So what's the story to be?

[shawn]

I got to thinking a bit after participating in another thread
http://www.interfaith.org/forum/designing-a-new-religion-10360-10.html
where I had this to say:

We have so much conflict and confusion due to there being too many stories as to :
1) what we are;
and
2) why we are here/why we exist.
Every religion is differentiated by its own exclusive version or twist to those 2 questions.

Really, there is only one truth and our primary purpose should be to resolve this issue.
Otherwise we are no better than the fiddling caeser who played while his city burned.
Sure it is good to joke around about things....it is healthy.
But we also need to balance that with some seriousness....that is, if we want a brighter future.

Religions serve one of 2 purposes.....
they either liberate/enlighten, or enslave/control.
The choice as to what our future religion will be, ought to be quite simple then.

And I thought that it should have its own thread as it really isn't a new religion which we need, but rather a better story.

All religions have come about due to their engineers seeing that the main problem with human society is the lack of a single unifying story, which is essential if one wishes to get people working together.
We can see in retrospect that the stories they have come up with are mostly BS and so we see many intelligent people rejecting religions across the board in large numbers these days.

So what should our story be?
I suggest that it needs to be true.
So...what is true?
If we are to have a future at all we really need to settle that.
Otherwise the religious fanatics/robots will destroy our world.

 

[PandaMentionalBeing]

I think what we are should be explained by Science, which says we are all interconnected by emptiness. This claim should be backed up by eastern philosophys 'empty mind' traditions. And then furthermore find ourselves in the realm of evolution through incarnation in the cosmic cycles.

 

[citizenzen]

I think what we are should be explained by Science, which says we are all interconnected by emptiness.

It gets even better because it turns out the emptiness isn't emptiness at all. Life itself, without any embellishment of myth, is the best religion of them all.

 

[shawn]

All religions are based upon stories, so leaving the idea of religion behind, let us just consider what the story ought to be.

 

[nativeastral]

All religions are based upon stories, so leaving the idea of religion behind, let us just consider what the story ought to be.

using the word 'ought' implies morality, which of course is basically the function of religion through the ages [as well as accounting for our existence here and after such is the mind of man who seeks reasons and meanings and purpose unlike other animals,presumably!].

yes what is 'the truth' if it is 'one', something we all hanker after since time immemorial, this 'one truth'. now 'confirmed by a 'belief', not a knockdown certainty or 'fact', in a singularity.

the story, apart from explaining the reason of our existence, which has not been solved or uncovered yet, by science nor religion, categorically, has to do with humaneness of humanness since we have gone down the road and still are, of destructiveness and distrustfulness.

so the story has to be 'universal' to all concerned, a very difficult endeavour despite the general intelligence of todays populations worldwide.

are we all at different levels of evolution/intellectual development that a conjunction of mutable narrative is incommeasurable?

A.N.Whitehead speaking in 1926 [during the heyday of behaviourism, which by the way is still by far the most popular 'belief' for scientists ie determinism ie no free will perse] said, 'when we consider what religion is to mankind and what science is, its no exageration to say the future course of history depends upon the decision of this generation to the relationship between the two of them' [stephen meyer 'the new cosmology 2001].

there is no proof, only empirical evidence, inferring to the best explanation, hypotheses which support 'beliefs'. we do not have the knowledge we require regarding meta physics to posit any 'truth'.

so we are back at 'stories' which epistemologically support what evidence we have accumulated up till now.

some of the ancient philosophers in their wisdom on living virtuous lives for happy living are as fresh and as relevent today as they were then.

 

[ARMyers]

There is but one story. It has been backed by both Science and History. It contains only Truth and no lies. It is the Bible. The only lies come from people twisting its words and combining it with Pagan rituals, ideas, and philosophy.

If you read the Epistles of Paul, you will come to understand that you are "enslaved" AND "liberated." You are either a slave to the world (or sin, sinful flesh, mammon - wealth) or a slave to the Lord. You do either what your flesh wants or what the Lord wants.

You are also "liberated" from the bonds of sin and willingly choose the bonds of the Lord such as in Deuteronomy 15 when a slave is to be freed of his master and pleads to stay with him because he is a good master, an awl must be thrust into his ear and the slave will be with his master forever. Who is a better master than the Father? Note: you are not a slave to religion or the works of men.

