Different strokes for different folks.
A
apexcone
Guest
Chris & I have been together 45 years, married 41. Our relationship became open 25 years ago. We were struggling and over a period of a month things changed dramatically, I confessed and interest in being sexual with other women and she confessed a life long torment of secretly also being attracted to other women. It's important to remember what works for some folks doesn't work for others. Whilst we are on honesty, the reality is that monogamy doesn't work for the majority of the worlds people, and the fruit is millions of emotionally damaged people, who have believed the lie that they are incomplete without their other half. What a lie. We all need to find completeness in ourselves, before we suck the life out of others.
What has transpired is our love for each other has grown stronger each year. She has had a female partner close to her age for the past 8 years and I have a Japanese female friend, 30 years my junior. All I can say is it works for us, we have shared the same house for the past 6 years with no strife.
In the end people can come to whatever judgments they want about the way we live our lives, but our reality is, it works for us. Its affirming, passionate, peaceful and very sensual.
In my opinion the government needs to get out of the marriage business, and would be wise to focus their attention on why the majority of monogamous relationships dont work instead of making life difficult for those who have chosen another path. When one looks at the stats for melt downs in Poly relationships its less than 15% compared to well over 50% amongst monogamous couples.Go figure its not rocket science.
I wrote the following article for the Guardian
Terry
What has transpired is our love for each other has grown stronger each year. She has had a female partner close to her age for the past 8 years and I have a Japanese female friend, 30 years my junior. All I can say is it works for us, we have shared the same house for the past 6 years with no strife.
In the end people can come to whatever judgments they want about the way we live our lives, but our reality is, it works for us. Its affirming, passionate, peaceful and very sensual.
In my opinion the government needs to get out of the marriage business, and would be wise to focus their attention on why the majority of monogamous relationships dont work instead of making life difficult for those who have chosen another path. When one looks at the stats for melt downs in Poly relationships its less than 15% compared to well over 50% amongst monogamous couples.Go figure its not rocket science.
I wrote the following article for the Guardian
Terry
Ah, so in the end it was the later Roman emperors who legally put an end to it?
Thank you
LolI've been married to the same woman for nearly 30 years now. No desire whatsoever to branch out. Like the Bible tells us, no man can serve two masters.
True
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It's easy to predict some religious types might disapprove. But how does the government affect you? Except by the law of monogamy, I mean? Genuine question. You're getting no moral judgements from me.
(I look forward to reading your article. I've downloaded it, but it's hard to read on my phone)
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Aussie Thoughts
Just my 2 cents
Same here, 21 years this coming August. Made a solemn vow before God and fully intend to honor it. The way I see it, you can either let carnal desire rule your life or tell it to get thee hence.
Different strokes for different folks. Lol
The ideal western 'autonomous' marriage — a heterosexual couple falling in love — is demonstrably a precarious affair with a very high failure rate, possibly as much as 50% in the US and Europe.
We're also now getting stats to show single parent and same sex couples are just as capable of bringing up perfectly rounded human beings as the 'norm'. So it would seem that 'love' counts more in a relationship than the gender of the lovers.
Where the 'role model' argument stands on this I don't know. My son-in-law works with pre- and early-school kids (a man being as rare as 'rocking horse shit' in this age group) and more than once the all-female staff have seen him interact with boys and say 'you're here for life'. Partly because he plays 'robust' games (he's a qualified swimming and skiing instructor, plays hockey and, er, 'shoots hoops', apparently ... a colonial thing? I have no idea what he's talking about). Partly because he has a deep knowledge of comic books, graphic novels and computer games.
The day he wore an Iron Man t-shirt to work he was trampled in a stampede of kids.
Favourite question:
"In a fight between Iron Man and Jesus, who would win?"
"Well, I don't think Jesus would fight..."
"Yeah, but if he did, who would win?"
"Well, Jesus' dad is God?"
"Yeah, but who would win?"
Back to the topic, the 'standard model' is failing terribly, its hardly surprising that people will look to alternative models.
Just as an aside ... what about arranged marriages?
Now before you all jump on me, I know, I know, I have massive reservations. Too often the female partner is too young, too often the female partner is little more than a chattel (but then how often is that the case in an autonomous marriage). Too often the female partner is unable to get out of the arrangement (ditto for autonomous marriages).
I'm not necessarily defending the institution, but two things:
I know of two very successful women — one a TV personality and the other a barrister and Queen's Counsel — both who live in happy and indeed loving arranged marriages. I can think of others who defend the institution. I recallone wife in an arranged marriage declaring the failure rate of autonomous marriages meant proponents of that system were in no position to criticise others.
