as the mediator between God & man & he is the only way to the Father. So while some may reject Jesus, God will still be able to draw them to Him through Jesus & they just wont realize it.
Prior to Jesus, there was no other way to obtain the promise of eternal life.

if we blaspheme the Holy Ghost, it is very simple there IMO, we will not be forgiven & we are pretty much on our own.

i think there is more to it than that even i have to get my bible out & really look at it again, so dont hold me to some of this.

 

[lunamoth]

Hmm-this raises an interesting interpretation of the terms Son of Man & Holy Spirit as well as "blasphemy." If we take the Holy Spirit to be the actions of "God" on a person perhaps "blasphemy" of it is in essence to turn away from its transforming effects-to turn away from the "kingdom of heaven." It would not be forgiven in the sense that we are turning away from the opportunity to grow into that kingdom, whereas to blapheme the Son of Man perhaps implies not responding to a particular embodiment of the Holy Spirit. Whatcha all think? Take care, Earl

This is much as I see it Earl. The context of this was when Jesus was accused of being possessed by Beelzebub and he retorts: "How can Satan drive out Satan?" The whole upshot seems to me to that if you deny that which is the blessing of the Spirit, in effect say that those fruits are not good, you are denying that there is really truth and goodness and mercy and peace and joy and grace. And if you deny it, how can you partake in it? Jesus has gone around healing people and instead of calling this good people accuse Him of being a demon, which is saying that something good is actually evil. Very much like turning away from the Kingdom, denying oneself the opportunity to commune with God. Take it to an extreme, say someone who has acted very evil their whole life, yet they perform one beautiful act of mercy or healing. They may have acted demonic most of the time, but to say that that good act is demonic is to blaspheme the Spirit. And at the other end of the spectrum, someone who has had a life totally filled with the fruit of the Spirit, yet does not "believe" in God/Jesus. To say that that person is not of the Spirit is to deny that very Spirit. Probably going to get flamed for this one...

 

[Bandit]

it appears to me also that the scribes here were found guilty of a sin for which there is no forgiveness for?
BECAUSE they refused to acknowledge the power & work behind Jesus & that was of the Holy Ghost (God).

What they were doing was calling Jesus unclean for doing a good thing denying the power & authority that backed Him which was the power to cast out Satan.

Now back to the forgiveness part. They can blaspheme Jesus (son of man) & be forgiven (yes they can be forgiven).
But if they blashpheme the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven as in NEVER.

so which is it? can the scribes be forgiven or not?
it is obvious they did not want to partake in it & rejected it.

& HOW is it one can blaspheme the person Jesus & be forgiven, but to blaspheme the Holy Ghost & not be forgiven.

Mark 3:28 & Matt 12:31

so what I think it is, one can blaspheme the person Jesus, but not the power that was in Jesus, which is the Holy Ghost (God).

IMO, this would apply to unbelievers & preclude forgiveness & preclude repentance, that there heart would be so hardened that they cannot see the difference in that which is of God & that which is of Satan.
reminds me of Pharao dealing with Moses, but denying the power that was behind Moses.

 

[smkolins]

right. this all looks right to me too but there was more than just love being shed there. there was reconciliation & obedience to a commandment also.

An other way to see the same thing is to see love before it, during it, and after it. Love of God for man and man for God. Love calls reconciliation and obedience and all the divine qualities, grace, forgiveness.... If it was mear tenderness or affection, it wouldn't bear reverence.

i have read your writings on God & Jesus smkolins, seeing each other in a mirror & that is how i see it too, but we cannot make Jesus any less than what the scriptures say he is, because in reality through essence Jesus is God in authority & in power, so he may as well be God

Simplification can make things simple, but also get one in trouble. For example, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." is not the same as "The Word was God."

If one's purpose is to note the relationship, then certainly the Baha'i Writings say "Were any of the all-embracing Manifestations of God to declare: "I am God," He, verily, speaketh the truth, and no doubt attacheth thereto. For it hath been repeatedly demonstrated that through their Revelation, their attributes and names, the Revelation of God, His names and His attributes, are made manifest in the world."

