Why Sunday?

My point is that if Jesus has no sin and he broke the sabbath in which he was the Lord over.. how could it be a sin? Jesus is my example. He scolded the priests for their hypocrisy. I would be a hypocrite if I told people they had to follow the sabbath or be in err of the commandments of God.. but then pay my employees to do a job on that day? If you are saying that you look at the sabbath as a blessing as a day to worship the Father then I do that also but I do not adhere to the laws of the Sabbath because I cannot follow them its not possible and I would be a hypocrite to try. I truly believe in my heart that Jesus is my Sabbath and in him I rest. There have been times I have had to work 7 days a week to support my family and have never felt the least guilt over that fact because I praise him I study his word and talk with him whenever I can. I am saved by grace. Amen

In some things we have to certainly agree to disagree and find healthy bible discussion in other areas in honor of our heavenly Father the Savior his son Jesus and the Holy Spirit our helper.

With all respect
 
Ok one last try to solve did Jesus Break the Sabbath I think we are saying the exact same thing (in my hillbilly term coming around the same barn in both Directions)

To Me to Say the word "Broke" means the same as saying he Broke the commandment thou shalt not Lie. I dont think that is what you want me to think but it is how it sounds to me and how I have up till now been understanding it.
My point is maybe best Said this way Jesus Kept the Sabbath in the way It had always been intended to kept He Knew the Diference between calling plucking a few ears of grain out of hunger and Harvesting a field. He also Knew that healing a man was not work but a good and Godly thing to do.
The leaders of that time had added alot of tradition to all of the laws some were outrite obsurd for instance a woman having a needle in her dress on the sabbath was considered work and therefore against the law Gods law ? NO traditional Law. Jesus brought us back to a very pure and clear understanding of all the laws by quoting love the lord with all your heart and love thy nieghbor. He Harshly criticized the scribes and priests for adding all these greivous things to the simplist of ideas (most were added for the personal gain of the preist hood)
No where that I read Did Jesus break any of Gods Laws Bend any of Gods laws or Change any of Gods laws.
But he did start a reform in the Jewish faith that went against the traditions and doctrine that had been set buy the leaders of that time .
The Priests would have at that time preformed a circumsism on the Sabbath to keep the law but had a man fallen and need medical attention refused it because it would have been "WORK" Jesus set them straight on how utterly stupid that is.
I once roofed Houses for a living I didnt get the roof done like I had hoped I like I said keep the sabbath as well as I can, other members of my crew did also. My choice was this; Dont work on the sabbath and chance these peoples house being damaged, (Rain was coming) or work . My choice was this I sent everybody home told them tomorrow was the sabbath and to not come to work the next day (the sabbath) I my self got up early and went to finish it myself not wanting any of my crew to be breaking the sabbath I figured one long day I could finish it before the rain. I wasn't ther an hour and my crew showed up they put it to me this way we could all get it done save the house and have half a sabbath to spend together. We had quiet a bible study on that roof got done in way less time than I had thought. And donated that days wages to a needy family... It is lawful to do good on the Sabbath it was funny but only the sabbath keepers on my crew showed up their desire was to make sure I got at least some rest. I got way more than that I recieved a blessing in Knowing my wittness and my faith were haveing an affect on those around me.
Did I break the Sabbath ? you decide

Doing any thing out of Love is easy expecialy keeping the commandments that are written on our hearts Jesus said if you love me Keep my commandments My Goal is to show him as much love as I can I think he deserves it.
Where I fall short I have grace where I am weak his strength is sufficiant for me not only in the sabbath but in life in general LOL I have children 5 teenagers in one house
I pray every Day Lord I Havent Cussed Yelled in anger or taken your name in vain I am doing well: But Father my Children will be waking up in about 5 more minutes and from that point on I will need all the help you can give me amen
Just Kidding but there is alot of truth in that also.

Now a Question You may say "I feel that way about Sunday or About every day of the week" But does God esteam every day of the week the same in this day and age. Please provide scripture to verify any answers

Peace
And always Brethren My deepest respect
 
Some religious groups fervently believe that worshiping God on Sunday and not Saturday (the Sabbath) is a direct violation of God’s commands. After all, it’s the 4th commandment isn’t it?

