Muslimwoman
Coexistence insha'Allah
Did you both ever come to a conclusion?
Cultural Ties and Religion
- Thread starter InLove
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Did you both ever come to a conclusion?
Muslimwoman
Coexistence insha'Allah
Hi All
I don't have any answers as I converted but I do have a comment if I may. I have been amazed how many people, behind closed doors, tell me they have thought during adulthood of converting to a different religion but felt unable to as they just couldn't let go of the religion they were taught in childhood. When I question them it seems that it is not a question of faith but more a feeling of being a 'traitor', of letting people down.
Perhaps this comes from our religious teachers who drum it into us that "we are on the right path and if you leave it you go to hell"? When you think about it this is quite a huge threat to put in a child's mind. I know this sounds like a wierd thing to say but perhaps we should have no specific religion as children (as all children are accepted by G-d without judgement) and then we all get to choose our religion when we reach adulthood?
I don't have any answers as I converted but I do have a comment if I may. I have been amazed how many people, behind closed doors, tell me they have thought during adulthood of converting to a different religion but felt unable to as they just couldn't let go of the religion they were taught in childhood. When I question them it seems that it is not a question of faith but more a feeling of being a 'traitor', of letting people down.
Perhaps this comes from our religious teachers who drum it into us that "we are on the right path and if you leave it you go to hell"? When you think about it this is quite a huge threat to put in a child's mind. I know this sounds like a wierd thing to say but perhaps we should have no specific religion as children (as all children are accepted by G-d without judgement) and then we all get to choose our religion when we reach adulthood?
flowperson
Oannes
My apologies for the slight derailment, although it isn't completely out of the ballpark...(I like doing that.)
Someone told me the reason Catholic Priests couldn't get married is to insure no heirs and they would leave all to the church.
Is this true?
If this is common knowledge... oh well...
I haven't heard that one, and I'm not Catholic so I have had no knowledgeable conversations with priests to know if it is true or not. Maybe someone else can shed light on your question.
flow....
Postcard to Snoopy...Because they wanted to use birth control (condoms, which according to legend were invented by Henry) ? Thereafter the COE presumedly allowed them and the Roman Church still does not.
Flow....
If this had been explained to Sir Thomas More I'm sure he would have understood and not have to have been beheaded.
s.
e.g. Ashoka and the patronage of Buddhism across India (and hence beyond)...
"...last major emperor in the Mauryan dynasty of India. His vigorous patronage of Buddhism during his reign (c. 265–238 [SIZE=-1]BC[/SIZE]; also given as c. 273–232 [SIZE=-1]BC[/SIZE]) furthered the expansion of that religion throughout India."
Asoka -- Encyclopaedia Britannica
s.
Nowadays I think the CoE is popular (hang on a minute.... it isn't popular....anyway, moving on) ... as popular as it is, because it combines religion and nationalism (not necessarily bad nationalism). Which might also explain its decline in recent years - nationalism has become deeply unfashionable and some people seem to regard love of England as next only to rampant racism .
In Triumph of the Moon Ronald Hutton explains the growth of neo-paganism in terms of the wider culture. Reverance for nature and interest in the pagan gods (particularly the greek and roman gods) grew up with the romantic poets etc, forming the cultural basis for a nature religion. From a personal perspective my parents (father - atheist, mother - agnostic) brought me up with a love of nature and a feeling that religion is something to be sincere about (my mother deeply offended my aunt by refusing to be a godparent - 'How can I promise to help to bring up a child in a religion that isn't mine, in front of a God I don't believe in?'). These influences can be seen in my 'choice' of religion, although I don't feel like I made a choice as such, it's just what I am.
Culture is one influence that makes people what they are, and therefore has an influence on what religion feels right to them. It might be that they reject their culture and turn to an exotic religion or something like Satanism, but that's still (partially at least) a result of the culture.
That's my tuppence anyway.
.In Triumph of the Moon Ronald Hutton explains the growth of neo-paganism in terms of the wider culture. Reverance for nature and interest in the pagan gods (particularly the greek and roman gods) grew up with the romantic poets etc, forming the cultural basis for a nature religion. From a personal perspective my parents (father - atheist, mother - agnostic) brought me up with a love of nature and a feeling that religion is something to be sincere about (my mother deeply offended my aunt by refusing to be a godparent - 'How can I promise to help to bring up a child in a religion that isn't mine, in front of a God I don't believe in?'). These influences can be seen in my 'choice' of religion, although I don't feel like I made a choice as such, it's just what I am.
Culture is one influence that makes people what they are, and therefore has an influence on what religion feels right to them. It might be that they reject their culture and turn to an exotic religion or something like Satanism, but that's still (partially at least) a result of the culture.
That's my tuppence anyway.
I see the same thing in denominations from inside one religion. I gave up Christianity when the dogma and stories of elementary school wouldn't fit with the world around me...in the course of my exploration I returned to Christianity. However I was know able to understand the stories in a light that fit with my life. To my family and friends...and many here on CR I don't fit their mold. And they thought me blasphemous...however after years of conversation, discussion and book exchanges, my family enjoys my understanding and my church...
pattimax
Somewhat returning
I haven't heard that one, and I'm not Catholic so I have had no knowledgeable conversations with priests to know if it is true or not. Maybe someone else can shed light on your question.
flow....