But there is more to be said, and has been said. In the Baha'i Writtings it also says "And since there can be no tie of direct intercourse to bind the one true God with His creation, and no resemblance whatever can exist between the transient and the Eternal, the contingent and the Absolute, He hath ordained that in every age and dispensation a pure and stainless Soul be made manifest in the kingdoms of earth and heaven. Unto this subtle, this mysterious and ethereal Being He hath assigned a twofold nature; the physical, pertaining to the world of matter, and the spiritual, which is born of the substance of God Himself. He hath, moreover, conferred upon Him a double station. The first station, which is related to His innermost reality, representeth Him as One Whose voice is the voice of God Himself. To this testifieth the tradition: "Manifold and mysterious is My relationship with God. I am He, Himself, and He is I, Myself, except that I am that I am, and He is that He is." And in like manner, the words: "Arise, O Muhammad, for lo, the Lover and the Beloved are joined together and made one in Thee." He similarly saith: "There is no distinction whatsoever between Thee and Them, except that They are Thy Servants." The second station is the human station, exemplified by the following verses: "I am but a man like you." "Say, praise be to my Lord! Am I more than a man, an apostle?" These Essences of Detachment, these resplendent Realities are the channels of God's all-pervasive grace. Led by the light of unfailing guidance, and invested with supreme sovereignty, They are commissioned to use the inspiration of Their words, the effusions of Their infallible grace and the sanctifying breeze of Their Revelation for the cleansing of every longing heart and receptive spirit from the dross and dust of earthly cares and limitations. Then, and only then, will the Trust of God, latent in the reality of man, emerge, as resplendent as the rising Orb of Divine Revelation, from behind the veil of concealment, and implant the ensign of its revealed glory upon the summits of men's hearts."

the problem i see when people make him just a man is they make him less than who he really is. I believe he was just a man like us all, but there is way more to it....how ,when , what & where.

Certainly the truth.

 

[smkolins]

BTW, an interesting detail of the views about what a Manifestation of God is from a Baha'i view can be gleaned from noting the position of a moderately obscure figure from Christian history - the first attempt at splintering the Christian Church was by Arius. "Consider thou, at the time of Christ and after Him, how many childish attempts have been made by different persons! What claims they have advanced and what a multitude have they gathered around themselves! Even Arius attracted to himself a million and a half followers and strove and endeavored to sow the seeds of sedition in the Cause of Christ. But eventually the sea of Christ surged and cast out all the gathering froth and nothing was left behind save everlasting malediction."

Many people note the Council of Nicea for other reasons but the key development of this meeting was the tearing out of the Arian heresy (which btw has nothing to do with the Nazis, however heinous that issue is as well.) For an interesting read consider this wikipedia article

Specifically consider his theology
"- that the Logos and the Father were not of the same essence (ousia);
- that the Son was a created being (ktisma or poiema); and
- that though He was the creator of the worlds, and must therefore have existed before them and before all time, there was a "time" [although Arius refused to use words meaning time, such as cronos or aion] when He did not exist."

These are not Baha'i positions. But in reacting to the arian heresy, perhaps Christianity leapt a bit farther than it had to. Simplification can get you in all kinds of trouble.

 

[Bandit]

An other way to see the same thing is to see love before it, during it, and after it. Love of God for man and man for God. Love calls reconciliation and obedience and all the divine qualities, grace, forgiveness.... If it was mear tenderness or affection, it wouldn't bear reverence.

yes & also the love of one man for the rest of the human race that we all could have eternal life.
Jesus was the only one who could do this & he was the bondman (so to speak). Jesus did NOT want to go to the cross, but he did because he knew he had to do it. It was required & it was required of a perfect sinless man.


"Lo I come through the volume of the book, to do thy will it is written of me..."
It was God looking at himself through the man Jesus & Jesus ion his life submitting to the perfect will of God, thus Jesus becomes God manifested in the flesh. NOT God in the flesh, but God manifested.

Simplification can make things simple, but also get one in trouble. For example, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." is not the same as "The Word was God."

I agree. I dont discuss this verse with too many people because they miss WHAT BEGINNING & when was the beginning. Everyone jumps first gear.

If one's purpose is to note the relationship, then certainly the Baha'i Writings say "Were any of the all-embracing Manifestations of God to declare: "I am God," He, verily, speaketh the truth, and no doubt attacheth thereto. For it hath been repeatedly demonstrated that through their Revelation, their attributes and names, the Revelation of God, His names and His attributes, are made manifest in the world."

I do note the relationship of God & Jesus, but i cannot tell if you are putting Jesus on the same level as the others of Gods servants. Jesus is at the top, though a servant & mediator, he is also above us & equal with God.

