Musings on a Gnostic Theme

[Faithfulservant]

Im sorry lightandstorm I just want to say something else because Im siick of the whining also...

sonoman if anyone is interested they could just pm you and ask for your website.. why is that not good enough?

brian is a supporter of writers that arent trying to promote themselves or their personal beliefs all you have to do is read some of okies stuff.. which happens to be contrary to brians personal beliefs but well written and highly entertaining......

Now stop with the theatrics already!

 

[Dream]

Raw Gnosticism says that the divine is self promoting and at work in individuals: Any human influence in the world is Gnostically-not a source of truth but merely illusion or symbol, however real truth continually proceeds fresh within each individual. A truly gnostic gnostic has no fear that truth will disappear from the world regardless of dead people, dead languages, burned books, or loss of any other media.

 

[earl]

Raw Gnosticism says that the divine is self promoting and at work in individuals: Any human influence in the world is Gnostically-not a source of truth but merely illusion or symbol, however real truth continually proceeds fresh within each individual. A truly gnostic gnostic has no fear that truth will disappear from the world regardless of dead people, dead languages, burned books, or loss of any other media.

gee, I really liked that, Dream. Tend to agree with that. You might say that the gnostic at heart in 1 sense doesn't rest on accepting the revelation of another only. Rather, it is a starting point (er) to find the revelation within their own being. earl

 

[sonoman]

Raw Gnosticism says that the divine is self promoting and at work in individuals: Any human influence in the world is Gnostically-not a source of truth but merely illusion or symbol, however real truth continually proceeds fresh within each individual. A truly gnostic gnostic has no fear that truth will disappear from the world regardless of dead people, dead languages, burned books, or loss of any other media.

Are you serious? Do you not know anything about how Gnostics were persecuted, killed, their visions burnt, themselves fleeing for their lives to the desert to hide and then the end of Gnosis for some 1700 years until the Nag Hammadi Library was found? Sometimes I really do not know who or what I'm dealing with here. I am fighting tooth and nail while I can for freedom to post my Christian beliefs without a non-Christian deciding what goes on the Christian boards or doesn't or who can post internet links and who can't.

I'll diagram the situation here to show how ridiculous it is in terms of honest information flow, yet you all are defending this absurdity:

Sonoman (Identity of God information) <---?----Earl ("what is it?")

Sonoman (Identity of God information)---> I, Brian (xxxxxxx xx xxx xxxxxxxx) --------> Earl (-------- --- ----- -------)

There are nice handy internet links right here ready to post internet links for the benefit of forum members, right? But if it is a member's own internet site that contains a members own thoughts, beliefs, history, and even religious visions, that site is verboten to link to. I have to ask why if there is nothing being sold on the site in question and no religion to join, just the sharing of a modern gnostic Christian vision and activism history, why on earth can I not share it with members of this forum? Why do I have to hide it? My website is blocked from sending on the PM too so that doesn't help me.

I'm under a gag order in effect and that is why I am complaining myself silly here to get fair treatment. You think I like to do this crappy squeaky-wheel gets the grease work to be heard? It's like talking to the telephone company about an overcharge, the amount of empathy this member feels from the Company and its regular members. I'd like to feel at home here and be able to not have to worry every time I log on if I can or if my posts have been removed or moved to timbuktoo just because I happen to be a member here with religious visions..really good ones too! Like the identity of God for example..

 

[Thomas]

As to Eastern meditations being innately oriented to selfish ends,

Whoa! Not my meaning, Earl, sorry if I implied that.

What I meant was, all too often that's what a consumer-orientated West does to 'good stuff', wherever the 'good stuff' comes from ..

Thomas

 

[Thomas]

Are you serious?

Are you?

I've offered numerous routes for you to engage in this gnostic musing, which you ignore, and continue to bleat on about your own personal persecution.

Do you not know anything about how Gnostics were persecuted, killed, their visions burnt, themselves fleeing for their lives to the desert to hide and then the end of Gnosis for some 1700 years until the Nag Hammadi Library was found?

That kind of sweeping and inaccurate generalisation does you no good whatsoever.

If you've got an argument, that stands on something more than your own opinions, make it ... if you haven't ...

Thomas

 

[sonoman]

Are you?

I've offered numerous routes for you to engage in this gnostic musing, which you ignore, and continue to bleat on about your own personal persecution.


That kind of sweeping and inaccurate generalisation does you no good whatsoever.

If you've got an argument, that stands on something more than your own opinions, make it ... if you haven't ...

Thomas

Read Elaine Pagels, read the history of Gnostic persecution, then come back with your know-nothing argument. I can't bring you up to speed on this--there's too much history to cover. My point is gnostic Christian persecution has not ended yet and gnostics are rightly sensitive to those who would continue to squelch the gnostic Christian voice.

 

[earl]

I'm not "squelched" here. But, Steve, you're not sharing much special revelation here thusfar in this thread. earl

 

[Francis king]

well.. nobody has anything to say about my long and dare I say it, dazzling post... no matter...

