Amida and Jesus

[InLove]

I have a question on my mind which has probably been asked a million times over the ages. But those kind of questions are probably the best ones anyway. I hope.

So here goes: If I am attached to Christ, but Christ, to me is the empty vessel of the Loving One, then I would not think this would be an attachment that would prevent Oneness. Comments?

InPeace,
InLove

 

[Vajradhara]

Namaste InLove,

thank you for the thoughtful reply.

Vaj, you asked me about whether I was introduced to these thoughts through meditation. I suppose one could call it meditation, but it seems more like a state of being to me.

when a being is sufficiently practiced with various meditational techniques, the experience does not leave when one gets up from the cushion.. it is maintained throughout all states of awareness.. there is a popular Zen Mondo about a butcher who reveals the nature of concentration to a new monk simply by his concentration on his task.

I guess I might describe it as “praying constantly”. But there is no set formula to these prayers most of the time, save that the Name of Jesus is always present—but it isn’t Christ to whom I pray. It is through Him, and I see Him as my constant Companion, because of the Holy Spirit of God.

i'm unclear on the significance of the word "Companion".. i.e. why the capitalzation.. does this term have some special significance in your understanding?

Anyway, as far as the “established Christian traditions of meditation” go, I find it terribly limiting, and nearly impossible to fit sincerely and neatly into any particular pocket of Christian theology (and this is most definitely not from a lack of effort!), or to experience prayer any less than all the time.

you've investigated the Franciscians and the meditational teachings of the Desert Fathers and found them lacking? interesting. for any other reader, this link may be of some interest:

The World Community for Christian Meditation

I am aware that sometimes I sound quite fundamentalist to many liberals, but at the same time, most fundamentalists seem to think I am a radical liberal. So where and when do I rest? Where can I live? The answer is “in the present moment”.

i find myself in the same position, quite often

The best guess I have about the reason for this is that in the Pureland Tradition, there seems to be a particular emphasis on (I hope I say this correctly) kyosei. From what I understand, this is about the idea of us all being born together. So, even though I may face physical death apparently alone, I am connected with others. And we are basically all One.

i'll only say this about that... Buddhism does not teach Monoism.. all things are not One... this is a particular school of Buddhist thought and one which, if i may, is somewhat "unorthodox" in its approach.

at the same time, we say that each sentient being is precisely equal, in that all wish to live happy lives free of suffering and hardship and, from this point of view, all beings are considered as equal to oneself.

if, as you are saying, all beings are One, then it would follow that no being would be reborn through karma as the Buddha stopped that. however, we see that the Buddha doesn't say that this is so.. in point of fact, each being must continue on the path, aided by the Sangha and other wise beings but it is we, and we alone, that must Cross to the Other Shore.

There is purpose in physical death, and it is beneficial, not only to me, but to “posterity”. The reasons for this may be explained differently in Buddhism than in Christianity, but in me there is no conflict here.

all arisen phenomena contain within the seeds for their eventual decomposition.. or, to say it another way; all compounded things decay.

[/quote] But I feel certain that Amida walks in compassion, and at present, I see no threat for me from this vision.

InPeace,
InLove[/quote]

just curious.. in what manner have you determined that the being manifesting to you is Buddha Amida?

metta,

~v

 

[InLove]

Namaste & thank you, Vaj, for offering me such patience and kindness. I don't have but just a minute for this post--there is an ailing rosebush calling me and I must answer. But just a couple of quick thoughts in response, and then I will come back later in more depth.

Very briefly, the capitalization here of "Companion" is simply my personal way of honoring what many Christians, including myself, refer to as the Holy Spirit. This Spirit is a manifestation, in my thinking, that is without limit, and in simple Christian terms, a Comfort, a Guide, and (for those who feel it must be stated more systematically), the Third Person of the Trinity. The way I have used it here indicates the connection between and within Christ. Of course, this isn't all I could say, for there are mountains of words already written in the attempt to explain. You may already know most of this, but I am typing my clarification for others who might be curious as well.

In regard to the Desert Fathers: Sadly, no--I am intensely drawn to what I have heard and read in this area, but I still lack so much in my understanding. Thomas and earl and Tariki and Snoopy and several others have introduced me to these wonderful, mystical, "heretical" thinkers, and I do tend to identify with so much of what they have offered. Perhaps I never knew these things before (except inside of me) simply because I was not exposed to any Christian Traditions other than Protestant ones when I was growing up. (Up until I joined CR, I had actually had more direct interaction with Buddhists and Muslims than with Christians more closely connected to Roman or Greek Orthodoxy. Even right now, I don't know how to say what I am trying to say, lol! Forgive me, my friends! Heck, I had only met one other Episcopalian before I met lunamoth, and Episcopalians are Protestant!) So it is a wonderful thing for me to discover, and I am in the process of investigating.

