islamic tradition of non-violence?

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bananabrain

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i would like to ask a question about sources in the Qur'an and hadith which support the idea of an islamic tradition of "non-violence", or non-retaliation. i am particularly interested in:

1. the episode where muhammad gets stoned by the worshippers of al-lat in taif and then declines to take gabriel up on his offer of angelic retaliation.

2. sources for the sufi story of the old man who was beaten up by a rich man and then said "may you have everything you wish for", said to be based upon the example of muhammad.

3. the episode where muhammad sits with his unpleasant and abusive jewish neighbour on the latter's deathbed.

i would also be interested in (hopefully positive) responses from indian/pakistani/bangladeshi islamic scholars in particular, but islamic thinkers in general to gandhi's doctrine of satyagraha ( Satyagraha - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ) which he explicitly considered to be an expression of jihad.

b'shalom

bananabrain
 
Forgive my meager contribution, i quickly found this:

"There is no compulsion in religion."

(The Qur'an (Pickthall tr), Sura 2)


EDIT:s
If you wish to quickly scan the Qu'ran and Hadiths, ive found Ocean to be a good free online library of every major world religious scripture on the planet.

Ocean can be downloaded from Ocean - World Religions Free Research Library
 
bananabrain said:
i'm a bit disappointed by the lack of interest so far - come on muslims, i'm always being told "islam" is another word for "peace"; what about it?
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bananabrain said:
b'shalom
bananabrain
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Hi
Please surf through the website:Al Islam Online - Ahmadiyya Muslim Community
If you encounter any difficulty, I am here to explain to you, but may be by copy/paste from that site, one should be careful from bananabrain, I know.
Thanks
I am an Ahmadi - a peaceful faith in Islam
 
thank you, inhumility, but i am looking for specific sources from the Qur'an, ayat and hadith. i don't mind cut-and-paste from specific sources, as long as we're talking about a short paragraph, not reams and reams. and in reference to the site you point me at, that's not specific enough. i'm not going to hunt through the entire ahmadi community site (which is the same site you always point everyone at no matter what question is asked) in hopes of stumbling upon the right thing. if you give me a more specific link (or someone actually answers my earlier question) i'm more likely to visit it.

b'shalom

bananabrain
 
ok, well, that's all well and good, but even if the sources are mainstream, there's still more than enough wiggle room provided to allow for them to be interpreted to allow violence applied with judgement, which is not what i'm asking. furthermore, i would actually like a mainstream sunni viewpoint, i don't know if we have any shi'a on the board, actually, but am interested in those opinions as well. ahmadi opinions are, i know, hardly regarded as authoritative or normative even by many here and i am looking for something that would be acceptable at, say, al-azhar. it's all very well for the ahmadis to big their non-violent credentials up, but they're a minority (and, moreover, considered heretical by many, not that that is any of my business) and i'm looking for majority opinions.

b'shalom

bananabrain
 
bananabrain said:
ok, well, that's all well and good, but even if the sources are mainstream, there's still more than enough wiggle room provided to allow for them to be interpreted to allow violence applied with judgement, which is not what i'm asking. furthermore, i would actually like a mainstream sunni viewpoint, i don't know if we have any shi'a on the board, actually, but am interested in those opinions as well. ahmadi opinions are, i know, hardly regarded as authoritative or normative even by many here and i am looking for something that would be acceptable at, say, al-azhar. it's all very well for the ahmadis to big their non-violent credentials up, but they're a minority (and, moreover, considered heretical by many, not that that is any of my business) and i'm looking for majority opinions.
b'shalom
bananabrain
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Well thank you for your appreciation, and that was expected. Truth is truth, it is never thought of in terms of minority or majority or normative. When nobody was responding to your satisfaction only then I offered myself to provide. Goodluck,please
Thanks
I am an Ahmadi, a peaceful faith in Islam
 
look, inhumility, the status of ahmadiyya and mirza ghulam ahmad is not a matter for me; it is not my business whether you guys are considered heretical or not by the sunni and shi'a (and ismailis and so on) but if i start trying to have a conversation with a sunni or shi'a about this and s/he finds out my sources are ahmadi, then immediately s/he can say "oh, well, what do you expect of that lot, they're not proper muslims". as i say, that is not my concern, but it harms my ability to have the discussion.

