Jesus is not God....part 2

mee said:
the one in the bible ,

That men may know that thou, whose name alone is JEHOVAH, art the most high over all the earth. KJV psalm 83;18
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The one (name) transliterated in the ELIZABETHAN ENGLISH Bible. Last I checked, G-d's name was written, and by extension pronounced (on those *very* rare occasions) in Hebrew- not Elizabethan English.

Heavenly Father will suffice. Seemed to be good enough for Jesus (Yashua).

Psalms 68:5 A father of the fatherless, and a judge of the widows, is God in his holy habitation.
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Psalms 103:13 Like as a father pitieth his children, so the LORD pitieth them that fear him.
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Bruce Michael said:
Quahom1 said:
Br.Mee will not like that Josh- because it isn't tasty to him. He is more used to substance predigested by the Watchtower Society.

They teach that Jesus is really the Archangel Michael- forgetting about all the other Archangels.
That is why they deny the Trinity, and that is why they try to prove that Christ Jesus is not God. Fortunately for us Truth has a power all of its own.

But tell us Mee, why do the Jehovah’s Witnesses teach that Jehovah directly created only one thing, Michael the Archangel, and that Michael then created all other things?
  • Does this not conflict with Daniel 10:13 where Michael is called “one of” the chief princes?
  • Does it not conflict with John 1:3 where it says “…without him [Jesus] was not anything made that was made?” Jehovah’s Witnesses do teach that Jesus (Michael) was “made.”
  • Does it not also conflict with Isaiah 44:24 where Jehovah’ said, “I am the Lord that stretcheth forth the heavens alone; that spreadeth abroad the earth by myself?”
  • Has not this teaching caused the Watchtower to tamper with God’s Word at Colossians 1:16-17 by adding the word “other” four times to their New World Translation so that it says, “… by means of him[Jesus] all other things were created…?”
Up on the Watchtower they are pontificating on what the "faithful slaves" must believe. Believe what you like but "test all things".

Love to All,
Br.Bruce
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Yes, and we must beware the wolves in sheep's clothing...that is that anything that tears at or attempts to tear apart the body of Christ (the church), is to be viewed with clinical eye and cautious scrutiny, and ready defense.
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Quahom1 said:
Bruce Michael said:
Yes, and we must beware the wolves in sheep's clothing...that is that anything that tears at or attempts to tear apart the body of Christ (the church), is to be viewed with clinical eye and cautious scrutiny, and ready defense.
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Yes Josh,
And to add further:

"Behold, I send you forth as sheep in the midst of wolves: be ye therefore wise as serpents, and harmless as doves." (Matthew 10:16)

In this we may find our guidance in understanding the offerings of good teaching. The wolves of the world would shred us to pieces and surely ravage our goodness by their very untamed natures. And so as sheep, we are sent forth, but with wisdom, as our mercy and goodness of intent are to be our saviour.


"Out of the same mouth proceedeth blessing and cursing. My brethren these things ought not to be. Doth a fountain send forth at the same place sweet water and bitter?" (James 3:10)
The 'fountain' has by character a need to be as harmless as a dove, sweet and true to the purity that it would impart. There is no reliability in a man to whom words spill forth in defamation, and then to issue the 'truth' of the angels. The teacher needs be with "wisdom that is from above first pure, then peaceable, gentle and easy to be entreated, full of mercy and good fruits, without partiality and without hypocrisy." (James 3:17).

These words show us the high ideals of every Christian teacher.

God Bless,
Br.Bruce

Quotes from my Teachers.
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Quahom1 said:
Bruce Michael said:
Yes, and we must beware the wolves in sheep's clothing...that is that anything that tears at or attempts to tear apart the body of Christ (the church), is to be viewed with clinical eye and cautious scrutiny, and ready defense.
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yes ,
And you will be objects of hatred by all people on account of my name; but he that has endured to the end is the one that will be saved. matthew 10;22



But they will do all these things against you on account of my name, because they do not know him that sent me john 15;21
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I don't want to go into details but personally (IMO) Christs' body is not particularly "the church".
 
Azure24 said:
I don't want to go into details but personally (IMO) Christs' body is not particularly "the church".
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Symbolic Usage. Jesus Christ is spoken of as the Head of "the congregation, which is his body." (Eph 1:22, 23; Col 1:18) This Christian body of people has no divisions racially, nationally, or otherwise, Jews and people of all nations being represented in it. (Ga 3:28; Eph 2:16; 4:4) All are baptized by holy spirit into Christ and into his death. They are, therefore, all baptized into one body. (1Co 12:13) Thus all the body follows the head, dying his kind of death and receiving his kind of resurrection.—Ro 6:3-5
 
What does John 2:19-21 teach?
18Then answered the Jews and said unto him, What sign shewest thou unto us, seeing that thou doest these things?

19Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.

20Then said the Jews, Forty and six years was this temple in building, and wilt thou rear it up in three days?

21But he spake of the temple of his body.
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23. According to Acts 2:24-28 what was it for which Christ’s body was resting in hope?

—Isn’t being “dissolved into gases” just an instant form of corruption?
 