What I'm suggesting is that the western idea of 'falling in love' is too often a myth and a fantasy. I'm not proposing arranged marriages, rather I'm suggesting we should look at arranged marriages and see what can be learned from them.
There is, I believe, a strong case to argue 'love grows' between two people who respect each other. That maybe love is not always, and not necessarily, cupid's arrow, but love can equally be something worked towards.
Then again, a significant number of 60+ couples are separating, now that life expectancy stretches on before them!
Me and my beloved celebrate 41 years this year. I find it hard to think of starting all over again ...
We're also now getting stats to show single parent and same sex couples are just as capable of bringing up perfectly rounded human beings as the 'norm'. So it would seem that 'love' counts more in a relationship than the gender of the lovers.
Where the 'role model' argument stands on this I don't know. My son-in-law works with pre- and early-school kids (a man being as rare as 'rocking horse shit' in this age group) and more than once the all-female staff have seen him interact with boys and say 'you're here for life'. Partly because he plays 'robust' games (he's a qualified swimming and skiing instructor, plays hockey and, er, 'shoots hoops', apparently ... a colonial thing? I have no idea what he's talking about). Partly because he has a deep knowledge of comic books, graphic novels and computer games.
The day he wore an Iron Man t-shirt to work he was trampled in a stampede of kids.
Favourite question:
"In a fight between Iron Man and Jesus, who would win?"
"Well, I don't think Jesus would fight..."
"Yeah, but if he did, who would win?"
"Well, Jesus' dad is God?"
"Yeah, but who would win?"
Back to the topic, the 'standard model' is failing terribly, its hardly surprising that people will look to alternative models.
Just as an aside ... what about arranged marriages?
Now before you all jump on me, I know, I know, I have massive reservations. Too often the female partner is too young, too often the female partner is little more than a chattel (but then how often is that the case in an autonomous marriage). Too often the female partner is unable to get out of the arrangement (ditto for autonomous marriages).
I'm not necessarily defending the institution, but two things:
I know of two very successful women — one a TV personality and the other a barrister and Queen's Counsel — both who live in happy and indeed loving arranged marriages. I can think of others who defend the institution. I recallone wife in an arranged marriage declaring the failure rate of autonomous marriages meant proponents of that system were in no position to criticise others.
What I'm suggesting is that the western idea of 'falling in love' is too often a myth and a fantasy. I'm not proposing arranged marriages, rather I'm suggesting we should look at arranged marriages and see what can be learned from them.
There is, I believe, a strong case to argue 'love grows' between two people who respect each other. That maybe love is not always, and not necessarily, cupid's arrow, but love can equally be something worked towards.
Then again, a significant number of 60+ couples are separating, now that life expectancy stretches on before them!
Me and my beloved celebrate 41 years this year. I find it hard to think of starting all over again ...
Seems we have a winner here! Can we end the ... length contest?
(mumble mumble 25 mumble blah)In addition to the "different strokes" dictum, I'd like to point out that any kind of human relationship requires mutual care, vulnerability, border-asserting, love, openness, and all the other good qualities, in order to maintain it and prevent it from becoming a nightmare of power-play and manipulation. Parent-child. Romantic partners. Siblings. Friends. Teachers! Neighbors.
Partnership is special, but not so super special as to make it totally incomparable to all these other relationships.
In time, you've seen it all.
I think a lot is preconditioning.
Nonscientific... But prearranged marriages seem to work more often where that is the norm. I have Indian friends that this is common and know of a few, know of no divorces (also no child marriages, all couples similar ages)
If you are from a family which divorce is common then it increases likelihood.
If you are from a family that has issues,.yet communicates and works things out then you have that pattern to follow.
Again...people do break the mold of whatever they are raised in, but nurture does have an affect.
I think a lot is preconditioning.
Nonscientific... But prearranged marriages seem to work more often where that is the norm. I have Indian friends that this is common and know of a few, know of no divorces (also no child marriages, all couples similar ages)
If you are from a family which divorce is common then it increases likelihood.
If you are from a family that has issues,.yet communicates and works things out then you have that pattern to follow.
Again...people do break the mold of whatever they are raised in, but nurture does have an affect.
Congratulations. Given the failure rate of marriages these days, alternative lifestyles and what have you, I believe those who have managed to make a go of it in the traditional sense and kept their marriage vows, are to be commended and not made light of.
Where my wife comes from, Fiji, arranged marriages are the norm. She's Hindu and in her tradition, marriage comes first, love second. Not the other way around. The way it works there, when a young man comes of age he tells his parents, usually the mother, when/if he's ready to marry and the search begins. In most cases a running tally of eligible females in the area has already been compiled or there's someone in particular he's interested in, likewise for perspective suitors, so things happen quickly.
