Holy Books?

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inquirer

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Is it true that Bahai's have two promary Holy Books?

What are they (and how do they view other scriptures)?

Also, what about the death of Christ on the cross?

All four Gospels, the book of Acts, and the Epistles speak of His death on the cross, but one passage in the Koran seems to say that He didn't die on the cross at all (unless you interpret it to mean He voluntarily laid His life down, instead of having it taken from Him, which is not how Muslims normally interpret the text.)

What is the Bahai view on this?
 
inquirer said:
Is it true that Bahai's have two promary Holy Books?

What are they (and how do they view other scriptures)?

Also, what about the death of Christ on the cross?

All four Gospels, the book of Acts, and the Epistles speak of His death on the cross, but one passage in the Koran seems to say that He didn't die on the cross at all (unless you interpret it to mean He voluntarily laid His life down, instead of having it taken from Him, which is not how Muslims normally interpret the text.)

What is the Bahai view on this?
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Hey Inquirer thanks for your post and welcome!

Baha'i sacred literature is pretty vast actually and includes the Writings of the Baha'u'llah, the Bab and also Abdul-Baha. Propably the best known important books are the Kitab-i-Iqan and the Kitab-i-Aqdas revealed by Baha'u'llah and the Arabic and Persian Bayan revealed by the Bab.

The writings of Shoghi Effendi are accepted as interpretations but not as Holy Writings and so are not used in devotions.

I'm going to include here a site that has all the writings available in English translation ..

Baha'i Reference Library


Some Tablets have been provisionally translated into English by various people and they are of interest to scholars and have not been authenticated as such and accepted for use.

Some Writings are still in Farsi and Arabic and have yet to be translated...

You will find references in the Writings and quotes from the Gospels and the Qur'an in the Writings. We Baha'is accept that the Bible was inspired but not necessarily accurate in all respects. We do accept the Qur'an as revealed but have interpretations at variance with probably many Muslims. We feel many of these Holy Books have been interpreted too literally by say theologians.

I'm going to answer your question about the crucifixion of Christ in a separate post to follow as it deserves special treatment here!
 
Baha'is accept that Jesus Christ was crucified and martyred on the cross..

Where we differ with most Christians is that we believe His resurrection was not bodily but spiritual and that some of the references say at the end of the Gospels and in Acts to Christ appearing are meant to be taken allegorically or spiritually.

The Baha'i view as I understand it is that Jesus was physically crucified and martyred on the cross.. but His Spirit could not be crucified.. Also the Qur'an elsewhere says the Martyrs should not be seen as "dead" or killed.

"...most Muslims maintain that Jesus was not crucified, but one who looked like Him was instead, based on their understanding of Qur'án 4:156. Shoghi Effendi, however, states that the Qur'ánic passage indicates that the spiritual reality of Christ was beyond crucifixion, not that His body escaped such a fate (Lights of Guidance, 1646, 1652, 1669); this resolves an apparent contradiction between Islam and Christianity. "

Abdul-Baha though also commented on the Qur'anic verse saying the the Spirit of Christ could not be crucified and that those who crucified Him were hoping they had killed His Cause... The disciples later rallied and understood that the martrydom of Jesus was not the end and that the Cause of Christ was "resurrected" spiritually:

"We do not believe that there was a bodily resurrection after the Crucifixion of Christ, but that there was a time after His Ascension when His disciples perceived spiritually His true greatness and realized He was eternal in being. This is what has been reported symbolically in the New Testament and been misunderstood. His eating with His disciples after resurrection is the same thing."

- A letter from Shoghi Effendi the Guardian 9 October 1947 to an individual believer
 
arthra said:
We Baha'is accept that the Bible was inspired but not necessarily accurate in all respects.
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Besides the crucifixion, in what other respects do you believe the bible to be inaccurate?

Do Baha'is believe the book of Revelations was inspired? Deuteronomy?
 
IowaGuy said:
Besides the crucifixion, in what other respects do you believe the bible to be inaccurate?

Do Baha'is believe the book of Revelations was inspired? Deuteronomy?
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Hey there Iowa Guy!

Thanks for posting..

As to the crucifixion we would accept what is in the Gospels..that Jesus died on the cross and was martyred so in that sense it would be "accurate".

As above the Bible is inspired..

The law codes in Deuteronomy would be for the time they were revealed during the dispensation of Moses.