Bruce Michael said:
What does John 2:19-21 teach?

23. According to Acts 2:24-28 what was it for which Christ’s body was resting in hope?

—Isn’t being “dissolved into gases” just an instant form of corruption?
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From the original form? yes. To a natural state of being? No. Who's question are you addressing?

v/r

Q
 
mee said:
Symbolic Usage. Jesus Christ is spoken of as the Head of "the congregation, which is his body." (Eph 1:22, 23; Col 1:18) This Christian body of people has no divisions racially, nationally, or otherwise, Jews and people of all nations being represented in it. (Ga 3:28; Eph 2:16; 4:4) All are baptized by holy spirit into Christ and into his death. They are, therefore, all baptized into one body. (1Co 12:13) Thus all the body follows the head, dying his kind of death and receiving his kind of resurrection.—Ro 6:3-5
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That's not what I meant, anyway like I said I don't want to go into details...
 
Quahom1 said:
...then the conversation comes to an immediate end. That is kind of sad.

v/r

Q
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Ok then,

"And when He [Jesus] was departed thence, He went into their synagogue… Then said He [Jesus] stretch forth your hand. And he stretched it forth; and it was restored whole… Then the Pharisees went out, and held a council against Him [Jesus] how they might destroy Him" (Matt. 12:9, 13, & 14).

From the responses I have recieved by some people in the church (and even here) this could also refer to me:


"And when He [Jesus] was come into His own country, He taught them in the synagogue… And they were offended in Him" (Matt. 13:54 & 57).

"…and He [Jesus] went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day, and stood up for to read… And ALL they in the synagogue, when they heard these things, were filled with wrath [rage], And rose up, and thrust Him out of the city, and led Him unto the brow of the hill, whereon their city was built, that they might cast Him down headlong [over the cliff]…" (Luke 4:16b, 28-29).

Do you believe that Jesus enjoyed Sabbath services in the Synagogues? Jesus didn’t go to the synagogues to worship God: Jesus worshiped God twenty-four hours a day, every day. Jesus didn’t go to the synagogues to have a good time. Jesus when to the synagogues to teach the truths of God! And many hated Him for it.

I know these are referring to synagoues but is this any different to today's churches? However alot of churches are not like this, but...
 
Azure24 said:
Ok then,

"And when He [Jesus] was departed thence, He went into their synagogue… Then said He [Jesus] stretch forth your hand. And he stretched it forth; and it was restored whole… Then the Pharisees went out, and held a council against Him [Jesus] how they might destroy Him" (Matt. 12:9, 13, & 14).

From the responses I have recieved by some people in the church (and even here) this could also refer to me:


"And when He [Jesus] was come into His own country, He taught them in the synagogue… And they were offended in Him" (Matt. 13:54 & 57).

"…and He [Jesus] went into the synagogue on the Sabbath day, and stood up for to read… And ALL they in the synagogue, when they heard these things, were filled with wrath [rage], And rose up, and thrust Him out of the city, and led Him unto the brow of the hill, whereon their city was built, that they might cast Him down headlong [over the cliff]…" (Luke 4:16b, 28-29).

Do you believe that Jesus enjoyed Sabbath services in the Synagogues? Jesus didn’t go to the synagogues to worship God: Jesus worshiped God twenty-four hours a day, every day. Jesus didn’t go to the synagogues to have a good time. Jesus when to the synagogues to teach the truths of God! And many hated Him for it.

I know these are referring to synagoues but is this any different to today's churches? However alot of churches are not like this, but...
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According to 2 Samuel 22:20, the Lord delights in us. Therefore logically He must have enjoyed talking with us in church. He also said on the cross "forgive them, for they know not what they do..." so obviously he held no malice towards any man.

I suppose there are some who do not want to hear the truth now as then, but that is not the majority (who are starved for the truth). And wish as the angry ones may, they could not cast Jesus anywhere. I opine that this is still true today.

v/r

Q
 
q, that bit that you quoted has always got to me. You know that Im still on the fence with all of this but that quote is what tugs at my heart strings. Its so sad, and so final. makes me wonder.
 
While hanging upon a stake, Jesus prayed in behalf of his executioners, saying: "Father, forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing." (Luke 23:34) When hate-filled men stoned the disciple Stephen to death, his final words were: "Jehovah, do not charge this sin against them." (Acts 7:60) Jesus and Stephen wanted the best even for those who hated them. There was no bitterness in their hearts. "Let us work what is good toward all," the Bible admonishes us.—Galatians 6:10.
 
shamsery said:
All the great people speak in such a way. He was a prophet and mighty messenger of Allah(swt).
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and stephen who was a follower of Jesus did the same . looking to the great teacher is the way to go .
:)
 
I see a lot of NT testament posted in here regarding Jesus as not being God. In what I have learned, Jesus is God. God is Jesus. Jesus is within us. It is good that we read the NT testament front and back. But I also suggest reading the other gospels, not just the ones in the bible. A lot will say that it is heresy to read about the other gospels not included, but I did, and I still came down with the same conclusion, Jesus is God, God is Jesus, and He is within us.
 
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