But there is more to be said, and has been said. In the Baha'i Writtings it also says "And since there can be no tie of direct intercourse to bind the one true God with His creation, and no resemblance whatever can exist between the transient and the Eternal, the contingent and the Absolute, He hath ordained that in every age and dispensation a pure and stainless Soul be made manifest in the kingdoms of earth and heaven. Unto this subtle, this mysterious and ethereal Being He hath assigned a twofold nature; the physical, pertaining to the world of matter, and the spiritual, which is born of the substance of God Himself. He hath, moreover, conferred upon Him a double station. The first station, which is related to His innermost reality, representeth Him as One Whose voice is the voice of God Himself. To this testifieth the tradition: "Manifold and mysterious is My relationship with God. I am He, Himself, and He is I, Myself, except that I am that I am, and He is that He is." And in like manner, the words: "Arise, O Muhammad, for lo, the Lover and the Beloved are joined together and made one in Thee." He similarly saith: "There is no distinction whatsoever between Thee and Them, except that They are Thy Servants." The second station is the human station, exemplified by the following verses: "I am but a man like you." "Say, praise be to my Lord! Am I more than a man, an apostle?" These Essences of Detachment, these resplendent Realities are the channels of God's all-pervasive grace. Led by the light of unfailing guidance, and invested with supreme sovereignty, They are commissioned to use the inspiration of Their words, the effusions of Their infallible grace and the sanctifying breeze of Their Revelation for the cleansing of every longing heart and receptive spirit from the dross and dust of earthly cares and limitations. Then, and only then, will the Trust of God, latent in the reality of man, emerge, as resplendent as the rising Orb of Divine Revelation, from behind the veil of concealment, and implant the ensign of its revealed glory upon the summits of men's hearts."

I cannot tell what you are trying to say here. it reminds me a little of the Christian Science Church.

This part does not sound right to me

And since there can be no tie of direct intercourse to bind the one true God with His creation, and no resemblance whatever can exist between the transient and the Eternal

Jesus is the tie of direct intercourse that binds the one true God with His creation & Jesus is that resemblance.
the rest looks ok to me, but that is just me
& yes there is more to be said & i have enjoyed talking to you a lot.

 

[Bandit]

BTW, an interesting detail of the views about what a Manifestation of God is from a Baha'i view can be gleaned from noting the position of a moderately obscure figure from Christian history - the first attempt at splintering the Christian Church was by Arius. "Consider thou, at the time of Christ and after Him, how many childish attempts have been made by different persons! What claims they have advanced and what a multitude have they gathered around themselves! Even Arius attracted to himself a million and a half followers and strove and endeavored to sow the seeds of sedition in the Cause of Christ. But eventually the sea of Christ surged and cast out all the gathering froth and nothing was left behind save everlasting malediction."

Many people note the Council of Nicea for other reasons but the key development of this meeting was the tearing out of the Arian heresy (which btw has nothing to do with the Nazis, however heinous that issue is as well.) For an interesting read consider this wikipedia article

Specifically consider his theology
"- that the Logos and the Father were not of the same essence (ousia);
- that the Son was a created being (ktisma or poiema); and
- that though He was the creator of the worlds, and must therefore have existed before them and before all time, there was a "time" [although Arius refused to use words meaning time, such as cronos or aion] when He did not exist."

These are not Baha'i positions. But in reacting to the arian heresy, perhaps Christianity leapt a bit farther than it had to. Simplification can get you in all kinds of trouble.

Yes i know. I have studied all this too. No one acheived what they wanted.
I dont follow Arius either, but i understand what he believed. i think he just had his timing off a little on when Jesus actually came into the picture in his preeminence. Kind of like God made a spirit by giving birth to it or something.

God can make spirits & make flesh, but he can only beget the spirit of men. He does not beget angels & deities.

Another one i found interesting was Tertullian. he had God as one substance. then God like(sort of) divided himself into 3rds, then at the end of the plan, God goes back to being one substance. He never used the word persons like some of the others. His beliefs pretty much got trampled too, even though he was one of the first to come up with the belief of trinitarianism.

I stick with what the Bible says the best that I can, word for word w/o adding or creating words or a doctrine to try & explain it.
The bible says Jesus was a man.

I think they messed up too the way they treated each other for some kind of earthly power. I dont follow any of them & have no plans of joining any organized religion. But i think some people need something to get them started in the right direction, so even in all the turmoil & confusion they put each other through, i think it had to be that way in order to get it to us in our generation.

i dont know exactly how Bahai sees it, but so far you & i have been pretty close to seeing it the same as far as the godhead part. (i think)
not sure what you see in the preeminence end of it.

 

[PersonaNonGrata]

it appears to me also that the scribes here were found guilty of a sin for which there is no forgiveness for?
BECAUSE they refused to acknowledge the power & work behind Jesus & that was of the Holy Ghost (God).