The Book of Revelation was mentioned by Abdul-Baha in a book of His addresses called "Some Answered Questions" and you can read about that here:

Bah' Reference Library - Some Answered Questions

Here are some additional citations that may help you understand how Baha'is view the Bible:

"This Book is the Holy Book of God, of celestial Inspiration. It is the Bible of Salvation, the noble Gospel. It is the mystery of the Kingdom and its light. It is the Divine Bounty, the sign of the guidance of God."

(Written by 'Abdul-Baha in the Bible of the pulpit of the City Temple in London, quoted in "Star of the West", Vol. 2, No. 11, p. 8)

"...the Torah that God hath confirmed consists of the exact words that streamed forth at the bidding of God from the tongue of Him Who conversed with Him (Moses)."

(From a recently translated Tablet of Bahá'u'lláh)

"Know ye that the Torah is that which was revealed in the Tablets to Moses, may peace be upon Him, or that to which He was bidden. But the stories are historical narratives and were written after Moses, may peace be upon Him.

(From a recently translated Tablet of 'Abdu'l-Bahá)


On authenticity:

"...we cannot be sure how much or how little of the four Gospels are accurate and include the words of Christ and His undiluted teachings, all we can be sure of, as Bahá'ís, is that what has been quoted by Bahá'u'lláh and the Master must be absolutely authentic. As many times passages in the Gospel of St. John are quoted we may assume that it is his Gospel and much of it accurate."

(From a letter dated January 23, 1944 written on behalf of Shoghi Effendi to an individual believer)
 
Will we retain our personal identities, and live in a comunity where we're able to recognize one another?

Will we see our loved ones again, and be able to recognoze them?
 
inquirer said:
Will we retain our personal identities, and live in a comunity where we're able to recognize one another?

Will we see our loved ones again, and be able to recognoze them?
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I think that's a great question and one that coincidentally came up to today.. I was at a memorial for a Baha'i (Peter Khan) who had served the Faith for many years and was asked to read the following passage revealed by Baha'u'llah at his memorial service:

Blessed is the soul which, at the hour of its separation from the body, is sanctified from the vain imaginings of the peoples of the world. Such a soul liveth and moveth in accordance with the Will of its Creator, and entereth the all-highest Paradise.

The Maids of Heaven, inmates of the loftiest mansions, will circle around it, and the Prophets of God and His chosen ones will seek its companionship. With them that soul will freely converse, and will recount unto them that which it hath been made to endure in the path of God, the Lord of all worlds.

If any man be told that which hath been ordained for such a soul in the worlds of God, the Lord of the throne on high and of earth below, his whole being will instantly blaze out in his great longing to attain that most exalted, that sanctified and resplendent station..."

~ Baha'u'llah, Gleanings from the Writings of Baha'u'llah, p. 156

But more specifically regarding loved ones the following was recorded of Abdul-Baha responding to this very question!

Mrs. S. asked some questions with reference to the conditions of existence in the next world, and the life after death; she said that having recently lost a very near relative, she had given much thought to this subject. Many thought that re-union with those we had loved, and who had passed on to the future life, would only take place after a long period of time had elapsed. She wished to know whether one would be re-united with those who had gone before immediately after death.

'Abdu'l-Bahá answered that this would depend upon the respective stations of the two. If both had the same degree of development, they would be re-united immediately after death. The questioner then said, how could this state of development be acquired? 'Abdu'l-Bahá replied, by unceasing effort, striving to do right, and to attain spiritual qualities.

Found on p. 73 Abdu'l-Baha in London
 
Here is a quote from the "website suggestion" thread which seemed more appropriate to discuss in this thread:

Ahanu said:
you must have ran into these words from ‘Abdu’l-Bahá sometime in your life: "The true marriage of Bahá'í is this, that husband and wife should be united both physically and spiritually, that they may ever improve the spiritual life of each other, and may enjoy everlasting unity throughout all the worlds of God. This is Bahá'í marriage."
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This got me wondering, what happens if a partner in a Bahai marriage dies? Can Bahai remarry? ('till death do us part?) If they remarry, which of the two spouses will they "enjoy everlasting unity throughout all the worlds of God" with?

What is the Bahai view on divorce, is it allowed?

How about same-sex marriage?
 
IowaGuy said:
Here is a quote from the "website suggestion" thread which seemed more appropriate to discuss in this thread:



This got me wondering, what happens if a partner in a Bahai marriage dies? Can Bahai remarry? ('till death do us part?) If they remarry, which of the two spouses will they "enjoy everlasting unity throughout all the worlds of God" with?

What is the Bahai view on divorce, is it allowed?

How about same-sex marriage?
Click to expand...

Hey Iowa Guy.. Thanks for the great questions!