i remain, however, presently disappointed that none of the brothers and sisters here who are so vociferous on other subjects see fit to respond on this one.

b'shalom

bananabrain
 
Re: Islam is most peaceful amongst all the Revealed Religions

bananabrain said:
look, inhumility, the status of ahmadiyya and mirza ghulam ahmad is not a matter for me; it is not my business whether you guys are considered heretical or not by the sunni and shi'a (and ismailis and so on) but if i start trying to have a conversation with a sunni or shi'a about this and s/he finds out my sources are ahmadi, then immediately s/he can say "oh, well, what do you expect of that lot, they're not proper muslims". as i say, that is not my concern, but it harms my ability to have the discussion.
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bananabrain said:
i remain, however, presently disappointed that none of the brothers and sisters here who are so vociferous on other subjects see fit to respond on this one.
b'shalom
bananabrain
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Hi
Never mind what they say about us, that we can face ourselves, you please don’t worry.
You did not mention, the purpose of your queries in your post I think, nevertheless I answered. Even if you are discussing this issue with the Shias or Sunnis or whatever denomination; you would be presenting verses from Quran or Hadith and for that you don't have to necessarily give quotations from Ahmadia website, you could give quotation from the Shia sources if you are discussing with a Shia, or from the Sunni sources if you are discussing with a Sunni. Our sources would provide you the useful references only from Quran and Hadith that would be valid for them from their own sources, as the basic sources are common. Then you would also get the arguments provided in that connection, which would provide you the link or logic behind, you need not unnecessarily quote that your view point is Ahmadia view point. You would see an amazing effect, you never would have thought of. Have a try at least.
One thing I must tell you, that Quran in Arabic is the same in all the Islamic denominations Shias, Sunnis, Ahle-Hadith sometimes called Wahabis. Hadith is not the same between Shias and Sunnis. If you present a Hadith from a Sunni source to a Shia, it would have no effect on him, your effort would be wasted and the vice versa. But in Ahmadia literature you would find both Shia Hadith and Sunni Hadith only you have to know if it has been quoted from the Shia Books or Sunni Books. It is safe if you train yourself in the Quran say 90% of you view point is based in Quran and only 10% is based in Hadith (5% from Shia and 5% from Sunni or a blend of it).I doubt if you would receive any useful reply from any Shia or Sunni these days due to obvious reasons.
I only suggested that you surf our website, you would get useful material from which you can collect references of verses of Quran and Hadith and then you could discuss with anybody in humility with confidence. You are my friend.
Thanks
I am an Ahmadi – a peaceful faith in Islam, working for unity of all the religions with peaceful means.

 
Re: Islam is most peaceful amongst all the Revealed Religions

inhumility said:
Hi
Never mind what they say about us, that we can face ourselves, you please don’t worry.
You did not mention, the purpose of your queries in your post I think, nevertheless I answered. Even if you are discussing this issue with the Shias or Sunnis or whatever denomination; you would be presenting verses from Quran or Hadith and for that you don't have to necessarily give quotations from Ahmadia website, you could give quotation from the Shia sources if you are discussing with a Shia, or from the Sunni sources if you are discussing with a Sunni. Our sources would provide you the useful references only from Quran and Hadith that would be valid for them from their own sources, as the basic sources are common. Then you would also get the arguments provided in that connection, which would provide you the link or logic behind, you need not unnecessarily quote that your view point is Ahmadia view point. You would see an amazing effect, you never would have thought of. Have a try at least.
One thing I must tell you, that Quran in Arabic is the same in all the Islamic denominations Shias, Sunnis, Ahle-Hadith sometimes called Wahabis. Hadith is not the same between Shias and Sunnis. If you present a Hadith from a Sunni source to a Shia, it would have no effect on him, your effort would be wasted and the vice versa. But in Ahmadia literature you would find both Shia Hadith and Sunni Hadith only you have to know if it has been quoted from the Shia Books or Sunni Books. It is safe if you train yourself in the Quran say 90% of you view point is based in Quran and only 10% is based in Hadith (5% from Shia and 5% from Sunni or a blend of it).I doubt if you would receive any useful reply from any Shia or Sunni these days due to obvious reasons.
I only suggested that you surf our website, you would get useful material from which you can collect references of verses of Quran and Hadith and then you could discuss with anybody in humility with confidence. You are my friend.
Thanks
I am an Ahmadi – a peaceful faith in Islam, working for unity of all the religions with peaceful means.
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This is a nasty divisive post.

