No it was not added by Islamic clerics as it's clearly mentioned in the Qur'an and in many of the sayings of Prophet Muhammad that he is the final prophet. The Muslim clerics are not like the clerics in some of the other religions, they never add something new into the religion, their job is just to call people to worship God in the right way which is stated in the Qur'an and the sayings of the Prophet. So they don't speak out their own desires, they just explain and help people to understand Islam better.
The Absolute Truth
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No it was not added by Islamic clerics as it's clearly mentioned in the Qur'an and in many of the sayings of Prophet Muhammad that he is the final prophet. The Muslim clerics are not like the clerics in some of the other religions, they never add something new into the religion, their job is just to call people to worship God in the right way which is stated in the Qur'an and the sayings of the Prophet. So they don't speak out their own desires, they just explain and help people to understand Islam better.
Bhaktajan II
Hare Krishna Yogi
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'Absolute' is that which is equal to enlightenment of "How Things Work".
Everything else, aside from: "the Absolute Way things work" ---is an after-thought.
Absolute Truth is not a path ---it is the goal.
Q: What is the absolute Goal behind all varieties of paths?
A: The Absolute Truth.
What is the Absolute Goal?
Remember "Necessity is the mother of Invention".
Everything else, aside from: "the Absolute Way things work" ---is an after-thought.
Absolute Truth is not a path ---it is the goal.
Q: What is the absolute Goal behind all varieties of paths?
A: The Absolute Truth.
What is the Absolute Goal?
Remember "Necessity is the mother of Invention".
Is there a path that perhaps is more suited than others to leading an individual to the Absolute Truth?
Bhaktajan II
Hare Krishna Yogi
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Does is seem that I am being a nagging biddy; But is it too ephemeral a question, too theoretical a question, to ask posters to
DEFINE "Absolute".
I think that such a round-table of contributors is such to find a distilled common denominator of the truth of "WHAT IS THERE THAT IS ABSOLUTE?"
Waht is "Absolute"?
Is it fair to say what IS NOT "Absolute"?
Surely all agree that the cosmic world is Transcient (temporary)/always morphing; while simultaneously, all exists is absolutely occurring within an ABSOLUTE Cosmos?
Time is Transcient (temporary) ... but ... passing time is an Absolute fact of existance.
Ultimate Absolute Truth is referring to a end-goal "Goal" that is applicaable across all stratums of existance.
Yes. It is known to Lord Brahma, the great grandfather of all the celestial Demigods and their progeny ---it was revealed to them thousands of aeons ago.
It can be passed down only by direct reception of the unbroken chain of teacher to student that has continued to exist in the old-country while the rest of the world pursued violent materialism as the ultimate goal of life.
What is "Absolute Truth"?
What is referred to as the Transcendent embodiment of Truth behind the absolute cycle of repeated Birth and death transmigration of the soul since time immemorial?
The "Absolute Truth" is a direct reference to the Personage of God.
The Personage of God is his own persona that reveals itself by His own discretion as per time & place & audience ---that Personage of God is the epitome & difinitive definition of Absolute Truth.
All roads do not lead to the same destination.
But roads are used to arrive at destinations.
The right road and the right goal is either a temporary reststop or the Absolute Desitination.
All paths can lead in a direction that requires circum-navigating the globe ---or one can take a tactfull course that is a direct route ---but it takes Objective Absolute Truthfull ambition ---only one self can admit such sincerety of single purpose & un-divided spiritual yearning.
An absolute truth must be had by scouting & surveying and traversing and verifying and finally by being 'almost causelessly' benedicted with the route that sums up all the previous lessons accrued in past attempts . . .
The Mahamantra servant,
Bhaktajan
hare rama hare rama
rama rama hare hare
hare krsna hare krsna
krsna krsna hare hare
DEFINE "Absolute".
I think that such a round-table of contributors is such to find a distilled common denominator of the truth of "WHAT IS THERE THAT IS ABSOLUTE?"
