Abortion

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steadfast199

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To be pro-abortion are you mentally ill or morally ill?

My opinion is you have to be both.
 
When you describe it as "pro" abortion, then I have to agree with you.

But who is advocating that women get pregnant just so they can get abortions?

Uhhh... nobody.
 
citizenzen said:
When you describe it as "pro" abortion, then I have to agree with you.

But who is advocating that women get pregnant just so they can get abortions?

Uhhh... nobody.
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I mean people who would use the dishonest term "pro reproductive rights" in order
to in order to belittle the rights of the unborn babies
 
i'm not pro-abortion. i am pro-choice. there is a difference and by failing to see it you belittle the moral considerations involved, let alone the rights of the parents involved.

b'shalom

bananabrain
 
In my opinion a baby is not a baby until it is capable of living outside the womb. Until then it is just a cluster of cells living off a host(ess)

Most women who have abortions don't do so lightly. It's a huge decision taken when they don't feel that they have any other choice

Abortions are going to happen, they always have, but...

An abortion undertaken in a safe environment is far better than reverting to back street butchers which is what will happen in the unlikely event that abortion is made illegal again

Having an abortion is a far better option than delivering an unwanted baby who will go on to be abused/abandoned because the mother can't cope

Julia
 
this is a difficult issue and all I can speak is from experience. I was 18 yo and my last year of high school when I got pregnant.. the father wanted me to have an abortion.. I had been brought up in an evangelical Christian home so I wouldnt consider it. 18 years later I have a beautiful intelligent talented daughter who really is my best friend and I thank God that I have her every single day.... she is a blessing to me.

however.. my convictions might not be someone elses and I think we do God and the bible a great diservice by putting other people to a greater moral standard than they are convicted of. This is not what Jesus set out to do during His ministry.. throw stones.. He loved them.. We are called to love each other with Christ-like love. Not throw stones and be condemning.

We change the world through love not through protesting self-righteously. Jesus didnt protest against the tax-collectors the prostitutes and the theives.. He loved them and ministered to them.

My views on this and a lot of things have changed recently. Jesus set the example and boy oh boy have we gone off the deep-end.
 
Julia59 said:
In my opinion a baby is not a baby until it is capable of living outside the womb. Until then it is just a cluster of cells living off a host(ess)

Most women who have abortions don't do so lightly. It's a huge decision taken when they don't feel that they have any other choice

Abortions are going to happen, they always have, but...

An abortion undertaken in a safe environment is far better than reverting to back street butchers which is what will happen in the unlikely event that abortion is made illegal again

Having an abortion is a far better option than delivering an unwanted baby who will go on to be abused/abandoned because the mother can't cope

Julia
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conception + 9 months = Baby
 
Faithfulservant said:
this is a difficult issue and all I can speak is from experience. I was 18 yo and my last year of high school when I got pregnant.. the father wanted me to have an abortion.. I had been brought up in an evangelical Christian home so I wouldnt consider it. 18 years later I have a beautiful intelligent talented daughter who really is my best friend and I thank God that I have her every single day.... she is a blessing to me.

however.. my convictions might not be someone elses and I think we do God and the bible a great diservice by putting other people to a greater moral standard than they are convicted of. This is not what Jesus set out to do during His ministry.. throw stones.. He loved them.. We are called to love each other with Christ-like love. Not throw stones and be condemning.

We change the world through love not through protesting self-righteously. Jesus didnt protest against the tax-collectors the prostitutes and the theives.. He loved them and ministered to them.

My views on this and a lot of things have changed recently. Jesus set the example and boy oh boy have we gone off the deep-end.
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Amen to that..we do everyone a disservice when we expect them to live by the letter of the Law rather than the Spirit. Enough said..I have argued this issue for 35 years and am tired of the same ole..same ole. I just appreciate your honesty. Thumbs up.
 
I used to be very pro choice in my teens - after all, abortion is there to help the victims of rape and abuse, and other situations, isn't it?

However, since then I've heard too often how abortion was used essentially as a means - or instead of - contraception.

When you look at the abortion figures nowadays, it looks like abortion has simply become a matter of convenience, and that the essential arguments for it I held as a teenager just aren't being used.

I'm still pro choice to an extent, but I think abortion criteria needs to be very much tightened.

