Do we all pray to the same God?
- Thread starter mystic
- Start date
Any reasonable person who begins dismantling a watch, and starts understanding it's fine mechanism, will conclude that it was designed by some intelligence, for some purpose. Yet our most brilliant scientific minds seem not to believe so. That's all the proof anyone can offer, really ...
Logic...
If we are all praying to G!d, and we are monotheists then it is all the same G!d.... If we think otherwise...we are either not monotheists or not accepting of others beliefs...
If we think we are praying to different gods, than we are polytheists, or saying the rest of you don't know what you are talking about.
If we are all praying to G!d, and we are monotheists then it is all the same G!d.... If we think otherwise...we are either not monotheists or not accepting of others beliefs...
If we think we are praying to different gods, than we are polytheists, or saying the rest of you don't know what you are talking about.
For those that believe, no proof is required, for those that choose not to, no proof is enough.
Scientists are in all varieties....believers and non... Believers point to nature and the stars and just say it is proof of a divine hand and are amazed.... Non believers look at the stars and nature and don't see proof of a.divine hand but are amazed with the science behind it.
For one cholorphyl is drained out of the leaves and leaves their natural brilliance, for others fall leaves and sunsets are not refraction and reflection of light but proof of G!d (his rainbow promise)
Sorry: it's this concept of blind 'belief' i trouble with. It's not that simple. God must respond. God must come. If not, no-one can be expected to just blindly believe in a whole lot of religious nonsense. God must respond. God will respond. Guarantee. No doubt. But it may not be the Mercedes Benz you ask for. And he may not sign his autograph as proof.
Free will means we.have to make the invitation. To let God take over. Sometimes perhaps a person has to get pretty low before doing that.
Moving on ...
Free will means we.have to make the invitation. To let God take over. Sometimes perhaps a person has to get pretty low before doing that.
Moving on ...
Last edited:
This is true. Ofttimes people only turn to God as a last resort and that's usually when they discover he was there all the time just waiting to be acknowledged.
G!d answers all our prayers.... Sometimes the answer is no.
arthra
Baha'i
Baha'is generally accept that God is one and that all the major religions have the same Divine Origin... It may be that each revelation has had its own circumstances and surroundings calling for a variety of teachings to suit the times and conditions but spiritually we are one. Baha'is are active in local inter-faith councils and on an international level with the Parliament of World Religions.
Bhaktajan II
Hare Krishna Yogi
- Messages
- 2,277
- Reaction score
- 115
- Points
- 63
There is a verse:
"Four kinds of pious men render devotional service unto the Supreme Lord—the distressed, the desirer of wealth, the inquisitive, and he who is searching for knowledge of the Absolute." (7.16)
Here is an explanation of this verse, I found on the web:
These persons come to the Supreme Lord for devotional service under different conditions.
These are not pure devotees because they have some aspiration to fulfill in exchange for devotional service.
Pure devotional service is without aspiration and without desire for material profit.
One should render transcendental loving service to the Supreme Lord favorably and without desire
for material profit or gain through fruitive activities or philosophical speculation. That is called pure devotional service.
When these four kinds of persons come to the Supreme Lord for devotional service and are
completely purified by the association of a pure devotee, they also become pure devotees.
As far as the miscreants are concerned, for them devotional service is very difficult because their lives are selfish,
irregular and without spiritual goals. But even some of them, by chance, when they come in contact with a pure devotee, also become pure devotees.
Those who are always busy with fruitive activities come to the Lord in material distress and at that time
associate with pure devotees and become, in their distress, devotees of the Lord.
Those who are simply frustrated also come sometimes to associate with the pure devotees and become inquisitive to know about God.
Similarly, when the dry philosophers are frustrated in every field of knowledge,
they sometimes want to learn of God, and they come to the Supreme Lord to render devotional service
and thus transcend knowledge of Godhead as impersonal and Godhead as the omnipresent Soul and come to
the personal conception of Godhead by the grace of the Supreme Lord or His pure devotee.
On the whole, when the distressed, the inquisitive, the seekers of knowledge, and those who are in need of money
are free from all material desires, and when they fully understand that material remuneration has
nothing to do with spiritual improvement, they become pure devotees.
As long as such a purified stage is not attained, devotees in transcendental service to the Lord are tainted with fruitive activities,
and they search after mundane knowledge, etc.
So one has to transcend all this before one can come to the stage of pure devotional service to Godhead.
"Four kinds of pious men render devotional service unto the Supreme Lord—the distressed, the desirer of wealth, the inquisitive, and he who is searching for knowledge of the Absolute." (7.16)
Here is an explanation of this verse, I found on the web:
These persons come to the Supreme Lord for devotional service under different conditions.
These are not pure devotees because they have some aspiration to fulfill in exchange for devotional service.
Pure devotional service is without aspiration and without desire for material profit.
One should render transcendental loving service to the Supreme Lord favorably and without desire
for material profit or gain through fruitive activities or philosophical speculation. That is called pure devotional service.