Most Sunnis and Shias get along fine, this Eid I prayed in a Shia Mosque and there were plenty of other Sunnis there.

I am afraid whilst preaching 'peaceful Islam', Ahmadis seem to spend most of their time trying to 'big up ' the divide between Sunnis and Shias.

I have Shia friends and they have a range of different views as do we Sunnis, sometime I find myself in agreement with a Shia friend as oposed to a Sunni friend.

I suggest that you start to practice your 'peaceful Islam' rather than attempt to exasperate divides or potential divides.

You disgust me.
 
Re: Islam is most peaceful amongst all the Revealed Religions

Abubakar said:
This is a nasty divisive post,
I suggest that you start to practice your 'peaceful Islam' rather than attempt to exasperate divides or potential divides.
You disgust me.
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i know nothing of the specifics of this argument/debate, but i can grasp tones. from where i'm sat inhumility has tried to engage in conversation and is being spat at with various empty justifications for this. you say he is divisive yet you push him away instead of trying to unite with him which is what he's trying to do with you. of course i'm not a muslim and this isn't my show but i am a human and i can speak out if i feel someones being demeaned unnecessarily. respectfully jase
so much for non violence/hate.
 
working for unity of all the Revealed Religions, peacefully

chakraman said:
i know nothing of the specifics of this argument/debate, but i can grasp tones. from where i'm sat inhumility has tried to engage in conversation and is being spat at with various empty justifications for this. you say he is divisive yet you push him away instead of trying to unite with him which is what he's trying to do with you. of course i'm not a muslim and this isn't my show but i am a human and i can speak out if i feel someones being demeaned unnecessarily. respectfully jase
Click to expand...
chakraman said:
so much for non violence/hate.
Click to expand...


Thank you my friend and brother in humanity. Anybody who is peaceful, some people start animosity against them. It is a very simple thing to understand that somebody who does not consider others humans, how could he understand truthful religion or message from GodAllahYHWH, which is and would remain always peaceful.
Thanks again
I am an Ahmadi - a peaceful faith in Islam, working for unity of all the Revealed Religions with peaceful means.
 
wil said:
Namaste BB.
I clicked twice and stumbled on this from his link....there are a number of quotes included..
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Hi
Thanks for clicking on to website alislam.org, actually by visiting once or twice to a website doen not make one familiar of the facilities availabe there, For doing a research work as BB intends to do, he has to be familiar with that site. Since 99% of our programmes are not done by professionals but by volunteers that make it more appropriate for more visits. If one opens the home page of alislam.org, one sees:
Digital Media Library
Search Engine
dml.gif

Searchable Library of Arabic & English programs, Liqa Maal Arabmore...
by clicking on the word more.... above one opens up the digital meida library:
hdr-search.gif

(e.g. Islam, Jesus, Jihad)

