Bruce Michael
Well-Known Member
John 4:16-18
The five husbands are the five senses, being then healed by the "living water".
John 4:13-15
-Br. Bruce
The Woman by the Well
- Thread starter Bruce Michael
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The five husbands are the five senses, being then healed by the "living water".
-Br. Bruce
Caimanson
Mind or spirit?
Hi Bruce, how do you come to that conclusion?
I'm curious.
I'm curious.
pattimax
Somewhat returning
You don't see it?!
Another scripture about seperating yourself from the illusion of reality, leaving your five senses for a better way...the leper at the pools of bethesda...
Caimanson
Mind or spirit?
I love this and all the other personal encounters jesus has on the book of John: nicodemus, the adulterous woman, etc.
I hear what you say wil, makes sense, I can appreciate the the added dimension to the text, thanks for that.
Though if true it is a shame it is veiled for the uninitiated, like it was an occult writing. Wonder how much of the bible is concealed this way.
I hear what you say wil, makes sense, I can appreciate the the added dimension to the text, thanks for that.
Though if true it is a shame it is veiled for the uninitiated, like it was an occult writing. Wonder how much of the bible is concealed this way.
pattimax
Somewhat returning
Is that what it's saying? I don't think so. The only connection to the senses is through the mind. Jesus was letting her understand who He was and what he represented and what He offered.
You can pull all kinds of wonderful, philosophical, arguments out of the bible, but I think you lose what His purpose was. Separating self is something we all need to do, but I don't think it is in this verse.
You can pull all kinds of wonderful, philosophical, arguments out of the bible, but I think you lose what His purpose was. Separating self is something we all need to do, but I don't think it is in this verse.
Dondi
Well-Known Member
Why can't people takes things at face value? Why must there be some "secret knowledge" to everything?
If these "husbands" are the five senses, then who is "he whom thou now hast is not thy husband"?
If these "husbands" are the five senses, then who is "he whom thou now hast is not thy husband"?
LeoSalinas22
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hey caimanson,
how about all of it?
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LeoSalinas22
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yes, that is true, but would you agree that we have to chew our food instead of just swallow? for instance, on the "cursed for seeing your dad naked" thread, i learned that nakedness back then meant someone's wife. never, unless i would have read the scriptures explaining this, would that have been understood that way. we have to chew our food and really see how it tastes if we are to understand scripture. in other words, reading alone won't help you understand the bible. there is a certain way to read the bible, not just read it, you know?
Caimanson
Mind or spirit?
The sixth sense?
Just kidding
Was just thinking, sometimes stories mean different things to different people, songs touch people in different ways...
If the husbands are literal, in what way is a metaphorical interpretation harmful if you find it beneficial?
For example wine, bread, oil, they all have second meanings in lots of places in the bible.
the last fellow is well worth discussing!
As to the 'secret knowledge' a lot of it wasn't so secret back then, every single place name, every persons name had a meaning, a trait, this is why Moses asked the bush what is your name, name would provide info, and not just lineage...I am that I am provided plenty! But as you read the bible she named him x because it meant y, they named the well x because it meant y.... it was common knowledge that stories meant more than the stories.
Lose the purpose? I think we expand it. Yes there is the historical context, the social/societal implications, the literal translation, but then also who is telling the story and why...there are intense differences between Mathew Mark Luke and John due to the perspectives of the writers, yes and then there are deeper meanings to be contemplated and personal meanings...moments of amazing clarity that come to a scripture that apply to one's life right in this moment...
And again....there exists more to that story...when you pull out the meanings of the names of each of the sons, and noah, and examine the aspect of what else it could mean to be laying naked...our innermost beliefs exposed, our trust taken, our thoughts ravaged...
I don't think anyone tosses out the literal when they move into the layers...some say seven layers of meanings....I think seventy times seven...(ie infinite)
yessir...
pattimax
Somewhat returning
The gospels focused on Jesus, who He was, and what He represented.
There is a huge difference in reading the bible and understanding what it is teaching or just trying to pull out things that aren't there.
Cursed for seeing (etc.) his wifes nakedness, not watching her sweep the tent.
