Faithfulservant
Well-Known Member
way to much cut and pasting... I didnt even read it.
Hermeneutics
- Thread starter Marietta
- Start date
Hi Terrence, Its nice to hear from you again. 
The scriptures you have quoted are written to (and pertain to) Israel as a nation (not the Christian Church). God is making a promise to the Nation of Israel that he will set them up as a nation within their own territory. They will also be given new insights that will take the bitterness of their hearts away and fill it with the Love and Light of God. Placing the Divine Laws within their hearts and minds. They will no longer need the written text.
Ezekiel 36:23 "And I will vindicate the holiness of My great name which has been profaned among the nations, which you have profaned in their midst. Then the nations will know that I am the LORD," declares the Lord God, "when I prove Myself holy among you in their sight.
Ezekiel 36:24 "For I will take you from the nations, gather you from all the lands, and bring you into your own land.
Ezekiel 36:25 "Then I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you will be clean; I will cleanse you from all your filthiness and from all your idols.
Ezekiel 36:26 "Moreover, I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; and I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh.
Ezekiel 36:27 "And I will put My Spirit within you and cause you to walk in My statutes, and you will be careful to observe My ordinances.
How do you equate John 3 or the above verses this with the new birth of a Christian?
Please read all of John 3 and put it all in perspective and see what you come up with.
If this is referring to a spiritual birth that Christians come to once they have accepted Christ, than according to verse 8 all who accepted Christ and are born again should be able to move about like the wind without anybody being able to see them. Read on in this chapter.
John 3:8 (a)"The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit."
John 3:9 Nicodemus answered and said to Him, "How can these things be?"
John 3:10 Jesus answered and said to him, "Are you (a)the teacher of Israel, and do not understand these things?
John 3:11 "Truly, truly, I say to you, (a)we speak that which we know, and (b)bear witness of that which we have seen; and (b)you do not receive our witness.
John 3:12 "If I told you earthly things and you do not believe, how shall you believe if I tell you heavenly things?
The Greek makes it clearier::
8. The life spirit were desires to blow and the voice it hear however don't understand from where came and where going, in this way is everything that is born out of the life spirit
9. continued Nicodemus and said this, how be capable of this birth
10. replied Iesous and to him, you are the teacher the Israelites and this don't understand
11. truly truly say you that which comprehend speak and that which visible confirms but the testimony we don't grasp
12. If I tell you about the earthly existence and you don't believe me how will you be convinced if I tell you about celestial things
13. and nobody ascends into heaven since not from the heaven descended the offspring the human being
Jesus is answering Nicodemus's question of how can a man enter his mother's womb a second time. We have to keep everything in perspective.
Love and Light, Midge
The scriptures you have quoted are written to (and pertain to) Israel as a nation (not the Christian Church). God is making a promise to the Nation of Israel that he will set them up as a nation within their own territory. They will also be given new insights that will take the bitterness of their hearts away and fill it with the Love and Light of God. Placing the Divine Laws within their hearts and minds. They will no longer need the written text.
Ezekiel 36:23 "And I will vindicate the holiness of My great name which has been profaned among the nations, which you have profaned in their midst. Then the nations will know that I am the LORD," declares the Lord God, "when I prove Myself holy among you in their sight.
Ezekiel 36:24 "For I will take you from the nations, gather you from all the lands, and bring you into your own land.
Ezekiel 36:25 "Then I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you will be clean; I will cleanse you from all your filthiness and from all your idols.
Ezekiel 36:26 "Moreover, I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; and I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh.
Ezekiel 36:27 "And I will put My Spirit within you and cause you to walk in My statutes, and you will be careful to observe My ordinances.
How do you equate John 3 or the above verses this with the new birth of a Christian?
Please read all of John 3 and put it all in perspective and see what you come up with.
If this is referring to a spiritual birth that Christians come to once they have accepted Christ, than according to verse 8 all who accepted Christ and are born again should be able to move about like the wind without anybody being able to see them. Read on in this chapter.
John 3:8 (a)"The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit."
John 3:9 Nicodemus answered and said to Him, "How can these things be?"
John 3:10 Jesus answered and said to him, "Are you (a)the teacher of Israel, and do not understand these things?
John 3:11 "Truly, truly, I say to you, (a)we speak that which we know, and (b)bear witness of that which we have seen; and (b)you do not receive our witness.
John 3:12 "If I told you earthly things and you do not believe, how shall you believe if I tell you heavenly things?
The Greek makes it clearier::
8. The life spirit were desires to blow and the voice it hear however don't understand from where came and where going, in this way is everything that is born out of the life spirit
9. continued Nicodemus and said this, how be capable of this birth
10. replied Iesous and to him, you are the teacher the Israelites and this don't understand
11. truly truly say you that which comprehend speak and that which visible confirms but the testimony we don't grasp
12. If I tell you about the earthly existence and you don't believe me how will you be convinced if I tell you about celestial things
13. and nobody ascends into heaven since not from the heaven descended the offspring the human being
Jesus is answering Nicodemus's question of how can a man enter his mother's womb a second time. We have to keep everything in perspective.
Love and Light, Midge
Faithfulservent,
I'm not sure who this was address to but since my posts are the long ones I will reply. There was no copying and pasting other than me compiling them in my word document and then transfering them into this forum. Sorry if they were to long for you to read. I realize that some people don't like to read but due to the fact that I love to read I sometimes forget that not everybody has this passion. I just find it hard to condinse my thoughts. Please forgive me.