I didn't know being Catholic was a requirement for an answer. After considering the question, I see it could be percieved as Catholic-bashing. That wasn't my intention.
Quick comment here--patti, I don't think our extremely understanding Catholics here would take your comment in a personal way. The tone of your post was not negative, just questioning. And I'm pretty sure flow didn't take it that way, either. From what I know of him, he's not usually averse to questioning authority of any kind, are ya my friend?
In other words, I doubt there are any worries.
I've been kind of busy elsewhere this weekend, but I'll get back to this very interesting thread soon. Thanks for the discussion, everyone.
InPeace,
InLove
In other words, I doubt there are any worries.
I've been kind of busy elsewhere this weekend, but I'll get back to this very interesting thread soon. Thanks for the discussion, everyone.
InPeace,
InLove
I think it's a pretty widespread phenomenon nowadays : giving up the religion we were born in for another one because it sounds/feels exotic... It's a pretty funny twist of the usual dynamics between religion and culture (i.e "I am part of the religion I was born in"), because people tend to be overly critical of their "original" religion and tend not to see the bad things about other religions. Which gives us stuff like Westerners idealizing any kind of "Eastern" spirituality or religion because, well, let's face it, it comes from a far away land, it's pretty, and it's, wow, exotic.
---> Karma Cola, Marketing the Mystic East ; Gita Mehta
Random House Academic Resources | Karma Cola by Gita Mehta
The book mocks the 60's, 70's wave of 'Easticism' but I think what Mehta says is still true today.
flowperson
Oannes
What ????? Me question authority ????? Naaaahhhhh !!!!
By the way Patti...my intuition tells me that the marriage ban placed upon Catholic priests has more to do with the traditions of the "celebacy" thingy as opposed to any economic considerations. Besides, many priestly orders, not to mention sisterly orders "require" vows of poverty from its adherents. No...I believe that this all has to do with the preservation and continuation of the essential qualities of leadership within the Catholic Church at large somehow...Thomas? ...Anything to add?
flow....
By the way Patti...my intuition tells me that the marriage ban placed upon Catholic priests has more to do with the traditions of the "celebacy" thingy as opposed to any economic considerations. Besides, many priestly orders, not to mention sisterly orders "require" vows of poverty from its adherents. No...I believe that this all has to do with the preservation and continuation of the essential qualities of leadership within the Catholic Church at large somehow...Thomas? ...Anything to add?
flow....
pattimax
Somewhat returning
But wasn't money placed inapproriately high on their list? (You know, the buying of "indulgences.")
pohaikawahine
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Deep in my cultural roots we had no religion, but a "way of life" that maintained a balance with the universe, our earth, and each other .... interesting enough this was in a way destroyed or rather I should say buried deeply again because of "religion" .... but even now in different "religions" I see seeds of truth that existed in our ancient ways .... so I have returned full circle and seek the "balance" again in the way I live my life .... I am drawn to Judiasm because the Torah holds a deep truth that strikes a cord with my cultural ties .... I do believe that the "promised land" is open to anyone that finds "the way" .... he hawai'i au, pohaikawahine
flowperson
Oannes
Aloha nui Poh:
So good to have you here to share your great wisdom with us again. Just wanted to say mahalo and welcome back.
flow....
So good to have you here to share your great wisdom with us again. Just wanted to say mahalo and welcome back.
flow....
My childhood religion was the David Caradine TV series, "Kung-Fu". It had a profound effect on both my father and myself. Lol - but it's true! I think this, coupled with a general "Christian" sense of morality was my grounding, when growing up. Does anyone else have a similar tale?
As our society becomes more media-based I wonder if spirituality will be led more by Websites & TV than by temples & churches?
... Neemai
As our society becomes more media-based I wonder if spirituality will be led more by Websites & TV than by temples & churches?
... Neemai
Ciel
in essence
Welcome back Po,
Only today I saw the fields turning to gold, and felt the wonder of a golden land in balance............ sometimes I wonder about this word "Religion", what does it really mean when "Balance" appears to be the very foundation of all things.
- c -
Well we have Matixism and Jedism.... And used to contemplate McGiver...and when in tough and tricky situations would contemplate WWMcGDMy childhood religion was the David Caradine TV series, "Kung-Fu". It had a profound effect on both my father and myself. Lol - but it's true! I think this, coupled with a general "Christian" sense of morality was my grounding, when growing up. Does anyone else have a similar tale?
As our society becomes more media-based I wonder if spirituality will be led more by Websites & TV than by temples & churches?
... Neemai
pattimax
Somewhat returning
What ????? Me question authority ????? Naaaahhhhh !!!!
By the way Patti...my intuition tells me that the marriage ban placed upon Catholic priests has more to do with the traditions of the "celebacy" thingy as opposed to any economic considerations. Besides, many priestly orders, not to mention sisterly orders "require" vows of poverty from its adherents. No...I believe that this all has to do with the preservation and continuation of the essential qualities of leadership within the Catholic Church at large somehow...Thomas? ...Anything to add?
flow....
So far, Thomas doesn't seem to be adding. Hopefully soon.
The reason I brought up money and indulgences is because that how this conversation started. This conversation started in aHumanities class years ago and I have never gotten a straight answer. My prof. said the same thing you did Flow, but then when money and indulgences were brought up (we were studying the Reformation), he threw up his hands and said he didn't know.