Let me see if I can respond.

Yes a Baha'i partner in a marriage could ascend/pass on...

Yes a Baha'i is free to remarry..

"Till death us do part" isn't in the wedding vows for Baha'is.. It's more like

"We will all verily abide by the Will of God".

If they remarry, which of the two spouses will they "enjoy everlasting unity throughout all the worlds of God" with?

There's a ring to this that sounds familiar..When Jesus was asked by the Sadducees who would the woman with seven husbands be married to in the resurrection.. You know your Bible.

You can read what I posted above quoting Abdul-Baha as saying:

this would depend upon the respective stations of the two. If both had the same degree of development, they would be re-united immediately after death.

What is the Baha'i marriage about?

Wikipedia has it I think:

Bahá'í marriage is union of a man and a woman. Its purpose is mainly spiritual and is to foster harmony, fellowship and unity between the two partners. The Bahá'í teachings on marriage call it a fortress for well-being and salvation and place marriage and the family as the foundation of the structure of human society.

From the Baha'i Writings:

Among the people of Baha, however, marriage must be a union of the body and of the spirit as well, for here both husband and wife are aglow with the same wine, both are enamoured of the same matchless Face, both live and move through the same spirit, both are illumined by the same glory. This connection between them is a spiritual one, hence it is a bond that will abide forever. Likewise do they enjoy strong and lasting ties in the physical world as well, for if the marriage is based both on the spirit and the body, that union is a true one, hence it will endure. If, however, the bond is physical and nothing more, it is sure to be only temporary, and must inexorably end in separation.

When, therefore, the people of Baha undertake to marry, the union must be a true relationship, a spiritual coming together as well as a physical one, so that throughout every phase of life, and in all the worlds of God, their union will endure; for this real oneness is a gleaming out of the love of God.

In the same way, when any souls grow to be true believers, they will attain a spiritual relationship with one another, and show forth a tenderness which is not of this world. They will, all of them, become elated from a draught of divine love, and that union of theirs, that connection, will also abide forever. Souls, that is, who will consign their own selves to oblivion, strip from themselves the defects of humankind, and unchain themselves from human bondage, will beyond any doubt be illumined with the heavenly splendours of oneness, and will all attain unto real union in the world that dieth not.

("Selections from the Writings of 'Abdu'l-Bahá" (Haifa: Bahá'í World Centre, 1982), sec. 84, pp. 117-18)

(Compilations, The Compilation of Compilations vol II, p. 439)



I'll continue on a succeeding post.:)
 
What is the Bahai view on divorce, is it allowed?

Yes under certain circumstances.... The couple having difficulty appear before the Local Spiritual Assembly sharing their issues.. If they cannot be reconciled a year of separation can be approved...They must live separately.

During that year the couple is supposed to see if they can work things out..attend counseling or whatever. They are not supposed to have relations with other people during this time. At the end of the year of patience if they are still not reconciled a divorce is recognized.

"Same-sex marriage" is not recognized by Baha'is.
 
radarmark said:
What status is accorded 4 Valleys/7 Valleys?
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Thanks for your question...

"The Seven Valleys and The Four Valleys" were revealed by Baha'u'llah in the period 1858 - 1862.

Aside from "Hidden Words" it is one of the most widely read books revealed by Baha'u'llah and widely read among Baha'is.

A beautiful illustrated edition in Persian, English and German was published by the Baha'i-Verlag in 1988 that I believe is still available.

You can read it online at

The Seven Valleys and the Four Valleys Bah'u'llh

Some further details:

About 7 Valleys and 4 Valleys

So anyway it was believed to be modeled after Attar's "Conference of the Birds":

"The birds must cross seven valleys in order to find the Simorgh"

and was directed to Sufi Shaykhs in the mountains of Kurdistan during the retirement of Baha'u'llah there.

An excerpt from the preamble reads:

In the Name of God, the Clement, the Merciful.​
Praise be to God Who hath made being to come forth from nothingness; graven upon the tablet of man the secrets of preexistence; taught him from the mysteries of divine utterance that which he knew not; made him a Luminous Book unto those who believed and surrendered themselves; caused him to witness the creation of all things (Kullu Shay') in this black and ruinous age, and to speak forth from the apex of eternity with a wondrous voice in the Excellent Temple [The Manifestation]: to the end that every man may testify, in himself, by himself, in the station of the Manifestation of his Lord, that verily there is no God save Him, and that every man may thereby win his way to the summit of realities, until none shall contemplate anything whatsoever but that he shall see God therein.
 
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