I will jump in here... sonoman, as u know, there are many different types of xtianity, and urs is one which ppl normally believe to be... esoteric, or new age, even though, true, it isn't... so, Brian has moved u...

it's no big deal...

however... u have visions and truths, yet... u act like a big girl...

suck it up, dude, get bk on topic, before u look even sillier... pls...

 

[wil]

well.. nobody has anything to say about my long and dare I say it, dazzling post... no matter...

You had some good stuff in that there post. Short attention span theater here, I don't often respond to long posts, it takes too long to break them down and express all the responses to all the items to which I'd like to comment on.

Sometimes I can't even make it to the end of them on this here computer screen. But there was a lot I was interested in. The sit down and shutup notion as well as the stories of what was found during the remodel...I also remember something about the stain glass windows, one with a moon showing Jesus being moved at night and hence alive. Other discussions about his crew playing with some concoction to lower body temperature, breathing and response...comatose for three days...hence his knowing it was the opportune time to tell Lazarus to get up...herecy all of it I say, to those with those ears.

 

[earl]

You had some good stuff in that there post. Short attention span theater here, I don't often respond to long posts, it takes too long to break them down and express all the responses to all the items to which I'd like to comment on.

Sometimes I can't even make it to the end of them on this here computer screen. But there was a lot I was interested in. The sit down and shutup notion as well as the stories of what was found during the remodel...I also remember something about the stain glass windows, one with a moon showing Jesus being moved at night and hence alive. Other discussions about his crew playing with some concoction to lower body temperature, breathing and response...comatose for three days...hence his knowing it was the opportune time to tell Lazarus to get up...herecy all of it I say, to those with those ears.

Huh? Must have missed some of that. earl

 

[wil]

Huh? Must have missed some of that. earl

Sorry commenting on her comment on big G vs. little g and starting where Francis left off in the Chateau topic.

 

[sonoman]

I'm not "squelched" here. But, Steve, you're not sharing much special revelation here thusfar in this thread. earl

Ok, earl, watch what happens when I try to share my Christian vision here.

 

[iBrian]

Ok, earl, watch what happens when I try to share my Christian vision here.

You mean an attempt to spam the forums, telling everyone you are a spiritual leader and therefore they should visit your website?

Dealt with the same as any other repeat spamming of the forums.

You have no more recourse to complaints of "censorship" than the porn, viagra, and casino spammers who repeatedly try to hit this place.

 

[seattlegal]

Read Elaine Pagels, read the history of Gnostic persecution, then come back with your know-nothing argument. I can't bring you up to speed on this--there's too much history to cover. My point is gnostic Christian persecution has not ended yet and gnostics are rightly sensitive to those who would continue to squelch the gnostic Christian voice.

Sonoman, perhaps you don't understand what true gnostic persecution is? The Gnostic Mandeans are undergoing real persecution right now. Attempting to equate your situation here on this forum to their situation is un-freaking-believable!

 

[Thomas]

Hi Sonoman —

Read Elaine Pagels...

I have. In fact I was a big fan until reading in other areas caused me to I dig a little deeper. On more than one occasion Pagels has conflated texts to show support her own presuppositions — that's a matter of public record — she has done herself no favours in scholarly circles.

... read the history of Gnostic persecution,

Aren't you now citing 'classical gnosticism' which you were critical of earlier?

And I agree with Seattlegal — your self-perceived 'persecution' on this forum, utter nonsense when you see what is allowed to be posted under the guise of Christian — is nothing when compared to the real suffering of those in distant lands.

then come back with your know-nothing argument.

Sonoman, if this is an example of 'sharing' your Christian viewpoint?

I can't bring you up to speed on this--there's too much history to cover.

Oh don't worry about that ... if you'd have bothered to engage in a reasonable discussion, I think you'd find I've read quite a bit in the areas of early and first millenium Christianity — I think others who know me better around here will allow me that much without assuming I'm blowing my own trumpet too much.

My point is gnostic Christian persecution has not ended yet and gnostics are rightly sensitive to those who would continue to squelch the gnostic Christian voice.

OK, a couple of points:
'Persecution' is never justified.
Being persecuted, however, does not validate what one is trying to say — you might be persecuted, and be wrong. Everybody's got a right to believe what they choose to believe — but that doesn't make them right.

Catholics are being murdered today in South America, the Middle East, India and China for what they believe, so excuse us if we happen to speak out when we find our message being distorted or misrepresented ...

... now you may think you're neither distorting nor misrepresenting ... but then, not for the first time, I say make your case ...

Two points in closing:
1 — As an orthodox Catholic here, I wonder why you feel what you're saying even deserves 'censorship' or 'persecution' on this forum — there are those who have said, and continue to say, much worse things about Christianity than yourself, so, it may come as some surprise to discover that your doctrine is no more shocking nor revolutionary than others proposed here, and quite mild compared to some...

2 — As I have learned, it doesn't do to be precious or too thin-skinned around here, hence a majority of posters who'll tell you you're talking crap if they don't agree, as I have found out often ... if you can't take it, Sonoman, don't dish it out ...

So, in the spirit of 'robust' discussion, I suggest you either **** or get off the pot.

Thomas

 

[Snoopy]

I suggest you either **** or get off the pot.

<WARNING: Incoming missiles from across the Tiber!>

s.