I can tell you now that the entire Bible is about one person, Jesus Christ. We were made for him just as he was made for us. The Law of Moses was provisional until there would come one (Jesus Christ) who could fully follow it (for all have sinned) and fulfill its purpose. When Adam and Eve sinned, a promise of redemption and restoration was given to them ("thy seed will crush the serpant's head, and the serpant will bruise his heel"). The Lord separated out himself a person (Abraham) and a nation (Israel) from the world, from which the Savior (Jesus) would come. Though the nation of Israel and the nation of Judah (not as much as Israel) constantly transgressed the Law and turned to other gods, the Father did not completely destroy them for the sake of those he loved (including Jesus). To David, the Lord promised one of David's seed would sit on the throne of Israel forever and build him a Temple. Solomon and David thought that Solomon would build that temple but the Temple was destroyed and corrupted; Christ (the spiritual temple) will build the physical temple (as told in Ezekiel) in the latter days. We know that David's line was thrown from power by the Babylonians, but the Lord is not a liar; Christ will return to reign on David's throne as the seed of David (hence the lineage given in the accounts). Much of prophecy points to Christ and the falling of nations to the will of God (which can be proven). Now that Christ has come and will come again, we must prepare ourselves to try obtain a place in his Kingdom on Earth before it is too late (we die or he returns).

This is why Jesus Christ is referred to as the "Word" or Logos (an idea or plan manifested) by John and why Jesus refers to himself as the "Alpha and Omega" in Revelations. The first letter to the last letter of the Bible are all about him and how we may become an heir with him as the multitudinous Christ. In fact the name of the Lord is Yahweh Elohim, which is translated "He who will be (or is) the Mighty Ones," pointing to the fact that He shall be manifest in many (these are Christ and the Saints who share the same spirit). This manifestation of the Lord is spoken about by Christ himself when he says "the Father and I are one" (one in goal, mind, spirit; not literally the same being) and further expounded to his apostles on the Mount of Olives when he says "I am in the Father and He is in me" just as "I am in you and you are in me." If you manifest Christ, you manifest the Father.

There is no need for any other story, for the minds of men are foolish, especially those that think they are wise. If you try to make something fully true, you will not succeed. All works of men fail to the test of time. Only the Lord Father who knows all things and can do all things can ever possibly create absolute Truth. It is our responsibility to seek this truth out.

Remember this: the Old Testament is the New Testament concealed, and the New Testament is the Old Testament revealed. You cannot have one without the other.

Thank you.

 

[seattlegal]

I got to thinking a bit after participating in another thread
http://www.interfaith.org/forum/designing-a-new-religion-10360-10.html
where I had this to say:
And I thought that it should have its own thread as it really isn't a new religion which we need, but rather a better story.

All religions have come about due to their engineers seeing that the main problem with human society is the lack of a single unifying story, which is essential if one wishes to get people working together.
We can see in retrospect that the stories they have come up with are mostly BS and so we see many intelligent people rejecting religions across the board in large numbers these days.

So what should our story be?
I suggest that it needs to be true.
So...what is true?
If we are to have a future at all we really need to settle that.
Otherwise the religious fanatics/robots will destroy our world.

Instead of a story, how's about a haiku?

Human Relations:
Dysfunctional family
All in the same boat​

 

[citizenzen]

There is but one story. It has been backed by both Science and History. It contains only Truth and no lies. It is the Bible.

I'm going to try really hard not to roll my eyes...

must...not ...roll...eyes!



DOH!

Oh well. I tried.

 

[ARMyers]

I'm going to try really hard not to roll my eyes...

must...not ...roll...eyes!



DOH!

Oh well. I tried.

I would only ask that you read and try to be more open. Most close their ears, their minds and their hearts, much more do not even read the words written. They glance and ascertain meaning from their own minds. That is foolish. Those who seek wisdom must first profess that they are fools. While many have Bibles, few of them read. Of those that read, few of them understand. Of those that understand, few of them believe. Of those that believe, few of them act. Of those that act, theirs is the Kingdom.

If you wish to seriously debate me on any of my points, feel free. But please do not dismiss because it goes against your own preconceptions and ideas.

 

[Snoopy]

If you wish to seriously debate me on any of my points, feel free. But please do not dismiss because it goes against your own preconceptions and ideas.

Do you not think that everyone has their own preconceptions and ideas; which makes us all likely to dismiss others' notions that run contrary to our own?

For instance, I imagine that someone who believes that "there is but one story. It has been backed by both Science and History. It contains only Truth and no lies. It is the Bible. The only lies come from people twisting its words and combining it with Pagan rituals, ideas, and philosophy" is likely to dismiss the views of others with contrary ideas.

Some people, erroneously you may think, may think that they have an understanding which makes sense to them, but that it is not the only understanding. Some people think that there is more than one door to truth. But you may not agree of course.

s.

 

[wil]

I would only ask that you read and try to be more open. Most close their ears, their minds and their hearts, much more do not even read the words written. They glance and ascertain meaning from their own minds. That is foolish. Those who seek wisdom must first profess that they are fools. While many have Bibles, few of them read. Of those that read, few of them understand. Of those that understand, few of them believe. Of those that believe, few of them act. Of those that act, theirs is the Kingdom.