The next step is for each set of parents to meet. The first encounter is more or less just a tentative proposal. If all are in agreement at that point, a 2nd meeting is arranged at the perspective brides home for the boys parents to gage her demeanor and to meet the rest of her family. The boy's parents then report their findings to their son and if acceptable, a 3rd meeting is arranged at the perspective grooms home to do same. If that goes well and only if that goes well, a 4th meeting takes place for the perspective couple to meet. If they like one another, negotiations begin and a dowry is agreed upon. This is just a formality really to honor tradition and not taken that serious as no doubt both parties are of meager means.
Once that's ironed out, there'll be a court marriage. Though legally binding, the locals consider this only an engagement until a religious service takes place some days/weeks later.
Divorce rates in my wife's country were once very low, but in recent years they seem to be on the rise, as is promiscuity and the number of young people rejecting tradition in favor of finding their own life partners.
Now, in our case, the wife and I sort of accidentally bypassed the whole thing. She was a long time pen pal of mine that I had decided to go and meet. No intention of marriage really, but that's exactly what happened 4 days after meeting face to face. My late father-in-law however, always considered ours an arranged marriage. From his perspective, since his daughter had asked his permission to write to me in the first place and he had agreed, the arrangement process had started. That and the fact that I had initially rejected her as a pen pal and the extraordinary circumstances that put us back in touch a year later, led him to believe God had solidified that arrangement. My late father-in-law was one of the wisest men I've ever know, so in all honesty, I tend to agree.
Getting married was the absolute best thing I ever did. I mean, I second guess, 3rd guess and 4th guess myself all the time, but getting married to someone I only knew through the mail, not a moments hesitation. The only tense moment I ever had was when I first brought my new bride home to what had been [my] apartment. I married late in life and was pretty set in my ways. The first thing she did was look over and touch everything. I sort of had brief panic attack. "Oh my goodness, she's touching all my stuff!" Then I hear in my head, ....and they shall become one flesh. That's when I realized, it's not just [me] anymore. It's us and we. A peace fell over me I can't even describe and I've never looked back or even once entertained the thought of being with another.
On that note, to each his own.Perhaps we could start looking for a different word, lol ...
Peace be with you friends....
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I've never heard anyone make light of a longstanding working relationship.
A
apexcone
Guest
Then I hear in my head said:....and they shall become one flesh.[/I]
On that note, to each his own.
Peace be with you friends....
Great news. I'm so pleased for you. "One flesh" means one in spirit NOT numerical
Thanks, lol. Actually, “And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh.” has spiritual, physical and numerical meaning. Twain being the archaic term for two and Flesh being our physical presence. Two lives, joined together by God, no longer separate, but intertwined in every respect.
A
apexcone
Guest
We'll have to agree to disagree. If two people become one then we licence the false belief that we need to find our other half, as your theory appears to indicate that the 2 are no longer separate, but 1
Terry
I'm suddenly reminded of my time as a counter salesman when a few minutes before opening one day, this little fellow began frantically knocking on the glass and pointing at his watch. "My watch says 9 o'clock!" So I pointed at the big clock on the wall behind me, clearly visible from his vantage point and shouted back, "We're going by this clock today. Avoids confusion when you're not around!"
No Mr. Johns, with all due respect, I do not share your opinion. Two people joining as one is referring to what happens when we marry. It is not however, mandating the practice. In fact ...it is good for them if they abide even as I. (unmarried) But if they cannot contain, let them marry: and once that vow is made, ...they are no more twain, but one flesh. Committed to each other's needs.
The wife hath not power of her own body, but the husband: and likewise also the husband hath not power of his own body, but the wife.
No Mr. Johns, with all due respect, I do not share your opinion. Two people joining as one is referring to what happens when we marry. It is not however, mandating the practice. In fact ...it is good for them if they abide even as I. (unmarried) But if they cannot contain, let them marry: and once that vow is made, ...they are no more twain, but one flesh. Committed to each other's needs.
The wife hath not power of her own body, but the husband: and likewise also the husband hath not power of his own body, but the wife.
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A
apexcone
Guest
Hey I’m ok with you not agreeing. Would I be right in assuming you believe the Bible is the word of God, because your response seemed very fundamentalist.
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There is no dogma or dictums on what is or isn't marriage or love on this site...none of our opinions or beliefs represent the whole or are more right than another's.
We do however appreciate a modicum of decorum from all, newbies and old farts.
We do however appreciate a modicum of decorum from all, newbies and old farts.
No book or scripture holds court outside it's coral, no proper interpretation is higher inside the coral.