LeoSalinas22
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hello patti,
that is true, alot of what is in the gospels is straightforward, but when you come across a book like Revelation, what then? that is when you have to really think and pray about what you are reading.
you are right, but what if you miss something that is there. i don't know about you but it has happened more times than i can count that where i read something in the bible and then a few months later i read it again and behold, something new!
watching her sweep the tent?
pattimax
Somewhat returning
pattimax
Somewhat returning
Yes, all the time and yes, new lessons to be learned in new ways. But when you start down the slippery slope of adding things, it is hard to stop. The solution is not to start.
The tent thing was a joke. Forget it.
BlaznFattyz
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lol, but really
.the woman by the well represents poor, lowly and despised man living in sin and in need of salvation and gods love that all should find everlasting life. having 1 adulterous affair was bad and probably, but 5 shows the extent of gods forgiveness to everyone.
jesus knowing she was living in sin, did not condemn her, which was what others who acted holier than thou did at the time--not allowing certain people into the temple to worship or even considering them unclean and ignored. rather, jesus offered her living water and her showing faith accepted his offer. there she passed from death to eternal life thru faith.
LeoSalinas22
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lol, but really
the woman by the well represents poor, lowly and despised man living in sin and in need of salvation and gods love that all should find everlasting life. having 1 adulterous affair was bad and probably, but 5 shows the extent of gods forgiveness to everyone.
jesus knowing she was living in sin, did not condemn her, which was what others who acted holier than thou did at the time--not allowing certain people into the temple to worship or even considering them unclean and ignored. rather, jesus offered her living water and her showing faith accepted his offer. there she passed from death to eternal life thru faith.
amen, blazn! amen. i didn't see it that way, but this is one example of another "layer" that is uncovered. a different way of seeing what isn't there if you don't chew your food correctly.
Caimanson
Mind or spirit?
That's what I like about the jesus of John, his grace and that intimate understanding of whoever he was speaking to.
He spoke to the heart.
Are we expanding, or exploring what is written and the meanings behind it?
Gen 26:20-23 But the herdsmen of Gerar quarreled with Isaac's herdsmen and said, "The water is ours!" So he named the well Esek, because they disputed with him. Then they dug another well, but they quarreled over that one also; so he named it Sitnah. He moved on from there and dug another well, and no one quarreled over it. He named it Rehoboth, saying, "Now the LORD has given us room and we will flourish in the land."
Now if we dug a well today would we name it? If we built a house would we name it? Odds are not likely...but we do with ranches and the like and we name them as they did long ago, based on a deeper meaning. Esek-disputes, Sitnah-quarrels, Rehobeth blessings, flourish....
Do we look in baby books at baby names and meanings...where do we think these meanings come from... the twelve tribes...read when they were born and the traits attributed to them...every name in the bible...sure they maybe referring to an actual situation...but there also exists a story in the story.
Namaste Blazn, and yes...that is one huge lesson right there...one we should all remember.
Oh, I guess I just gotta jump in on this one.
I don't see a problem with considering layers of meaning in the account of the woman at the well. However, I tend to look at it as mainly that--an historical account. The reason I look at it this way is because, well, it is presented as such. Now if it was presented as a parable or a vision or a dream, then I say layers upon layers upon however many layers one may find. That said, the writer of John was a creative, insightful, apparently faithful follower of Christ. So I would say that if the account is literal, than other layers of insight could be there in the reading, as well. What I like to do is make sure that whatever metaphor or symbolism I find from an account is consistent with its literal content. Does that make any sense?
InPeace,
InLove
I don't see a problem with considering layers of meaning in the account of the woman at the well. However, I tend to look at it as mainly that--an historical account. The reason I look at it this way is because, well, it is presented as such. Now if it was presented as a parable or a vision or a dream, then I say layers upon layers upon however many layers one may find. That said, the writer of John was a creative, insightful, apparently faithful follower of Christ. So I would say that if the account is literal, than other layers of insight could be there in the reading, as well. What I like to do is make sure that whatever metaphor or symbolism I find from an account is consistent with its literal content. Does that make any sense?
InPeace,
InLove
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