Rest assured there is some basis for the position that Christians are not obliged to keep the Sabbath or worship God on Saturday as opposed to Sunday. For example, in Colossians 2:16 Paul says that we are not to allow anyone to judge us in this matter of keeping the Sabbath. On the other hand, the Sabbath is not merely a Jewish regulation at all. The Sabbath is inextricably woven together with creation: For God Himself rested on the seventh day (Gen. 2:1-3). Not only that, but the Sabbath just happens to be one of the Ten Commandments, which most Christians regard as a summary of God’s moral code.

The truth is, the observance of Sunday rather than Saturday does not violate God’s Commandments at all! The Sabbath command in the Old Testament never specified a “Saturday” observance; rather, it was simply a command that we should observe a cycle of six days of work and then rest for one day. So obviously, the intent of the Sabbath command is kept when we rest on Saturday or on Sunday, it really doesn’t matter.

Not only that, but there is also some evidence that Sunday worship was practiced in the New Testament Church. As an example, in Acts we read about an evening meeting of the church on the first day of the week (Acts 20:7). And Paul instructed the Corinthians to take up a collection on the first day of the week (1 Cor. 16:2). When John says in Revelation that he was “in the Spirit on the Lord’s day” (Rev. 1:10), he appears to be referring to a day of the week set aside for the Lord, and not the traditional, Jewish Sabbath day.

In fact, in none of these passages is Sunday worship commanded. Christians are no more required to make Sunday their day of rest than they are to make Saturday their day of rest. However, of course, they are perfectly free to do so. In fact, to criticize Sunday observance and then to separate from the rest of the church over something like this, is both legalistic and divisive.

Remember, let’s not focus on the letter of the Law and forget the substance of it.
 
I have been reading the comments about the sabbath and I would like to share some light on this subject.

For every Christian who believes that the Bible is the sole rule of faith and practice for the believer, this question is crucial. In fact, it is a question that must be answered by all who profess Jesus as Lord of their lives, and claim to be filled with the Holy Spirit of the Creator God.

Is there any biblical directive to support the practice of so many brothers and sisters in the Body of Christ who attend church on the first day of the week?

The beneficent Creator, after the six days of Creation, rested on the seventh day and instituted the Sabbath for all people as a memorial of Creation. The fourth commandment of God's unchangeable law requires the observance of this seventh-day Sabbath as the day of rest, worship, and ministry in harmony with the teaching and practice of Jesus, the Lord of the Sabbath. The Sabbath is a day of delightful communion with God and one another. It is a symbol of our redemption in Christ, a sign of our sanctification, a token of our allegiance, and a foretaste of our eternal future in God's kingdom. The Sabbath is God's perpetual sign of His eternal covenant between Him and His people. Joyful observance of this holy time from evening to evening, sunset to sunset, is a celebration of God's creative and redemptive acts. (Gen. 2:1-3; Ex. 20:8-11; Luke 4:16; Isa. 56:5, 6; 58:13, 14; Matt. 12:1-12; Ex. 31:13-17; Eze. 20:12, 20; Deut. 5:12-15; Heb. 4:1-11; Lev. 23:32; Mark 1:32.)
If anyone can give me any biblical reference were it states that the sabbath day was changed, please post it.
 
Well stated! Christians are free to worship on any day. I myself try to worship at least twice a day. Of course, the issue is not whether or not Christians are free to worship, but whether God has sanctified a new day to commemorate his acts of creation and liberation. The issue is whether God has said in His word that the Sabbath should no longer be kept holy. The issue is whether God has said that Sunday is now the day on which he rested and set apart for a holy use.
Furthuremore, the text Acts 20:7: "On the first of the week, we gathered together to break bread...." The events in Acts 20:7 take place on a Saturday night (eve of the first day). While it is not out of the realm of possibility, the text does not say that this was something they did on a weekly basis. This is a special farewell meeting for Paul who leaves for a new location on Sunday morning (ibid). Furthermore, according to Acts 2:46, breaking bread was something that early Christians did on a daily basis.
 
Basstian said:
My point is maybe best Said this way Jesus Kept the Sabbath in the way It had always been intended to kept He Knew the Diference between calling plucking a few ears of grain out of hunger and Harvesting a field. He also Knew that healing a man was not work but a good and Godly thing to do.
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Hi Bass, I missed this the first time around. Just wanted to say that I think you have caught the spirit of how Jesus taught us to keep the Sabbath.

peace,
lunamoth
 
Mohsin said:
Think not that I have come to destroy, the laws and Prophet. I have come not destroy but to fulfill.
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Yeah that is true, and he is the Lord of Sabbath. (Matthew 12:8, Mark 2:28, Luke 6:5).

