Who created God?

"At Savatthi. There the Blessed One said: "From an inconstruable beginning comes transmigration. A beginning point is not evident, though beings hindered by ignorance and fettered by craving are transmigrating & wandering on. What do you think, monks: Which is greater, the tears you have shed while transmigrating & wandering this long, long time — crying & weeping from being joined with what is displeasing, being separated from what is pleasing — or the water in the four great oceans?"

I differ from Buddha here. If there is no 'atta', there is no transmigration. In Advaita Hinduism, there is no 'atta' and no transmigration. It is the effect of 'karmas' that lingers on. Like a Buddhist told me, a billiard ball passes its energy to another. What Gandhi or Caliph Ibrahim did (good and bad), effects us even now when they are no more.

Bahais are a different class, since they seek numbers from all other religions.
 
Aupmanyav said:
"Who created God?"
Those who benefited by its creation, in cornering power or money - or who wanted to do so (some did not succeed).
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Yes, I understand .. you think that the Abrahamic concept of God [with a big G], is not true, and mankind has invented it..
..is that right?

However, mankind can understand the concept of something responsible for our existence .. so that cannot be to do
with power or money, I would have thought.
 
Aupmanyav said:
"Who created God?"
Those who benefited by its creation, in cornering power or money - or who wanted to do so (some did not succeed).
Click to expand...

The thing here is, that all the Messengers that told us about God, gave their lives and worldly wealth up for God, as an example for us to follow.

Those that do follow those Messengers and God in truth, do likewise.

Regards Tony
 
Most religions reject material attachment and desire
 
muhammad_isa said:
However, mankind can understand the concept of something responsible for our existence .. so that cannot be to do with power or money, I would have thought.
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Yeah, there are atoms, energy, space and time. That is where we have to look for answers, and not in Gods / Allah / avataras / prophets / sons / messengers / manifestations / mahdis.
 
Tone Bristow-Stagg said:
The thing here is, that all the Messengers that told us about God, gave their lives and worldly wealth up for God, as an example for us to follow.
Those that do follow those Messengers and God in truth, do likewise.
Click to expand...
They told you or they fooled you, and you may be doing to same to others. 'Without getting your nose cut, you cannot see the Emperor's new clothes'.
Jesus alone was the unsuccessful. Others, Moses, Mohammad, Bahaollah and Mirza Ghulam Ahmad died in prosperity and comfort; Bahaollah up to his third generation when his line petered out.
 
Aupmanyav said:
What speaks to me is my conscience.
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Yes, that's it. The concept of conscience is non-physical.
In psychology, the subconscious is the part of the mind that is not currently in focal awareness.
It is possible to ignore our conscience, and hardly be aware of doing so.

One does not need to know anything about the Abrahamic God to ask ourselves how we came to exist.

Aupmanyav said:
..there are atoms, energy, space and time..
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There is more than that .. there is your conscience, as well :)
Does your intelligence / conscience tell you that something can evolve from no-thing?
 
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Aupmanyav said:
What speaks to me is my conscience.
That has developed according to my up-bringing (Samskaras), society, culture, education, religion and life experiences. No God or Allah involved in this.
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Sure you can see it that way, in the end it is the good we do in life that matters.

Regards Tony
 
Aupmanyav said:
They told you or they fooled you, and you may be doing to same to others. 'Without getting your nose cut, you cannot see the Emperor's new clothes'.
Jesus alone was the unsuccessful. Others, Moses, Mohammad, Bahaollah and Mirza Ghulam Ahmad died in prosperity and comfort; Bahaollah up to his third generation when his line petered out.
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One needs to research to see what they offer is based on truth. In the end, we will look for what we choose to.

Regards Tony
 
Tone Bristow-Stagg said:
One needs to research to see what they offer is based on truth.
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That is correct.
However, it seems that people have different ideas about what is true.
Apparently, according to history books, the heretical Christian Arius believed in
a spiritual Father creating a spiritual Son (before the ages),
but wasn't smart enough to realise that he believed in 2 gods.

Likewise, all of his followers were oblivios too.
Oh well !

Tone Bristow-Stagg said:
In the end, we will look for what we choose to.
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Exactly!
If we think that the Arians and Muslims are "ignorant barbarians", then that's how it is!
 
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But wait a moment .. the plot thickens.
..because not only did Arians believe that the Father created the Son "before the ages",
they also believed, according to history books, in an eternal Logos which became flesh.

Logic tells us that something can't become flesh "before the ages" ..
.. because there IS no flesh :confused:
Logic also tells us that a created son cannot be eternal.

I don't think even Einstein could make sense of that .. but then, he didn't have to.
Arians must have been an inferior race with an IQ of 50, according to history books.
Many white people used to believe that about black people. [some still do]
Hmm.
 
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muhammad_isa said:
That is correct.
However, it seems that people have different ideas about what is true.
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Truth is relative. There is no Absolute truth in this world of illusions.

When the Spirit of Absolute Truth visits us from age to age, we mostly reject what is offered as truth in our time.

Regards Tony
 
One might ask what my last 2 posts have to do with "who created God?"
A very good question :)

It looks more like a philosophical battle to determine supremacy to me.
The question has a very simple answer .. He is eternal .. He has never been a mortal human being and never will be.
God cannot be born or die.
 
muhammad_isa said:
One might ask what my last 2 posts have to do with "who created God?"
A very good question :)

It looks more like a philosophical battle to determine supremacy to me.
The question has a very simple answer .. He is eternal .. He has never been a mortal human being and never will be.
God cannot be born or die.
Click to expand...

Thus, the only way we can know God, is via the Messengers.

God is also not He! ;)

Regards Tony
 
muhammad_isa said:
The concept of conscience is non-physical.
One does not need to know anything about the Abrahamic God to ask ourselves how we came to exist.
Does your intelligence / conscience tell you that something can evolve from no-thing?
Click to expand...
- Beg to differ. Conscience is totally physical, arises out of brain and its working, and is the behavior learnt during bringing up, education, religion and life experiences. There is nothing occult or mysterious about it.
- Science tells you how we came to exist. What has an imaginary fictional entity to do with that?
- Again, I would check with science as to whether anything can arise out of nothing. And at the moment, science does not deny the possibility (Many-worlds interpretation, Zero-energy universe - Wikipedia). Conscience relates to our behavior and actions, and not for the questions of science.
 
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Tone Bristow-Stagg said:
Thus, the only way we can know God, is via the Messengers.
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Yeah, only the story-teller (Dastan-go, if you know the meaning) can tell you about the character in his fiction. He can make it any way he wants. Basically, Iranians were good at story-making - Arabian Nights, Shahnama, etc.

Scheherazade and Shahryār by Ferdinand Keller, 1880 (Arabian Nights)
220px-Ferdinand_Keller_-_Scheherazade_und_Sultan_Schariar_%281880%29.jpg
 
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