When these four kinds of persons come to the Supreme Lord for devotional service and are
completely purified by the association of a pure devotee, they also become pure devotees.
As far as the miscreants are concerned, for them devotional service is very difficult because their lives are selfish,
irregular and without spiritual goals. But even some of them, by chance, when they come in contact with a pure devotee, also become pure devotees.
Those who are always busy with fruitive activities come to the Lord in material distress and at that time
associate with pure devotees and become, in their distress, devotees of the Lord.
Those who are simply frustrated also come sometimes to associate with the pure devotees and become inquisitive to know about God.
Similarly, when the dry philosophers are frustrated in every field of knowledge,
they sometimes want to learn of God, and they come to the Supreme Lord to render devotional service
and thus transcend knowledge of Godhead as impersonal and Godhead as the omnipresent Soul and come to
the personal conception of Godhead by the grace of the Supreme Lord or His pure devotee.
On the whole, when the distressed, the inquisitive, the seekers of knowledge, and those who are in need of money
are free from all material desires, and when they fully understand that material remuneration has
nothing to do with spiritual improvement, they become pure devotees.
As long as such a purified stage is not attained, devotees in transcendental service to the Lord are tainted with fruitive activities,
and they search after mundane knowledge, etc.
So one has to transcend all this before one can come to the stage of pure devotional service to Godhead.
Rarely does God answer prayers in the negative. More often than not it is we that fail to recognize positive response.
I saw a cartoon once where a young boy couldn't wait to see what his mother had brought home from the grocery store. He hurriedly emptied the contents of each bag and looked on with great disappointment. "What's wrong," his mother asked? "Well I prayed for you to bring home a cake, but all that's here is flour, sugar and eggs. Guess God's answer was no. Again...."
If we're pursuing this, my understanding is that although God is concerned with our soul progress, he will give material assistance and comfort, where it doesn't conflict with soul.
But sometimes God will answer prayer by first taking away a lot of the dead weight of material and emotional burden that we cling to like a part of ourselves, until it's stripped from us. With bitter tears. At which point comes the understanding that it was these things -- attachments --that held us down and robbed our freedom?
Can't board that plane carrying the grand piano. Can't enter through the narrow door to freedom, trying to bring through a removal truck filled with stuff. Just a small suitcase.
Perhaps on the other side of the door, where there opens a vista of freedom, we may see all the stuff we held so important, stacked there waiting for us to take it all back again, if we want to, but we will probably prefer the lightness and freedom so painfully learned?
The nexus of the hourglass?
Nice discussion. Thanks
But sometimes God will answer prayer by first taking away a lot of the dead weight of material and emotional burden that we cling to like a part of ourselves, until it's stripped from us. With bitter tears. At which point comes the understanding that it was these things -- attachments --that held us down and robbed our freedom?
Can't board that plane carrying the grand piano. Can't enter through the narrow door to freedom, trying to bring through a removal truck filled with stuff. Just a small suitcase.
Perhaps on the other side of the door, where there opens a vista of freedom, we may see all the stuff we held so important, stacked there waiting for us to take it all back again, if we want to, but we will probably prefer the lightness and freedom so painfully learned?
The nexus of the hourglass?
Nice discussion. Thanks
Last edited:
I like the concept. I think thou it is simply easier to learn from our mistakes than develop a whole construct about how the unknown has planned all this for our benefit. I see how this is designed to make strife, oppression, slavery world conditions more palatable and I really ought to let it lay as millions benefit mentally and physically by this comfort.
The time I learned was when as a young person I prayed in the night, to the Virgin Mary,, against a painful, unbearable event awaiting me the next day, to take it away.
But what she did, she took away the fear. Just like that, it was gone. I knew I could handle it. I went to sleep, and next day, when it happened, I was almost laughing, and others thought I was so brave and quite a hero.
That's when I learned the lesson that even now, in my late years, is still fresh.
Now, of course I do mean that wherever and to whomever sincere prayer is directed, I know God hears. But still for me, when I find myself in times of trouble, Mother Mary comes to me, speaking words of wisdom, let it be ...
Thanks
But what she did, she took away the fear. Just like that, it was gone. I knew I could handle it. I went to sleep, and next day, when it happened, I was almost laughing, and others thought I was so brave and quite a hero.
That's when I learned the lesson that even now, in my late years, is still fresh.
Now, of course I do mean that wherever and to whomever sincere prayer is directed, I know God hears. But still for me, when I find myself in times of trouble, Mother Mary comes to me, speaking words of wisdom, let it be ...
Thanks
Yes, exaxtly what I meant.
I agree. I'd probably say 'where it doesn't conflict with His will, but essentially the same thing.
I think a lot of people experience that. Kenosis ...
... and metanoia.
It's then we see such terms as 'kenosis' and 'metanoia' as more than abstract concepts.
Abused that way? You don't think biblical stories about being tricked into marriage, being stuck.in prison or slavery or famine are designed to make our lives and problems seem either small in comparison or give us hope of something better? (Everlasting life?)