Revelation 5;13

[mee]

God breathed life breath into Adam, which I believe is the Spirit. I believe the soul is the medium of flesh and spirit. The Spirit is the shadowy thing that goes back to God when the flesh has had it's run.

Unfortunately, I only have access to an NIV at this time. I will bring a KJV tomorrow.

The whole New Testament is Greek teaching. Do you discount that as well?

Earth is a physical realm. God set this up to run its course, however long that is. Because God has set it up to operate in a particular way, I assume that God will not defy his own laws. God has set man up to operate independantly so in that I believe that 'evil' always has the possibly to exist (of course that depends on what you view as evil as well). For evil to be done away with, God would have to destroy the earth, those functions of the earth that He created in the 6 days that Genesis describes, and mankind as well. For God to reestablish mankind in the flesh would be a set up for the original sin scenario again. For us to be 100% obedient to the will of God for certainty, for eternity, it couldn't be in the physical realm. God has tried that. It doesn't work. Sounds like a spiritual resurrection to me.


What?

i looked in the NIV and it has the same meaning as the KJV and the NWT at genesis 3;19, so i am a bit confused why you say it reads differant in your bible ? yes you are right the new testament is written in the Greek , but what i meant was, the teaching of the churches of christendom have taken on the Greek teachings of plato philosophy about immortality of the human soul , which is not a bible teaching but a teaching of plato. its good to know that the bible promises a new heaven and a new earth 2 peter 3;13 ....rev 21;1....Isaiah 65;17.... it is my belief that the hope for most of christians is a resurrection into a paradise earth if we die , but the 144,000 that the bible speaks about in revelation , will be resurrected from death to be with Jesus in the heavens and rule as kings and preists in the heavenly kingdom goverment. and these 144,000 will be resurrected with a spiritual body as flesh and blood cannot live in heaven . but i do not believe that they possess a thing inside them but Jehovah gives them a body to live in heaven

 

[mee]

The 12,000 from the 12 tribes of Israel (equaling 144,000) as mentioned in Rev. 7:4-8 and 14:1-3 does not state that they will be the only ones that will enter Heaven.

After this I looked and there before me was a great multitude that no one could count, from every nation, tribe, people and language, standing before the throne and in front of the Lamb. They were wearing white robes and were holding palm branches in their hands. (Rev 7:9)

the 144,000 will be saved as well as a great multitude of those that believe that jesus is the son of god and our personal saviour.

If you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved. As the Scripture says, "Anyone who trusts in him will never be put to shame." For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile – the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him, for, "Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved" (Rom. 10:9-13).

yes rev 7;9 is talking about the ones who will inherit the earth they also regonize Jesus as Gods king , but these ones are of the other sheep that Jesus spoke of in john 10;16
(John 10:16) "And I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; those also I must bring, and they will listen to my voice, and they will become one flock, one shepherd.....so they are not part of the little flock of 144,000

 

[truthseeker]

i looked in the NIV and it has the same meaning as the KJV and the NWT at genesis 3;19, so i am a bit confused why you say it reads differant in your bible ? yes you are right the new testament is written in the Greek , but what i meant was, the teaching of the churches of christendom have taken on the Greek teachings of plato philosophy about immortality of the human soul , which is not a bible teaching but a teaching of plato. its good to know that the bible promises a new heaven and a new earth 2 peter 3;13 ....rev 21;1....Isaiah 65;17.... it is my belief that the hope for most of christians is a resurrection into a paradise earth if we die , but the 144,000 that the bible speaks about in revelation , will be resurrected from death to be with Jesus in the heavens and rule as kings and preists in the heavenly kingdom goverment. and these 144,000 will be resurrected with a spiritual body as flesh and blood cannot live in heaven . but i do not believe that they possess a thing inside them but Jehovah gives them a body to live in heaven

The spirit is that body.
As God has made man in His image, God is not on walk about with a turban on so we must be a spirit form as well, which we all agree God is of spirit form.
'In the sweat of your face you will eat bread...' just doesn't sound the same to me as 'By the sweat of your brow you will eat your food...', but I digress. And what's so wrong with Plato? If nothing else he was searching for a deeper understanding just like all the rest of us are. Didn't Plato hang out with Paul?
A new heaven, because we as flesh and blood have yet to see; and a new earth perhaps in a spiritual realm. When I finally get it right, and I am one with God, then the life-breath that is me will ascend into the dwelling place of the omnipotent spiritual wholeness that I call God. You can come back and try it again and again, if you like.
Is there really a need for kings and priests in heaven?