Love and Light, Marietta
You wrote: way to much cut and pasting... I didnt even read it.
I'm not sure who this was address to but since my posts are the long ones I will reply. There was no copying and pasting other than me compiling them in my word document and then transfering them into this forum. Sorry if they were to long for you to read. I realize that some people don't like to read but due to the fact that I love to read I sometimes forget that not everybody has this passion. I just find it hard to condinse my thoughts. Please forgive me.
Love and Light, Marietta
You wrote: way to much cut and pasting... I didnt even read it.
Faithfulservant
Well-Known Member
ok sacredstar #2. if you post huge compilation of thoughts and expect to get any intelligent conversation.. you have people who can only pick one thought out of a hundred and those thoughts all digress from the main thought of the insane going ons in the original post. nuff said.
T
Terrence
Guest
Hey Midge,
You're right, the qouted scripture is talking about the nation of Israel. However, a clear exgesis of scripture, I feel, will reveal that Israel is not only Jews, but made up of both Jews and Gentials, from every tribe, tounge, and nation. Pior to Eze. 36, God's 1st covernant were written in stone and man didnt keep it (they couldnt - but thats another story). The new covernant, written about in Eze. 36, is the one that Jesus inacted and it is written on the human heart. Anyone (both jew and gentials) who believes the gospel and responds to it by repenting and trusting in Jesus, will be saved. Jesus was explaining the new birth (as spoken about in Eze. 36) to Nicodemus, who being a teacher of the law, thought that you had to work for it. But, as the scriptures say, "Salvation is not by man's will, but of God." Jesus was trying to show Nicodemus that God is the one that causes the new birth to people whom God chooses and Nicodemus understood, but objected with ojections of absurdity. Nicodemus was a teacher of the law and was not stupid, he understood Jesus' teachings, but it was hard to accept. This is how I understand the scriptures. It is the same way that the early church believed it all through the ages to Augustine, to the Reformers, to the Pilgrims, to Jonathan Edwards and people after him to modern believers now. I simply dont see proof for any case for reincarnation, since it is only appointed "once" for a person to die then comes judgement.
Grace and Peace and Love,
Terrence
You're right, the qouted scripture is talking about the nation of Israel. However, a clear exgesis of scripture, I feel, will reveal that Israel is not only Jews, but made up of both Jews and Gentials, from every tribe, tounge, and nation. Pior to Eze. 36, God's 1st covernant were written in stone and man didnt keep it (they couldnt - but thats another story). The new covernant, written about in Eze. 36, is the one that Jesus inacted and it is written on the human heart. Anyone (both jew and gentials) who believes the gospel and responds to it by repenting and trusting in Jesus, will be saved. Jesus was explaining the new birth (as spoken about in Eze. 36) to Nicodemus, who being a teacher of the law, thought that you had to work for it. But, as the scriptures say, "Salvation is not by man's will, but of God." Jesus was trying to show Nicodemus that God is the one that causes the new birth to people whom God chooses and Nicodemus understood, but objected with ojections of absurdity. Nicodemus was a teacher of the law and was not stupid, he understood Jesus' teachings, but it was hard to accept. This is how I understand the scriptures. It is the same way that the early church believed it all through the ages to Augustine, to the Reformers, to the Pilgrims, to Jonathan Edwards and people after him to modern believers now. I simply dont see proof for any case for reincarnation, since it is only appointed "once" for a person to die then comes judgement.
Grace and Peace and Love,
Terrence
Marietta/Midge,
I've been reading your posts with great interest for awhile now, and it pains me to do this...
"Moderator Hat on"
Considering this is the Christianity forum, and re-incarnation is not considered part of Christian thought (on the whole), your posts concerning such are better suited in Comparative Studies, or Belief and Sprituality, or Liberal Christianity. And, yes I enjoy your thoughts. They are simply in the wrong area of CR forum. And NO, I am not judging you. I'm following the CR Code of conduct. Have you had the chance to read it yet? If not, then you can by clicking HERE.
Please note when you do read the COC, the part where it specifically states, no preaching or prosyletizing on any board.
Trying to educate backwater conservative Christians (like me for instance) in the Christian Forum, is in fact a form of both.
And, should you continue, I will be back to discuss directly with you, the issue at hand.
"Moderator hat off"
Please, respect your fellow members here (You and I are two of them as well).
v/r
Quahom
moderator, Christian forum
I've been reading your posts with great interest for awhile now, and it pains me to do this...
"Moderator Hat on"
Considering this is the Christianity forum, and re-incarnation is not considered part of Christian thought (on the whole), your posts concerning such are better suited in Comparative Studies, or Belief and Sprituality, or Liberal Christianity. And, yes I enjoy your thoughts. They are simply in the wrong area of CR forum. And NO, I am not judging you. I'm following the CR Code of conduct. Have you had the chance to read it yet? If not, then you can by clicking HERE.
Please note when you do read the COC, the part where it specifically states, no preaching or prosyletizing on any board.
Trying to educate backwater conservative Christians (like me for instance) in the Christian Forum, is in fact a form of both.
And, should you continue, I will be back to discuss directly with you, the issue at hand.
"Moderator hat off"
Please, respect your fellow members here (You and I are two of them as well).
v/r
Quahom
moderator, Christian forum