Waht is "Absolute"?
Is it fair to say what IS NOT "Absolute"?
Surely all agree that the cosmic world is Transcient (temporary)/always morphing; while simultaneously, all exists is absolutely occurring within an ABSOLUTE Cosmos?
Time is Transcient (temporary) ... but ... passing time is an Absolute fact of existance.
Ultimate Absolute Truth is referring to a end-goal "Goal" that is applicaable across all stratums of existance.
Yes. It is known to Lord Brahma, the great grandfather of all the celestial Demigods and their progeny ---it was revealed to them thousands of aeons ago.
It can be passed down only by direct reception of the unbroken chain of teacher to student that has continued to exist in the old-country while the rest of the world pursued violent materialism as the ultimate goal of life.
What is "Absolute Truth"?
What is referred to as the Transcendent embodiment of Truth behind the absolute cycle of repeated Birth and death transmigration of the soul since time immemorial?
The "Absolute Truth" is a direct reference to the Personage of God.
The Personage of God is his own persona that reveals itself by His own discretion as per time & place & audience ---that Personage of God is the epitome & difinitive definition of Absolute Truth.
All roads do not lead to the same destination.
But roads are used to arrive at destinations.
The right road and the right goal is either a temporary reststop or the Absolute Desitination.
All paths can lead in a direction that requires circum-navigating the globe ---or one can take a tactfull course that is a direct route ---but it takes Objective Absolute Truthfull ambition ---only one self can admit such sincerety of single purpose & un-divided spiritual yearning.
An absolute truth must be had by scouting & surveying and traversing and verifying and finally by being 'almost causelessly' benedicted with the route that sums up all the previous lessons accrued in past attempts . . .
The Mahamantra servant,
Bhaktajan
hare rama hare rama
rama rama hare hare
hare krsna hare krsna
krsna krsna hare hare
Eloquent commentary, thanks for sharing.
c0de
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Actually, they are exactly like them.
Sure they do. Where did they get the idea of stoning people for adultery? Is that in the Quran? Nope. They say its in the hadith. But why would the Prophet contradict the Quran? The punishment for adultery is clearly listed in the Quran, therefore, if the Prophet actually said what these clerics say he did, he would be contradicting the Quran. Yet, there are some Muslims who follow the clerics, instead of the Quran.
They have added more commandments to Islam (that have no basis in the Quran) then are listed in the Quran itself.
Is that all the clerics of Iran are doing? Really?
Are they prophets themselves?
You are talking about "knowing". Faith, is getting there, and knowing is being there...yes?
China Cat Sunflower
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Absolute truth...blah, blah-nee-blah, blah blah... looks like this idol and...obey me.
Chris
Chris
I am not a Muslim but I am interested in learning about it. I have been raised a Christian, as far as Christianity being the absolute truth, I could not say that to someone with absolute conviction, because of the fact that the Bible which is supposed to be the word of God, contradicts itself. For example the Bible says in the old Testament that God is a jealous God and not to worship anyone or anything except him, then the New Testament says that we have to believe in Jesus, this is confusing. Then in the New Testament Jesus says that to follow him, one must give up all his possessions including those he loves. Later the New Testament it says that all we need to do go to heaven and be forever forgiven of our sins is believe that Jesus was God, and that he died for our sins. Once we have confessed this with our lips and asked God for forgiveness, we are forever saved from our sins.
You have to admit these mixed messages can be confusing. In everyday life, I have found that the truth fits easily where it belongs. If you are confused you don't have the truth yet. That's my experience.