 

[BlaznFattyz]

yes rev 7;9 is talking about the ones who will inherit the earth they also regonize Jesus as Gods king , but these ones are of the other sheep that Jesus spoke of in john 10;16
(John 10:16) "And I have other sheep, which are not of this fold; those also I must bring, and they will listen to my voice, and they will become one flock, one shepherd.....so they are not part of the little flock of 144,000

those other sheep are the believers (gentiles) who make up the christian church, and through the work of the holy spirit know that jesus is the son of god, and take his gospel to the ends of the earth. and when god feels it is enough gentiles saved and hidden in the body of christ, he will again turn his attention on his chosen people, the jews.

 

[mee]

The spirit is that body.
As God has made man in His image, God is not on walk about with a turban on so we must be a spirit form as well, which we all agree God is of spirit form.
'In the sweat of your face you will eat bread...' just doesn't sound the same to me as 'By the sweat of your brow you will eat your food...', but I digress. And what's so wrong with Plato? If nothing else he was searching for a deeper understanding just like all the rest of us are. Didn't Plato hang out with Paul?
A new heaven, because we as flesh and blood have yet to see; and a new earth perhaps in a spiritual realm. When I finally get it right, and I am one with God, then the life-breath that is me will ascend into the dwelling place of the omnipotent spiritual wholeness that I call God. You can come back and try it again and again, if you like.
Is there really a need for kings and priests in heaven?

the bible says the kings and priests in heaven will rule over the earth ,
"You (Jesus)are worthy to take the scroll and open its seals, because you were slaughtered and with your blood you bought persons for God out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation, and you made them to be a kingdom and priests to our God, and they are to rule as kings over the earth.(rev 5;9-10

a kingdom with a king and corulers has to have subjects to rule over and that is what the 144,000 will be doing nothing can touch this kingdom because it is in heaven and it is set up by God....Daniel 2;44

(Matthew 19:28) Jesus said to them: "Truly I say to YOU, In the re-creation, when the Son of man sits down upon his glorious throne, YOU who have followed me will also yourselves sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.





(Revelation 20:4) And I saw thrones, and there were those who sat down on them, and power of judging was given them. Yes, I saw the souls of those executed with the ax for the witness they bore to Jesus and for speaking about God, and those who had worshiped neither the wild beast nor its image and who had not received the mark upon their forehead and upon their hand. And they came to life and ruled as kings with the Christ for a thousand years.




​

(Revelation 22:5) Also, night will be no more, and they have no need of lamplight nor [do they have] sunlight, because Jehovah God will shed light upon them, and they will rule as kings forever and ever .as for paul hanging out with plato
The immortality of the soul . . . is a pagan philosophical dogma." In view of this, we can see why the apostle Paul strongly warned the first-century Christians against "the philosophy and empty deception according to the tradition of men, according to the elementary things of the world and not according to Christ."—Colossians 2:8

 

[mee]

those other sheep are the believers (gentiles) who make up the christian church, and through the work of the holy spirit know that jesus is the son of god, and take his gospel to the ends of the earth. and when god feels it is enough gentiles saved and hidden in the body of christ, he will again turn his attention on his chosen people, the jews.

yes they are a great crowd
(Revelation 22:17) And the spirit and the bride keep on saying: "Come!" And let anyone hearing say: "Come!" And let anyone thirsting come; let anyone that wishes take life’s water free

(Isaiah 2:2) And it must occur in the final part of the days [that] the mountain of the house of Jehovah will become firmly established above the top of the mountains, and it will certainly be lifted up above the hills; and to it all the nations must stream



(Isaiah 60:3) And nations will certainly go to your light, and kings to the brightness of your shining forth
yes psalm 11;4 is just what Jehovah is doing ,examing the sons of man bylooking down from the heavens onto the humans down here, so we dont need to go to heaven and God does not need to come down here he can examine us and see weather we give glory to his king (Jesus christ) by looking down from the heavens as it tells us in psalm 11;4

 

[Virtual_Cliff]

Do you know, I just lost twenty minutes of my life reading through this thread. Who cares? Do I follow Jesus because I love God or to get something out of it for myself - perhaps an honorary kingship for example? If the whole of the Book of Revelation was revealed as a hoax written by a crazed American in the 19th century it would not affect my faith in the slightest. Back to work, guys!

 

[mee]

Do you know, I just lost twenty minutes of my life reading through this thread. Who cares? Do I follow Jesus because I love God or to get something out of it for myself - perhaps an honorary kingship for example? If the whole of the Book of Revelation was revealed as a hoax written by a crazed American in the 19th century it would not affect my faith in the slightest. Back to work, guys!

Faith is the assured expectation of things hoped for, the evident demonstration of realities though not beheld...hebrews 11;1.....my faith is based on the promises in the bible that God reveals to us through his word the bible