A baby is a baby regardless as to whether its enfolded in skin or not, and regardless as to whether it's 38 weeks old or 28 weeks old.

I think we seriously need to rethink abortion and access to it - procreation comes with responsibility, and there are still tools such as the morning after pill available. But I think abortion is being dreadfully abused as a convenience and an excuse for not using contraception or practising responsible sex.

Like FF, it took parenthood here to realise how blinded by ideology against practical reality the pro-choice camp has become.
 
What about a return to Victorian values and the Poor Law, when unmarried mothers went to the workhouse. It might help stop women getting raped as well?

s.
 
Namaste all,

Great post Faithful Servant.

The word games people play around it. Pro Choice, Pro Abortion, Anti Abortion, Anti women's reproductive rights?

While I have my beliefs on the subject. They are my beliefs. While I think late term abortions and partial birth abortions are abhorrent, I also think the same of rape and incest and pedophelia. So in my mind as a male especially who am I to determine what is right for a woman in that situation. But even if I was female, I would have my beliefs, and still be open to allow others to have theirs even if I disagreed with them, as each situation is different and we cannot be in anothers shoes.

As you all know, I have issues with anyone that thinks they have all the answers in regard to religion, and what is true, and I have the same issues in this case.

In the US Roe v. Wade decision did not open pandora's box to what we have going on today. Roe v. Wade is specific as to when an abortion is allowed and we are breaking that ruling on a regular basis.

It is also interesting to note the number of Catholics and Evangelicals that voted for Obama, it is obvious that all do not follow the party line on this issue.
 
Snoopy said:
What about a return to Victorian values and the Poor Law, when unmarried mothers went to the workhouse. It might help stop women getting raped as well?
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The heck with the workhouse. We're concentrating on the wrong sex here.

Garnish 25% of all wages that a man makes for every child born out of wedlock.

He can sire three children... leaving 25% for himself. Of course upon the birth of his third child there'd have to be some guarantee that he couldn't father another...

Snip, snip!
 
citizenzen said:
The heck with the workhouse. We're concentrating on the wrong sex here.

Garnish 25% of all wages that a man makes for every child born out of wedlock.

He can sire three children... leaving 25% for himself. Of course upon the birth of his third child there'd have to be some guarantee that he couldn't father another...

Snip, snip!
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Almost anything is better than killing babies
 
steadfast199 said:
I mean people who would use the dishonest term "pro reproductive rights" in order
to in order to belittle the rights of the unborn babies
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What you mean is to have sex and if one gets "knocked up" it's ok to get rid of the "issue"...

That is what this boils down to. (rape or incestual rape, or mother to die, aside...)
 
citizenzen said:
The heck with the workhouse. We're concentrating on the wrong sex here.

Garnish 25% of all wages that a man makes for every child born out of wedlock.

He can sire three children... leaving 25% for himself. Of course upon the birth of his third child there'd have to be some guarantee that he couldn't father another...

Snip, snip!
Click to expand...
How about garnishing 75% of the wages those who would want this kind of life, right off the bat? Do you really think we would see a decline in child birth throughout the country? Or would it go underground? (think american rebellious attitude to the world as it is)...
 
We have had this discussion many times before.

Murdering your own child is the worst crime we can commit.

That is what it is.

Greymare OUT
 
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Quahom1 said:
How about garnishing 75% of the wages those who would want this kind of life, right off the bat? Do you really think we would see a decline in child birth throughout the country? Or would it go underground? (think american rebellious attitude to the world as it is)...
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What I think is that the male part of the problem is too easily overlooked. If people want to force women to carry every fetus to term, then I think we need to make the men responsible for their contribution.
 
citizenzen said:
What I think is that the male part of the problem is too easily overlooked. If people want to force women to carry every fetus to term, then I think we need to make the men responsible for their contribution.
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hmmmm, "fathers, teach your sons well..." comes immediately to mind...
 
Quahom1 said:
hmmmm, "fathers, teach your sons well..." comes immediately to mind...
Click to expand...

Seems like fathers have been teaching sons for centuries to no avail.

Teach them this: you make a baby, and you either marry the girl and raise that baby or else 25% of everything you earn is automatically deducted from your paycheck... no ifs ands or buts.

That'll give the guy a little something more to think about. I'd say it's about time time to hold ourselves accountable for our horny ways.
 
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