I am reading the Quran and have only gotten about a 100 pages into it so far, so I can't say that its message is not confusing or if it makes perfect sense. The first part set right with me though because ever since I was a little girl and I've prayed, I have always addressed my prayers to God. I have never felt comfortable addressing my prayers to Jesus, or saying Thank You Jesus, I always have just naturally addressed prayers for guidance to God, and gave thanks to God. I do believe in Jesus' teachings, I believe he was the most perfect person to ever walk the earth and that he taught the truth in his words and his actions, we should follow his teachings and live by his example, but I'm uncomfortable with calling him God, because I'm confused by the mixed messages from the Old Testament about there being only one God. Why did Jesus' name get changed from Yeshua? Why do Catholics who believe in Christ too, have more books in their Bible? Maybe over time the Truth in the Bible has become distorted trough interpretations, human error, and human intentions. The 100 pages that i have read in the Quran has actually clarified some things that I have questioned in the past from the Bible. Because the message of the Quran was given to only one prophet and not several, it's possible its a more absolute truth.
That's all. I apologize if I'm too wordy, I think as I write sometimes and tend to ramble.
You have to admit these mixed messages can be confusing. In everyday life, I have found that the truth fits easily where it belongs. If you are confused you don't have the truth yet. That's my experience.
I am reading the Quran and have only gotten about a 100 pages into it so far, so I can't say that its message is not confusing or if it makes perfect sense. The first part set right with me though because ever since I was a little girl and I've prayed, I have always addressed my prayers to God. I have never felt comfortable addressing my prayers to Jesus, or saying Thank You Jesus, I always have just naturally addressed prayers for guidance to God, and gave thanks to God. I do believe in Jesus' teachings, I believe he was the most perfect person to ever walk the earth and that he taught the truth in his words and his actions, we should follow his teachings and live by his example, but I'm uncomfortable with calling him God, because I'm confused by the mixed messages from the Old Testament about there being only one God. Why did Jesus' name get changed from Yeshua? Why do Catholics who believe in Christ too, have more books in their Bible? Maybe over time the Truth in the Bible has become distorted trough interpretations, human error, and human intentions. The 100 pages that i have read in the Quran has actually clarified some things that I have questioned in the past from the Bible. Because the message of the Quran was given to only one prophet and not several, it's possible its a more absolute truth.
That's all. I apologize if I'm too wordy, I think as I write sometimes and tend to ramble.
NiceCupOfTea
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I am not a Muslim but I am interested in learning about it. I have been raised a Christian, as far as Christianity being the absolute truth, I could not say that to someone with absolute conviction, because of the fact that the Bible which is supposed to be the word of God, contradicts itself. For example the Bible says in the old Testament that God is a jealous God and not to worship anyone or anything except him, then the New Testament says that we have to believe in Jesus, this is confusing. Then in the New Testament Jesus says that to follow him, one must give up all his possessions including those he loves. Later the New Testament it says that all we need to do go to heaven and be forever forgiven of our sins is believe that Jesus was God, and that he died for our sins. Once we have confessed this with our lips and asked God for forgiveness, we are forever saved from our sins.
You have to admit these mixed messages can be confusing. In everyday life, I have found that the truth fits easily where it belongs. If you are confused you don't have the truth yet. That's my experience.
I am reading the Quran and have only gotten about a 100 pages into it so far, so I can't say that its message is not confusing or if it makes perfect sense. The first part set right with me though because ever since I was a little girl and I've prayed, I have always addressed my prayers to God. I have never felt comfortable addressing my prayers to Jesus, or saying Thank You Jesus, I always have just naturally addressed prayers for guidance to God, and gave thanks to God. I do believe in Jesus' teachings, I believe he was the most perfect person to ever walk the earth and that he taught the truth in his words and his actions, we should follow his teachings and live by his example, but I'm uncomfortable with calling him God, because I'm confused by the mixed messages from the Old Testament about there being only one God. Why did Jesus' name get changed from Yeshua? Why do Catholics who believe in Christ too, have more books in their Bible? Maybe over time the Truth in the Bible has become distorted trough interpretations, human error, and human intentions. The 100 pages that i have read in the Quran has actually clarified some things that I have questioned in the past from the Bible. Because the message of the Quran was given to only one prophet and not several, it's possible its a more absolute truth.