Luke 24:1 Now upon the first day of the week, very early in the morning, they came unto the sepulchre, bringing the spices which they had prepared, and certain others with them.

Acts 20:7 And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.

1 Corinthians 16:2 Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come.

Now what's the essence? The essence is on the gathering of the brethren upon the first day of the week.

In fact, it did not change. If you recall:

Exodus 12:16 And in the first day there shall be an holy convocation, and in the seventh day there shall be an holy convocation to you; no manner of work shall be done in them, save that which every man must eat, that only may be done of you.

Leviticus 23:7 In the first day ye shall have an holy convocation: ye shall do no servile work therein.

Lev 23:35 On the first day shall be an holy convocation: ye shall do no servile work therein.

Num 28:18 In the first day shall be an holy convocation; ye shall do no manner of servile work therein:

If you are arguing regarding this

Leviticus 23:3 Six days shall work be done: but the seventh day is the sabbath of rest, an holy convocation; ye shall do no work therein: it is the sabbath of the LORD in all your dwellings.

then let us read:

Hbr 4:4-10 For he spake in a certain place of the seventh day on this wise, And God did rest the seventh day from all his works. And in this place again, If they shall enter into my rest. Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:Again, he limiteth a certain day, saying in David, To day, after so long a time; as it is said, To day if ye will hear his voice, harden not your hearts.For if Jesus had given them rest, then would he not afterward have spoken of another day. There remaineth therefore a rest to the people of God.For he that is entered into his rest, he also hath ceased from his own works, as God did from his.
 
Perhaps this is why, Sunday is the day of rest and worship...

"From 312 A.D. on Constantine favored Christianity openly. Ministers of Christ had the same rights as pagan priests. Execution by cruxifiction was hence abolished. Gladitorial games for criminal punishment were ended. In 321 A.D. Sunday became a "public" holiday, and the churches began to rise in stature and beauty, due to his support of the followers of Christ."


Sunday became a holiday (Holy day), because of a grateful and remembering heart of an Emperor who owed his rule (and his life), to a Christian God, that he spent the remaining years of his life trying to get to know. He was even baptised shortly before his death (337 A.D.), and was buried (not burned), in his baptismal robes (not royal purple of his station in life). In fact, from the day of his baptism, he never wore purple again.

Sunday as the day of worship for Christians (the sabbath), was given to us by a newly converted "Christian" Roman Ceasar.

my thoughts

v/r

Q

edit: as a side note, King David once declared "Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath". I think he would know best, since he was one of those closest to God.
 
the day doesnt really matter, love the lord with your hearts each and every day is what matters. to balance your life, i know everyone is busy with work, family, and chores, pick a day to renew your spirit in church and worship the lord. it can be on wednesday nite at 8pm if that best fits your lifestyle. just try to find that time. the lord created all things for us that is for sure, and one of those things is the sabbath. we are not to be prisoned by it, rather we are to set free by it. sabbath is made for man, man is not made for sabbath.
 
I said:
If Jesus was entombed on Friday, for 3 days and 3 nights, then wouldn't he be risen on Monday morning?

I hope that isn't too silly a question.

As to the actual names of days - the Roman calendar actually had no day names - so it's very possible this was something lifted from the Germanic tribes who took control of Europe after smashing Rome.
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That 3 days is an interesting discussion of its own...

much less than 48 hours in the tomb...but three days...

BlaznFattyz said:
the day doesnt really matter, love the lord with your hearts each and every day is what matters. to balance your life, i know everyone is busy with work, family, and chores, pick a day to renew your spirit in church and worship the lord. it can be on wednesday nite at 8pm if that best fits your lifestyle. just try to find that time. the lord created all things for us that is for sure, and one of those things is the sabbath. we are not to be prisoned by it, rather we are to set free by it. sabbath is made for man, man is not made for sabbath.
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kudos...

who is to ever say what day the sabbath was?

Our Julian calendars in the US typically have Sunday as the beginning of the week, which would make our Saturday the day of rest...

But also in the states if you ask anyone when is the beginning of the week, most would answer Monday as the beginning as that is their work week and Sat/Sun are the Week End.

Then of course Constantine and the satisfying Sun worship...and to differentiate from Jews...hence the reason Muslims to Friday? or is there something else to that discussion??

But Blazzn....gotta agree, the sabbath is whenever you can make it, but not quite whenever as in maybe not ever....but whenever like wednesday evening as you sit and contemplate or meditate...or monday morning as you pass a car accident and say a prayer....
 