If you wish to seriously debate me on any of my points, feel free. But please do not dismiss because it goes against your own preconceptions and ideas.

No problem debating. There are plenty of threads about the errors in the bible over in the Christian section. And that is the place where we Christians discuss the intracicies, similarities and differences about their Christian beliefs. What we don't do is go out on the rest of the board and claim we have the answer and the rest of you are wrong. If you'd like to do that, please find a local streetcorner, megaphone and soapbox.

 

[ARMyers]

No problem debating. There are plenty of threads about the errors in the bible over in the Christian section. And that is the place where we Christians discuss the intracicies, similarities and differences about their Christian beliefs. What we don't do is go out on the rest of the board and claim we have the answer and the rest of you are wrong. If you'd like to do that, please find a local streetcorner, megaphone and soapbox.

Do not forget the large sign that says "REPENT! THE END OF THE WORLD IS COMING!" with some fliers. I suppose I could also dress in a black suit with white shirt and hand out little magazines to people at their homes. I would much rather speak to people searching out truth, wherever they may be searching, and show them an alternate path.

 

[Paladin]

All religions are based upon stories, so leaving the idea of religion behind, let us just consider what the story ought to be.

Well Shawn, if there is another story there will be a religion that forms around it. I think CZ points us in the best direction.

 

[ARMyers]

Do you not think that everyone has their own preconceptions and ideas; which makes us all likely to dismiss others' notions that run contrary to our own?

For instance, I imagine that someone who believes that "there is but one story. It has been backed by both Science and History. It contains only Truth and no lies. It is the Bible. The only lies come from people twisting its words and combining it with Pagan rituals, ideas, and philosophy" is likely to dismiss the views of others with contrary ideas.

Some people, erroneously you may think, may think that they have an understanding which makes sense to them, but that it is not the only understanding. Some people think that there is more than one door to truth. But you may not agree of course.

s.

I agree. I have at one time had many similar ideas posted in this section as well as other ideas. Now that I have the Truth, I have an alternate understanding and yet I understand where other people get their ideas as well. Most would consider me a Bible nut and write me off. I am asking that you don't and actually read what I am writing. I do hope some one actually read my post. I am more than willing to debate any issue.

 

[wil]

Do not forget the large sign that says "REPENT! THE END OF THE WORLD IS COMING!" with some fliers. I suppose I could also dress in a black suit with white shirt and hand out little magazines to people at their homes. I would much rather speak to people searching out truth, wherever they may be searching, and show them an alternate path.

Well it appears you are trying to use this forum to do so. You'll find it frowned upon.

BTW, don't print as much in your flyers as you do on your posts...or they'll be largely ignored as well.

 

[citizenzen]

I would only ask that you read and try to be more open.

You want me to be more open, but you don't ask the same of yourself. After all you said, "There is but one story."

Doesn't sound very open to me.

But please do not dismiss because it goes against your own preconceptions and ideas

I will ask the same from you.

 

[ARMyers]

Well it appears you are trying to use this forum to do so. You'll find it frowned upon.

BTW, don't print as much in your flyers as you do on your posts...or they'll be largely ignored as well.

I apologize if it seems this way. Just offering at alternate viewpoint. When I speak, I often back up my statements with sufficient support, which make my comments long. That which I do not support is an opening for debate in which I can then give my support. I do not expect anyone to believe me just because I say so. I will also state things as a matter of fact so that people will be riled up enough to refute what I say. If you cannot defend what you say, then why speak?

 

[ARMyers]

You want me to be more open, but you don't ask the same of yourself. After all you said, "There is but one story."

Doesn't sound very open to me.

Further down I explain my point that there is one true story. If you wish to debate me on this belief, I am more than open to your ideas as will I do and be to your beliefs. Show me something I have said incorrectly and I will speak further on the subject.

 

[wil]

Just offering at alternate viewpoint. If you cannot defend what you say, then why speak?

If you think the Bible is an alternate viewpoint that folks that find this forum or participate in this forum are unaware of, you are misinformed.

I've tried to say and I suppose should be more clear. This is not the place to say the Bible is the one and only way. Please move that debate to the many threads that can be found discussing that in our Christian Forum.

You may wish to read the code of conduct as well.

BTW this is the forum you are currently in:Belief and Spirituality General thinking beyond the boundaries of religion and organised belief

 

[citizenzen]

Further down I explain my point that there is one true story.

ARMyers, what are your views on Islam? Are Muslims able to connect with God? If not, what are they connecting to when they pray? Are Buddhists able to be one with God? If not, what are they in one with when they meditate?