I had better get to the rosebush now. I'll address some more of your comments later on. I have a feeling they will take a bit more thought on my part than the ones I have noted above! Thank you, thank you!

InPeace,
InLove

 

[InLove]

Just to clear things up a bit...my husband informs me that the Episcopalian Church is not really considered Protestant. After I typed that, I thought about it, and asked him. I think he is right. Anyway, sorry, everyone--especially luna---if I goofed there.

InPeace,
InLove

 

[Tariki]

I have a question on my mind which has probably been asked a million times over the ages. But those kind of questions are probably the best ones anyway. I hope.

So here goes: If I am attached to Christ, but Christ, to me is the empty vessel of the Loving One, then I would not think this would be an attachment that would prevent Oneness. Comments?

InPeace,
InLove

InLove,

Reading your question, the following popped into my mind.............a short verse or two from "The Dark Night of the Soul" by the Christian mystic St John of the Cross............

I had no guide, no light,
save that which burned within my heart.
And yet this light did guide my way
more surely than the noonday sun
unto a place where waited One
who knew me well.
A place where none appeared.

 

[InLove]

Thank you, Tariki and Vaj.

I suppose that if I had to file my card in a particular folder, then perhaps “Christian Mysticism” would do just about as well as any. I am pretty sure by now that I am never going to be “orthodox” anything, which may partly explain why I am drawn to Pureland contemplations. But at this point in my life, I can’t see myself entering into any kind of formal study anywhere. There is a path for me, and it is custom-made. I can look back and see that I have actually been on this very path for a long time, and indeed, here is where I can be as happy and as assured as anyone can be, whether in times of suffering or in times of ease. And it allows for me to explore and connect with people of a multitude of faiths and philosophies wherever possible. It looks to me like I am right where I am supposed to be.

So, why Amida? Vaj, you asked me the following:

just curious.. in what manner have you determined that the being manifesting to you is Buddha Amida?

The short answer, I think, is probably the compassionate understanding I perceived in the attitude of certain students or devotees or whatever I should call them. LOL, not “followers”, I guess. There is a beautiful simplicity surrounding what I know of Pureland that I have found and may continue to find helpful in what is left of this daily life as I know it. It is not like a sentimental embrace; there is something more, and it is something I recognize. Perhaps Amida symbolizes something to me that I can embrace, or in which I am embraced.

Another possible answer is that I needed help in a certain area. I am not physically well, and there is much that goes along with my condition that I am attempting to balance. Perhaps it did not necessarily have to be Amida, but that is who I “saw”, not as in some kind of picture, but in a deeper way. It might be worth noting that I went through a particularly rough spell last summer, and in a critical moment, (I need to speak “Christian” here) I asked God to let me stay here, even if it was painful, at least long enough to untangle some of what I had been taught in regard to the “salvation” of others. I wasn’t attempting to make a bargain, but I just did not want to leave this realm with a misunderstanding about this, since it seemed so important to so many Christians to see an either/or solution. It is not necessary for me to go into lots of detail here, but (and this may sound simple-minded to some), I “saw” Christ who assured me that I was in for a wonderful adventure. And as I alluded to earlier, I am more than satisfied with a peek or hint into that mysterious answer, and I don’t need to know all the specifics. For now, the idea that “self” and “other” are connected is sufficient for me.

And by the way, I would like to say that in regard to this thread so far, I have found myself to be in very good company all around. Thank you. I hope I have offered something worth your reading time here, as I certainly have received some helpful thoughts from all of you.

InPeace,
InLove

 

[earl]

Thank you for sharing that InLove. I, too, don't sweat the "orthodoxy" or whether I "fit into" certain traditions. I think your "vision" informing you is right, we are all part of a wonderful adventure in Life (and no doubt to me through and beyond Death), though it can be awfully hard to see stuff as a "wonderful adventure" when things ain't goin' well. best wishes always, earl

 

[InLove]

Thanks earl. I hope I didn't cause you any consternation by stirring up those Christo-Buddhist waters again.

And I appreciate the leeway afforded me here in the Buddhist gardens. By allowing me to speak the way I have, you have added to my peace and helped me understand something that otherwise might have taken much longer. I bow deeply....

InPeace,
InLove

 

[Vajradhara]

Namaste InLove,

thank you for the post.

well.. it's nothing special on our part.. it's part of our tradition to be welcoming to other religious points of view and, moreover, to dialog with those followers and attempt to understand, as much as possible, their points of view

metta,

~v

 

[Snoopy]

Pure Land was a purely Chinese origination.

Well slap me with a very robust fish, wherever did I get that notion from? Thanks for that, a little bit of delusion washed away.

s.