Mohsin said:
Regards to all.

I came across an article raising a question about Sabbath(the seventh day of the week) as a day of worship for the Christians and the Jews.


Jesus Christ(pbuh) mentioned in the Gospel of Matthew - Ch. No. 5, V. No. 17 to 20…

Think not that I have come to destroy, the laws and Prophet. I have come not destroy but to fulfill. So unless the heavens and the earth pass away, not one jot or title shall pass away from the law, until all be fulfilled. So whosoever shall break one of the least Commandments, and teach men do so, he will be called least in the Kingdom of Heaven. And whosoever shall teach the Commandment… teach others to do so, will be called great in the Kingdom of heaven.

Its from King James Version… it’s a verbatim quotation. That unless your righteousness, exceeds the righteousness of the Scribes and the Pharases, in no way you shall enter the Kingdom of Heaven. So Jesus Christ (pbuh) said that… If a Christian, has to be a good Christian, he should follow each and every law of the Torah - Whatever Moses said… they have to follow, verbatim. Even if one jot or a title, if they break… they will not enter the Kingdom of Heaven.
Many questions rises, but please clerify to me, Why don’t Christians observe Saturday, as the Holy day?
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Early Christians did celebrate the Sabbath on the 7th day. It was Flavius Constantinus (Emperor Constantine) who made it Sunday the new Sabbath. Constantine was a believer in the Cult of Sol Invictus with strong Mithraic influences. These were both Sun Gods and Sunday was the natural Sabbath.

Constantine's vision was a glowing circle (Sun) around the centre of four rays of light (Up, down, right, and left) forming a cross like geometric figure. This symbol was common among Sol Invictus believers and in Pre-Christian Irish Druidism. Constantine's mother, St. Helen, converted to Athanasian Christianity a rival of Arian Christianity.

Constantine wanted to unify the troubled Empire suffering a series of civil wars. One way would be to combine Christianity with Sol Invictus, Mithraism, and Celtic Paganism. He called a synod at Nicaea in Asia Minor to force the Pagan and Christian bishops to merge into one Roman Church. To do this he needed to outlaw the rival Christianities like Arianism and the other Jesus Cults (Ebionites, Nazarenes) plus the Pagan religions.

He likely influenced the degree of integration of those cults into Orthodox/Roman Trinitarian Christianity.

He declared Sunday to be the new Sabbath so it coincided with Mithraism, Sol Invictus/Cybele, Teutonic, Celtic, Greek, and Roman Paganism. It was enforced.

It still took another 75 years before Paganism and rival Christians could be exterminated or converted during the reign of the two Theodosius emperors. Theodosius II was the more brutal in the Pagan and Older Christian holocaust beginning in 393 CE. Many Pagans found it easier to convert with a Sunday (Sun God) Sabbath than the early Christians who resisted the Gentilization (I made that up.) of the faith.

Today there are only a few Christian sects that keep the Saturday Sabbath:
Sabbath Catholic-Arians,
Seventh Day Adventists,
The Seventh Day Sabbath Latter Day Saints,
Earlier Coptic Christians,
Syriac and Armenian Christians,
Persian Christians,
St. Thomas Sabbath Christians (India),
and Jehovah's Witnesses.

(Other Mormons. Armenians, and Copts have adopted the Sunday Sabbath.)

Amergin
 
Amergin said:
Early Christians did celebrate the Sabbath on the 7th day. It was Flavius Constantinus (Emperor Constantine) who made it Sunday the new Sabbath. Constantine was a believer in the Cult of Sol Invictus with strong Mithraic influences. These were both Sun Gods and Sunday was the natural Sabbath.

Constantine's vision was a glowing circle (Sun) around the centre of four rays of light (Up, down, right, and left) forming a cross like geometric figure. This symbol was common among Sol Invictus believers and in Pre-Christian Irish Druidism. Constantine's mother, St. Helen, converted to Athanasian Christianity a rival of Arian Christianity.

Constantine wanted to unify the troubled Empire suffering a series of civil wars. One way would be to combine Christianity with Sol Invictus, Mithraism, and Celtic Paganism. He called a synod at Nicaea in Asia Minor to force the Pagan and Christian bishops to merge into one Roman Church. To do this he needed to outlaw the rival Christianities like Arianism and the other Jesus Cults (Ebionites, Nazarenes) plus the Pagan religions.

