Were it not for Death, do you think Religion and Faith would even Exist?
- Thread starter Namaste Jesus
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Shibolet
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... and will come no more.
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Shibolet
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In a way... perhaps. Theodor Herzl exhorted his life out in Europe trying to inculcate the Jews with love for Zion and he died of his struggle. He even prophesied that if the Jews did not leave the Diaspora and returned to Israel or somewhere in Africa, Anti-Semitism would destroy them by the millions.Their response was that after one thousand years in Germany and being the main source of wealth for the whole of Europe, no one would want them to leave. And he said that the Jews' own wealth would be the reason for their destruction. As a matter of fact, Hitler would not have declared war on all Europe were not for the Jewish money he confiscated.
Devils' Advocate
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BigJoeNobody
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The war that was started by... Hitler...
the Israel that was created due to... Hitler's mass extermination of Jews (and others rarely mentioned in connection)
It's a dark version of root cause, which from some theories goes back to jews as Hitler wouldn't have Hated them so much had he gotten into the jewish art school. (this is probably known to be false, but it's hard to unlearn things)
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru.
I have not, but there are stories.
Worms are everywhere. "We have thousands of symbiotic relationships with organisms. Without them, you wouldn't be alive today. There are approx. 100 trillion good bacteria on/in you at any given time." https://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20130830102103AAGDuci
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Shibolet
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Really! England was one of the allies winning the war. It rather locked the gates of Israel and forbade the Jews to return to their Land at a most difficult time for the Jews which was right after the Holocaust. Were not for Ben-Gurion, we would have never proclaimed our State in 1948. His policy was to, simultaneously, fight the Arabs in spite of the White Paper and the White Paper in spite of the Arabs.
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Shibolet
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Yea! Stories... the books are full of stories.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru.
Whatever happened in Israel before declaration of its independence was when Britain had the Mandate. Israel is a creation of Britain (in collusion with other Allies). They allowed it to happen.
Exactly and without Hitler and the holocaust, Britain wouldn't have felt compelled to create it.
A Cup Of Tea
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And without the poor economical situation created by WW2 Hitler wouldn't have risen to power. Are we really saying that one point in history that is more relevant then the others for the creation of Israel, and it's Hitler?
It seems to me, that the allies were aghast at the treatment of Jews by Hitler (yes there were millions of others gassed including the millions of Jews, the gypsies and gays were also singled out) that giving the Jews back their homeland after the mistreatment in ghettos around the world I think seemed 'the least we could do' after all, what cost was it to the west to give somebody else's desert to the Jews? (turns out quite costly, but that is another story)
BigJoeNobody
Professional Argument Attractor
oh we aren't doing a root cause analysis?
the reason for the moving of the Jews to modern Israel (the country wasn't part of the deal) can be debated highly, but either way you look at it, Hitler/holocaust was a primary reason, but it can go further back.
BigJoeNobody
Professional Argument Attractor
I agree, still wondering what would have happened if the Gypsys had gotten free land as well. Why they decided to move them to an area the Jews had left centuries before (many of their own will) and which was already owned, I'll never know. I obviously could go on about this, but I'll digress as I'm sure everyone has heard it too many times already.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru.
It is money that the Zionista had in the West.
"Zionist movement was founded in the late 19th century by secular Jews, largely as a response by Ashkenazi Jews to rising antisemitism in Europe, exemplified by the Dreyfus affair in France and the anti-Jewish pogroms in the Russian Empire. The political movement was formally established by the Austro-Hungarian journalist Theodor Herzl in 1897 following the publication of his book Der Judenstaat. At that time, the movement sought to encourage Jewish migration to the Ottoman Palestine." (Wikipedia)
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Shibolet
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If we had to go according to England, we would not have our State today.
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Shibolet
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Not Hitler but the Jewish money of European Jews. Hitler would not have maintained his war were not for his confiscation of the Jewish wealth.
waggindraggin
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I realize you posted a year ago, but its a good question. I suspect death is really the price of being alive and that life isn't possible otherwise. Things that don't die aren't really alive, at least in my experience. Somebody mentioned God. Is God alive? Certainly I don't think God would be alive in any way that relates to our experience. So, I think the explanation is that we ourselves would not have the capacity to be religious.