What they were doing was calling Jesus unclean for doing a good thing denying the power & authority that backed Him which was the power to cast out Satan.

Now back to the forgiveness part. They can blaspheme Jesus (son of man) & be forgiven (yes they can be forgiven).
But if they blashpheme the Holy Ghost it shall not be forgiven as in NEVER.

so which is it? can the scribes be forgiven or not?
it is obvious they did not want to partake in it & rejected it.

& HOW is it one can blaspheme the person Jesus & be forgiven, but to blaspheme the Holy Ghost & not be forgiven.

Mark 3:28 & Matt 12:31

so what I think it is, one can blaspheme the person Jesus, but not the power that was in Jesus, which is the Holy Ghost (God).

hello bandit,

my question might not seem adequate however i understood as there are two souls in one?
though is there a milestone in Jesus's life that holy sprit entered personna Jesus, making him the Christ or is it in just referring, blasphemy is not forgettable you say?

summer

 

[Faithfulservant]

I agree with you on the blaspheming the Spirit, luna. I believe its the continual rejection of God. I believe that Paul and John speaks of sin leading to death which I believe is concerning spiritual death.. which is the continual rejection of Christ.

Romans 6:16 Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one's slaves whom you obey, whether of sin leading to death, or of obedience leading to righteousness

1 John 5:16-17 If anyone sees his brother sinning a sin which does not lead to death, he will ask, and He will give him life for those who commit sin not leading to death. There is sin leading to death. I do not say that he should pray about that. All unrighteousness is sin, and there is sin not leading to death.

 

[Bandit]

hello bandit,

my question might not seem adequate however i understood as there are two souls in one?
though is there a milestone in Jesus's life that holy sprit entered personna Jesus, making him the Christ or is it in just referring, blasphemy is not forgettable you say?

summer

that is what i see. two souls in one. God was IN Jesus, making Jesus the Christ. Prior to Jesus, God held back his spirit from becoming one with man because of Adams transgression. Then after Jesus' death burial & resurrection, God poured out his spirit upon all flesh.

(not forgettable, but unforgivable)
i feel what Jesus was saying here is something like this, (& this is just my interpretation)

"You can say bad things about me, you can spit on me, you can deny me & reject me & crucify me & it will be forgiven. But if someone denies God or slanders God, or cannot see the good works & power that God THROUGH Jesus, was manifesting, it is a sin that will not be forgiven.
In reality it is a two edged sword & the person who blasphemes God or the power & works of God, they bring judgment on themsleves & decide not to be partakers in the inheritance with Christ.
They reject God, so what else is God supposed to do?

i think there is more than one way to blaspheme. Fortunately I have not known too many people in my life who do this.

What do you think?

& i dont understand what you mean by this:

though is there a milestone in Jesus's life that holy sprit entered personna Jesus

or do you mean was there a specific time the Holy Ghost entered Jesus?
if that is what you mean, then my answer is yes.

Luke4:1 And Jesus being full of the Holy Ghost returned from Jordan, and was led by the Spirit into the wilderness.

Jordan was the begining of his ministry & the first time on record that God spoke & declared Jesus as His son. all other references are prophecy and after Jordan. as you can see here, Jesus was being LED by the spirit...& he was not doing this all by himself.

The Holy Ghost is God taking His abode in us & becoming one with us.


I hope that helps & you can talk about it with me if you want to


What do you think about it PersonaNonGrata?

 

[PersonaNonGrata]

I agree with you on the blaspheming the Spirit, luna. I believe its the continual rejection of God. I believe that Paul and John speaks of sin leading to death which I believe is concerning spiritual death.. which is the continual rejection of Christ.

Romans 6:16 Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one's slaves whom you obey, whether of sin leading to death, or of obedience leading to righteousness

1 John 5:16-17 If anyone sees his brother sinning a sin which does not lead to death, he will ask, and He will give him life for those who commit sin not leading to death. There is sin leading to death. I do not say that he should pray about that. All unrighteousness is sin, and there is sin not leading to death.

all negative words? Besides righteousness is a very elastic word if you ask me.
Like are there codes for sins? Say like giving grades?

i totally agree on blaspheming the sprit might put a curtain in your eyes. SİN. Even may lead you darkness and make a personna see the place he lives in a place where there is no hope, left him in despair or a world not to bother for, or make you leave an unpleasant taste. NO? Most of our actions determine, the Will!
Results all comes back to you when you die? I really dont think so, it is affecting this consciousness' as well if you ask me.
So, thats a very nice paraphrising of Bible, i mean Romans 6:16

a little ironic as well:/