Keyword List
hdr-browse.gif
hdr-by-language.gif
• Arabic • English • Urdu • Bangla • French • All
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Bangla Mulaqat Dars-ul-Quran English Mulaqat French Mulaqat Friday Sermon Liqamaal Arab Majlis-e-Irfan English Majlis-e-Irfan Urdu Tarjamat-ul-Quran Urdu Class Urdu Mulaqat
hdr-view-all.gif

hdr-about-dml.gif
The Al Islam Digital Media Library is an ambitious project that aims to catalog and make accessible all of the premium audio and video content of the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community. Currently, the Digital Media Library contains content from the popular Arab/English, Bangla/English, and French/English Question-Answer programs.
Now using the search engine, one could get answers to any type of religious questions and resources, mostly answered by our late caliph, Mirza Tahir Ahmad, whose photograph appears above, and who died some years ago. One could read or listen to the answers.
The website is purely non-commercial and religious only for the guidance of humanity the world over. It is free, and no donations are asked for. Personally I neither run the show there,nor anybody knows me there.
Thanks
I am an Ahmadi - a peaceful faith in Islam,working for unity of all the revealed religions.
 
Re: working for unity of all the Revealed Religions, peacefully

inhumility said:
Thank you my friend and brother in humanity. Anybody who is peaceful, some people start animosity against them. It is a very simple thing to understand that somebody who does not consider others humans, how could he understand truthful religion or message from GodAllahYHWH, which is and would remain always peaceful.
Thanks again
I am an Ahmadi - a peaceful faith in Islam, working for unity of all the Revealed Religions with peaceful means.
Click to expand...

If i may humbly ask, does that include the Baha'i Faith?
 
Thus, if they let you be, and do not make war on you, and offer you peace, God does not allow you to harm them.] (An-Nisaa' 4:90)


If even a little sparrow has been killed unjustly, it will appear before the Lord of the worlds crying for justice!"(An-Nasa'i, Ad-Darami, and Ahmad) Books of hadith



Take not life, which Allah hath made sacred, except by way of justice and law: thus does He command you, that ye may learn wisdom.) (Al-An`am 6: 151)

any one slew a person - unless it be for murder or for spreading mischief in the land - it would be as if he slew the whole people: and if any one saved a life, it would be as if he saved the life of the whole people.) (Al-Ma’idah 5:32)

Allah commands justice, the doing of good, and liberality to kith and kin, and He forbids all shameful deeds, and injustice and rebellion: He instructs you, that ye may receive admonition." (An-Nahl: 90)


Just a few quotes from the Quran and Hadith
you may also find this helpful
Non-Violence and Islam
Salaam
 
Re: Islam is most peaceful amongst all the Revealed Religions

chakraman said:
i know nothing of the specifics of this argument/debate, but i can grasp tones. from where i'm sat inhumility has tried to engage in conversation and is being spat at with various empty justifications for this. you say he is divisive yet you push him away instead of trying to unite with him which is what he's trying to do with you. of course i'm not a muslim and this isn't my show but i am a human and i can speak out if i feel someones being demeaned unnecessarily. respectfully jase
so much for non violence/hate.
Click to expand...
Sallaam Jase,

I quite understand your post and your sentiments but I am afraid it may be because you are not a Muslim or just a thoroughly decent person that you have failed to pick up on inhumility's meaning behind the gloss.

He is not seeking to unite with me but to subdue my beliefs beneath his own, I am a Muslim (as it happens a Sunni Muslim, but that is not important). Inhumility attempts to reinforce the false perceptions that Muslims who come from different threads (specifically Sunni and Shia Muslims) are divided along Religious lines, constantly at each other throats and in fact enemies. This is false. Not true.

Yes there are areas of conflict between Sunni and Shia Muslims, much publicised in the Middle East (namely Iraq), but even there most Muslims of different hues get along fine , including plenty of inter-marriage and mixed families. I am not denying there is a problem there but how much is religious and how much tribal or political is open to question.

I can understand that you may not have a good knowledge of these matters and have been mislead into believing the type of guff that inhumility is dishing out (along with western journalists who are spoonfed 'information' inside the green zone) but inhumility KNOWS that he is not telling the truth, He is lying and however sugar coated the pill is it is nasty and unIslamic behavour from him.

If you are unclear about anything that I have written please feel free to ask, however blunt the question, I may be off the board for a week or so (holiday in Gambia !) but will reply when I get back.

Peace
 
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