That's all. I apologize if I'm too wordy, I think as I write sometimes and tend to ramble.
both the Bible and Quran have seemingly conflicting themes, but contradictions as far as the Bible are concerned are often a lack of our own understanding and not really contradictions at all.
I have read some of the quran and I converted to islam for a number of years I started reading some of it again this year but there are so many threats of burning in hell for anyone who does not believe mohamed, which really put me off.
As far as praying to Jesus if you believe Jesus is God then its not problem, and if you believe that Jesus died on the cross for you then saying thankyou is also no problem.
c0de
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Really?
You must have a different version from mine.
(either that, or your just taking stuff out of context)
The older I get the more I have to agree. The picture is not the Absolute Truth. Those that focus their teaching on that mislead.
China Cat Sunflower
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Well, yeah. I tried for a long time to find the metaphysical model that explains it all kind of thing, but there just isn't one. There may be an Absolute Truth but practically everyone agrees that whatever It may be, it exists outside our comprehension. There's plenty of little t truth all around which seems to be best encapsulated in little axioms and aphorisms but I just don't see all of that adding up to a single, all encompassing Truth.
Chris
Saltmeister
The Dangerous Dinner
I don't believe in an objective reality and therefore don't believe in absolutes. There are "important" and "compelling" truths but none of these are absolute. What we regard as a rational view or idea is a product of our experience and derives from our existing knowledge.
Accumulation of knowledge enables us to override existing ideas and views with more "rational" ones when it leads to "new understandings." I do not think that these "new understandings" or "new arguments" are necessarily an indication of a higher rationality, but more likely to be rationality of the same level that is of greater breadth.
I would be unable to assign a number that indicates the level of rationality of an idea. Knowledge, understanding, rationality, meaningfulness and truth cannot be quantitatively measured. In religion, the value of an argument, idea or understanding cannot be defined by a numerical value, but by yet another argument.
A person may find an argument that appears to establish the "ultimate rationality" of a particular idea, but that perception of ultimate rationality will only persist as long as nobody is able to find an argument that either "refutes" or shows that the "established" argument is inadequate or misses an important concept.
Because religion involves vague, qualitative and fuzzy concepts, there is no such thing as an invincible argument. The easiest way to defeat an argument in religion is to "think outside the box," show that something outside the box is important and valuable, and that the established argument fails to cover an external concept. A determined opponent will usually be able to find a "loophole" in an argument.
In other words, to defeat any argument, all you have to do is disagree with the established thought system. To put it more simply, all you have to do is disagree and find a reason. The mere existence of an opponent and dissenter is sufficient evidence for the inadequacy of any argument.
Accumulation of knowledge enables us to override existing ideas and views with more "rational" ones when it leads to "new understandings." I do not think that these "new understandings" or "new arguments" are necessarily an indication of a higher rationality, but more likely to be rationality of the same level that is of greater breadth.
I would be unable to assign a number that indicates the level of rationality of an idea. Knowledge, understanding, rationality, meaningfulness and truth cannot be quantitatively measured. In religion, the value of an argument, idea or understanding cannot be defined by a numerical value, but by yet another argument.
A person may find an argument that appears to establish the "ultimate rationality" of a particular idea, but that perception of ultimate rationality will only persist as long as nobody is able to find an argument that either "refutes" or shows that the "established" argument is inadequate or misses an important concept.
Because religion involves vague, qualitative and fuzzy concepts, there is no such thing as an invincible argument. The easiest way to defeat an argument in religion is to "think outside the box," show that something outside the box is important and valuable, and that the established argument fails to cover an external concept. A determined opponent will usually be able to find a "loophole" in an argument.
In other words, to defeat any argument, all you have to do is disagree with the established thought system. To put it more simply, all you have to do is disagree and find a reason. The mere existence of an opponent and dissenter is sufficient evidence for the inadequacy of any argument.