The question of Israel

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Originally Posted by Avi1223
I think tolerance is one of most important characteristics. It differentiates us yelling at each other from speaking to one another. It separates talk from violence. It separates caring from hating. It separates learning from closing our ears. I think it is essential for interfaith dialogue. Peace to you, Sir.

or it differentiates us from talking period. There is just as much evidence for those in peace talks that it changes nothing and only makes matter worse. I am a tolerant person in a different way with a different definition. I learned that being tolerant any other way only gets you less respected and walked on by others. I give tolerance and respect to those who give it back and pay close attention to those who are the worse offenders. I don't have to talk to anyone I don't like nor do I have to tolerate a lot of things. Calling the police and using my tax dollar to my advantage is my tolerance these days:).

I think interfaith preaches a lot of stuff like a religion and things like tolerance but it isn't exactly factual or something I agree is really happening or changing anything for the better. I view it as another disturbing religion on the marketplace and also a religion for people who love to argue.

Any way is has been fun once again. I don't find discussing this stuff all that wonderful, but I have enjoyed your company and once in awhile that does happen here. Let's chat again.
Are you old enough to remember Jack Kennedy ? Bobby Kennedy ? Martin Luther King ? During those days many people believed we could have a better world. Their deaths killed that possibility for many. I hope that dream will re-awaken with Obama.

I know the timeline of the Jews pretty well. And I know Native American Indians have suffered genocide as well. That is why hate speech and hate baiting (seen earlier on this thread) need to be eliminated. Maybe that is a good place to start :).

Yes. I remember them. I do not expect genocides to end and I don't want to burst your Obama bubble so I will leave it at that.
Bandit said:
The agenda says it is ok for Israel to have as many WMD, biological, chemical and nuclear weapons as they want, while Iran & Iraq are not allowed to have even one nuclear bomb.
says who? israel doesn't have bio or chemical weapons (or an interest in developing them) as far as i'm aware (do you know differently, avi?) - and they have only ever used nuclear capability as a deterrent and rather effectively; everyone knows the israelis have nuclear capability but you cannot generalise from that to an interest in all WMDs - as compared to both iran and iraq (and syria) who have demonstrably used chemical weapons on both battlefields and against domestic rebels; israel has never done such a thing. remember halabja? the ten-year iran-iraq war? israel may value the lives of its own soldiers over the lives of enemy combatants and, sadly, bystanders, but it has always displayed considerably less contempt for human life than the others you cite.

Israel is far more dangerous than Iran is
i'm sorry, but that is quite simply deranged. israel does not want to take over the world. israel is not conducting proxy wars in lebanon, iraq and egypt to destablise its governments. iran is doing that. ever heard of the "shi'a crescent"? you don't even have to take it from me - read the arab press, asharq al-awsat's a good place to start. they are no friends of israel, but they would strongly disagree with you.

the propaganda and media does its thing to convince people that Iran and Korea is the big problem to shift the political agenda and get what they want.
really? you think a megalomaniac whose country is starving should be spending money on nuclear weapons? when there was last an earthquake or famine, do you remember iran or korea sending specialist emergency teams? israel does that.

We also need to be fair and admit that the question of Israel is not just about wicked jews but also about wicked Christians who are using a religious christian-jewish dogma to support it
i am on record here on numerous occasions as saying that christian fundamentalists who support the right-wingers and the settlement enterprise in israel are one of the biggest problems - these people are not my friends. they are trying to provoke the end of the world and expecting all the jews who don't die in the process to convert. it is crazy for anyone in israel to get into bed with these lunatics.

It only takes a handful of elitists to use religion and persuade the masses to crucify an innocent man they label as a heretic
hang on - now we're back to killing jesus? that was the romans, not us. remember vatican II? that was when the catholic church formally dropped the accusation of deicide and admitted they'd been mistaken.

/or that the globe should be ruled from one city of their god, of course from that of what was once Rome
there is no hint of this in judaism.

For example purposes I equate zionists with roman catholics in different ages. They conquer by joining that which they are against.
i have no idea what you mean by this.

I feel this is all in deciet of the nations while using jews/judaism to do it and to create a false peace to usher in a global dictatorship of a messiah-like figure while hiding war and blood in his/her ears.
this is the worldview of the protocols and the christian apocalyptists, not of sane and reasonable dialogue.

We have serious blood baths ahead and no amount of religious dialogue and poltical peace talk is going to change it.
so why are you here, bandit? there is not one iota of the picture you paint that i recognise. i could not disagree with you more. we clearly have no common ground. and now you're saying you don't believe in dialogue. what is the point of this conversation?

That is because they do not even realize what they are a part of.
are you seriously suggesting that informed jews like myself are part of some sort of global conspiracy that we are unaware of? or that we are aware of it, but are lying? that is unbelievably a) patronising b) rude and c) flies in the face of my entire upbringing and religious education. nothing i have ever learned suggests anything of the sort. this is the discourse of the lunatic fringe.

all three hebrew religions suck and have caused more harm than they do good.
so christianity and islam are now "hebrew" religions? what on earth have you been reading?

the nazi-zionist agenda

Zionists want to rule the world through Israel and it does not matter who gets killed along the way.
so now zionism and nazism are the same thing? and it's about world domination? this has passed beyond the realm of reasonable discourse and i see no point in continuing this discussion. i'm closing the thread. and if you think i'm stifling the discussion, then i really don't care. you are free to discuss this but you can do it elsewhere. i'm sure the white supremacists, islamists and conspiracy nuts will be glad to have you.


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