He likely influenced the degree of integration of those cults into Orthodox/Roman Trinitarian Christianity.

He declared Sunday to be the new Sabbath so it coincided with Mithraism, Sol Invictus/Cybele, Teutonic, Celtic, Greek, and Roman Paganism. It was enforced.

It still took another 75 years before Paganism and rival Christians could be exterminated or converted during the reign of the two Theodosius emperors. Theodosius II was the more brutal in the Pagan and Older Christian holocaust beginning in 393 CE. Many Pagans found it easier to convert with a Sunday (Sun God) Sabbath than the early Christians who resisted the Gentilization (I made that up.) of the faith.

Today there are only a few Christian sects that keep the Saturday Sabbath:
Sabbath Catholic-Arians,
Seventh Day Adventists,
The Seventh Day Sabbath Latter Day Saints,
Earlier Coptic Christians,
Syriac and Armenian Christians,
Persian Christians,
St. Thomas Sabbath Christians (India),
and Jehovah's Witnesses.

(Other Mormons. Armenians, and Copts have adopted the Sunday Sabbath.)

Amergin
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Jesus was chastising the clerical in this case (if you read further concerning the audience he was "entertaining").

If one would continue to read further, Christ is specific about the "laws" we are to follow: Love ones God with all thine heart, might and mind...and Love neighbor as thine self.

To be specific, Jesus stated ominously that if we could keep these two commandments, we could keep them all...
 
BlaznFattyz said:
the day doesnt really matter, love the lord with your hearts each and every day is what matters. to balance your life, i know everyone is busy with work, family, and chores, pick a day to renew your spirit in church and worship the lord. it can be on wednesday nite at 8pm if that best fits your lifestyle. just try to find that time. the lord created all things for us that is for sure, and one of those things is the sabbath. we are not to be prisoned by it, rather we are to set free by it. sabbath is made for man, man is not made for sabbath.
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I don't believe in anthropomorphic gods of any kind. But I thin you are right in the context of your beliefs.

The 7th day depends on which is the First Day. Someone else mentioned that Western culture has a week starting on the work week, which is Monday. Monday is really the first day and Sunday is the focus of the week-end. Sunday is therefore the 7th day of our European-American-Australian-NZ world. Sunday is the day most people rest from work. During my 40 years as a physician, every other Sunday was my day of rest, alternating with a Sunday "on call."

Amergin
 
Quahom1 said:
Jesus was chastising the clerical in this case (if you read further concerning the audience he was "entertaining").

If one would continue to read further, Christ is specific about the "laws" we are to follow: Love ones God with all thine heart, might and mind...and Love neighbor as thine self.

To be specific, Jesus stated ominously that if we could keep these two commandments, we could keep them all...
Click to expand...

For me that can mean: Love the Cosmic Creative Process...and love thy fellow evolved animals (human and non-human) as thyself. That makes it easy for me to follow my Secular Humanist Commandments.

1. Thou may have any or no gods before thee.
2. Thou may make graven, porcelain, or clay images of whatever suits you.
3. Thou may take the name of any god in vain. One cannot harm gods.
4. Thou may do whatever thou desireth on Sunday if it is otherwise moral.
5. Thou shalt honour thy parents, if thy parents are deserving of honour.
6a. Thou shalt not kill except in self-defence.
6b. Thou shalt not kill unbelievers, disbelievers, or dissidents on scriptural trivia.
7. Thou shalt not commit adultery or thy word is worthless.
8. Thou shalt not steal.
9a. Thou shalt not lie.
9b. Thou shalt not deceive others to acquire their possessions or votes.
10. Thou may covet all thou want but shalt not take what is not thine.
11. Thou shalt not persecute or hate those whose beliefs differ from yours.
12. Thou shalt not enslave another human being.
13. Thou shalt not treat cruelly or otherwise mistreat non-human animals.
14. Thou shalt not discriminate due of race, ethnicity, gender, or gender orientation.
15. Thou shalt not mentally or physically abuse or oppress thy spouse.
16. Thou shalt not mentally, physically, or sexually abuse children.
17. Thou shalt not suppress the scientific search for truth about our world.
18. Thou shalt not make laws restricting freedom of and from religion.
19. Thou shalt not make laws restricting the freedom of speech, press, media, internet, and association.
20. Thou shalt show compassion and charity to those less fortunate than you.

Now tell me how these 20 Atheist commandments are not clearly superior to those written by Moses in Exodus.

Amergin
 
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