Sexality

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apexcone

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Wasn't sure which section to post this in as I cant see any sections on Relationships/Sexuality.
So I'm guessing it may get moved which is chill....

Just finished reading a great book called Sexual Lust. It's a great book and exposes many of the hideous lies within the church on sexuality. A few years ago I wrote a book called "Biblical Sexuality" For someone in a Poly relationship with other faith people Mark Zinders book has been a real blessing to us all.

If you'd like a copy PM your email and I'll send them in PDF formats. Highly recommended as long as your open to being challenged.

Terry
 
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I've always chuckled at my religious friends views on lgtbq biblical arguments. And really can't wait to hear them try to say that poly lifestyles are not biblical!
 
wil said:
I've always chuckled at my religious friends views on lgtbq biblical arguments. And really can't wait to hear them try to say that poly lifestyles are not biblical!
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It's interesting that the majority of people today think that Monogamy is the Godly model and that Poly in the OT was tolerated by God, they seem to be blind to the fact that it was God that promoted Poly, why NOT so men could have more sex but for the safety of families. Sadly due to the sex negative culture within religion, religious people have sexualized Poly, in most cases due to blindness & a hard heart.

I spoke to a guy the other day who had been married 4 times, clearly monogamy isn't working for him. Even after 4 partners he's now looking for another one, I mentioned that we are all capable of loving more than one person at a time, he didn't get it, for him, you love one at a time, when its done you get rid of them and then try another. How destructive.
 
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Yes but tribal sexual/marriage mores were there to protect the tribe from inbreeding/sexual diseases, etc. There were family structures and a child had to know who his/her father was, for all sorts of reasons. Sexual/marriage laws were very strict.

I'm constantly surprised that otherwise intelligent people don't seem to be able to reduce things to the basics ...
 
RJM Corbet said:
I'm constantly surprised that otherwise intelligent people don't seem to be able to reduce things to the basics ...
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I agree which is why I'm bewildered why people have such hard hearts towards those in alternative marriage structures when the BIble is very unclear on the topic.
 
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Polygamy -- but not adultery -- is still standard for many cultures: one man may have as many wives as he can support financially, and of course physically. In tribal Africa a chief's wives are expected to be fat -- fatter the better proves how well he feeds them.

But it doesn't work to other way. Wives belong to their husbands. Otherwise the tribe is diluted and degraded: sons don't know who their fathers are, whom to obey and fight alongside. Family/tribe structures disintegrate. It's ancient.

The laws are very strict.
 
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But it wasn't then, in tribal structure. It was fun to raid and steal women for wives. To make more children to strengthen the tribe.

That was the reality. Other ancient societies, Romans and Greeks, didn't seem to do polygamy -- perhaps to avoid the issue you highlight, lol.
 
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In the end we all make decisions based on our own wisdom and hopefully the wisdom we have gathered from others and God. All I can say is for us Poly works, no strife, lots of support and buckets of care. That's important.
 
wil said:
It is only an issue to men. It is called equality.
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But I never implied that.

I was analysing the historical/tribal origin of sexual/marriage customs. I wasn't making judgements about the 21st century.

Whatever ...
 
Well then, are we saying the biblical passages people cite all the time regarding sexuality are defining what is sinful, what is moral, what is ethical, or simply tribal customs, do they apply today, or not?
 
People can believe Chaka Zulu if they want, but they have no right to impose their belief on others. Nor, if they stay inside the law, does anyone have the right to deny them the freedom to what they believe either.

EDIT: Sexual/marriage customs have ancient roots in tribal culture, where protection of the tribe was all that mattered.

(Sorry, have I already said that?)
 
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wil said:
Isn't law by definition imposing one set of beliefs on others?
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Yes. But nowadays society votes for its leaders and laws. There are parliaments and representatives and constitutions and bills of rights.

The Hells Angels may believe they have the right to take over a bar without paying, but the law imposes the majority belief that they do not.

Where is this going?
 
RJM Corbet said:
Where is this going?
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No clue, that is not a criteria in conversation to me.
RJM Corbet said:
they have no right to impose their belief on others. Nor, if they stay inside the law,
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This just seems like two opposing statements... Having a law says one group of people does have a right to impose their beliefs on others.

Not saying that is wrong, just pointing out the two statements are incompatible... And in previous posts trying to clarify what we are discussing so actual discussion can continue.

In society we humans tend to like to should all over each other...based on our beliefs we are often more than happy to tell each other what we should or more often shouldn't do.
 
I really miss Bananabrain when these things come up ... there is someone who had a real grasp of the Hebrew writings.
 
Thomas said:
I really miss Bananabrain when these things come up ... there is someone who had a real grasp of the Hebrew writings.
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Yes. At what point did the Jewish people opt for monogamy, instead of the polygamy of David and Solomon, etc? Herod had many wives?

Most western societies have adopted Christian monogamy as law. Of course there's no law against having girlfriends/boyfriends too, but legally you can only be married to one person at a time.
 
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RJM Corbet said:
Yes. At what point did the Jewish people opt for monogamy, instead of the polygamy of David and Solomon, etc? Herod had many wives?
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It's a change over time.

Polygamy was acceptable in the OT, polyandry (wife with more than one husband) was explicitly forbidden. It seems to have gone out of fashion in post-exilic Israel. A shot in the dark would suggest that monogamy became preferable, and of course it would be the marriage of a Jew to another Jew, where in polygamy, we can surmise a Jew might marry a Jew for form's sake, then could marry 'outside the tribe' as it were. As the authorities were determined to return Israel to a pure state (the call to return to Judah after the Babylonian captivity did not go down too well with those Jews who had now made a comfortable living for themselves). This is all off-the-cuff without research, but I'd say monogamy was a safer means of preserving the tribe from dispersion?

The Dead Sea Scrolls indicate that several Jewish sects — which tended to be more right-wing — forbad polygamy.

Josephus speaks of polygamy as acceptable and Justin Martyr reproaches Trypho that the Jewish teachers permitted a man to have several wives.

In 212AD the Lex Antoniana de civitate gave the rights of Roman Citizenship to great numbers of Jews, and it was necessary to tolerate polygamy among them, even though it was against Roman law for a citizen to have more than one wife.

In 285 a constitution of Diocletian and Maximian interdicted polygamy to all subjects without exception, but the Jews, at least, ignored it. In 393 a special law was issued by Theodosius to compel the Jews to relinquish this national custom, but even then it was not well received.

There is scant evidence of polygamy in the early Christian communities, but nothing definitive.
 
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