Christian who honour Judaism should honour Islam too?

[muhammad_isa]

Moved discussion comments about the subject onto this new thread, to avoid derailing @wil's thread
Interfaith prayer … for all
https://www.interfaith.org/community/threads/19982/

The title of this thread can be changed to whatever anyone suggests? RJM

@muhammad_isa I apologize that the thread is credited to you, It's too late to change it now, because to delete the first post here will delete the whole thread. I'm trying to fix it. In the meantime please accept my apology

I can't embrace an all paths lead to God belief system as much as it sounds good because it removes Jesus Christ from the equation. Jesus is the Cornerstone of my Faith. If a religion denies Jesus or adds anything to Jesus as the means of Salvation that would be a false religion or false gospel.

Strange don't you think?
..that you say this, yet do not consider Judaism as a "false religion" ?

 

[Faithfulservant]

Strange don't you think?
..that you say this, yet do not consider Judaism as a "false religion" ?

It's not the same. You know this. Judaism is the father of my faith. The God of Abraham is My God and His name is Jesus Christ. Nice try though!

 

[muhammad_isa]

It's not the same. You know this. Judaism is the father of my faith. The God of Abraham is My God and His name is Jesus Christ.

Uhhh ..no.
Either you consider Judaism a "false religion" or you do not.
Jews do not believe that Jesus is the "God of Abraham"..
..so which is it? False or true?

Incidentally, I do not consider Christianity and Judaism to be "false religions".
I just observe that they do not believe that Muhammad is a prophet of G-d.

 

[Faithfulservant]

Uhhh ..no.
Either you consider Judaism a "false religion" or you do not.
Jews do not believe that Jesus is the "God of Abraham"..
..so which is it? False or true?

Incidentally, I do not consider Christianity and Judaism to be "false religions".
I just observe that they do not believe that Muhammad is a prophet of G-d.

The God of Abraham is Jesus Christ just because they don't accept that now doesn't mean they won't later as the book of Revelation prophesized amongst others. Imo of course. I'm sorry I'm not going to let you corner me with false logic.

 

[muhammad_isa]

The God of Abraham is Jesus Christ just because they don't accept that now doesn't mean they won't later as the book of Revelation prophesized amongst others. Imo of course. I'm sorry I'm not going to let you corner me with false logic..

It is NOT false logic..
..to consider Islam a "false religion" whilst not applying the same criteria to Judaism,
is disingenuous, imo.

Both religions have their roots in the God of Abraham .. but you show predudice?
Furthermore, Islam recognises Jesus as the Messiah, whilst Judaism does not.

PS I am not trying to create discord .. just saying it how I see it

 

[Faithfulservant]

It is NOT false logic..
..to consider Islam a "false religion" whilst not applying the same criteria to Judaism,
is disingenuous, imo.

Both religions have their roots in the God of Abraham .. but you show predudice?
Furthermore, Islam recognises Jesus as the Messiah, whilst Judaism does not.

PS I am not trying to create discord .. just saying it how I see it

With all due respect and I'm only speaking for myself. I know this bothers you that I cannot accept Islam. I'm sorry. You have issue with me taking the bible literally. I can do nothing else but take it literally. It's my very food.

The reason I cannot accept Islam and the Quran is because of the prophet Muhammad.

We are given the criteria to test Prophets of God.

If what a prophet proclaims in the name of the LORD does not take place or come true, that is a message the LORD has not spoken. That prophet has spoken presumptuously. Do not be afraid of him." Deuteronomy 18:20-22

If they err in one thing they cannot be a prophet.

Even though you accept Jesus as a prophet you deny Him as God. That is one of the very basic but most important aspect of my faith. To deny Him what He Himself claimed . To deny that He died and rose again is also an issue.

I know that you will say Judaism denies this as well but prophecy states they will future tense. I believe in my heart Islam and the descendants of Ishmael will also. At that time we will be one faith until that time comes we are divided.

 

[muhammad_isa]

With all due respect and I'm only speaking for myself. I know this bothers you that I cannot accept Islam.

No, it does not bother me.
What bothers me is the favoritism of Jews over Muslims.

The reason I cannot accept Islam and the Quran is because of the prophet Muhammad.

Right .. but you are OK with the Prophet Moses.

 

[Faithfulservant]

No, it does not bother me.
What bothers me is the favoritism of Jews over Muslims.

I can understand that. If it's helpful.. they don't usually care for us much. People of my faith that is. We are grateful because it's through them that we have salvation.

Right .. but you are OK with the Prophet Moses.

I'm not sure if I'm understanding the comparison but I think there's a difference between a prophet in the sense of speaking future prophecy and a prophet speaking the word of God given divinely.

Muhammad made false future predictions which disqualified him according to scripture.

 

[TheLightWithin]

It's not the same. You know this. Judaism is the father of my faith. The God of Abraham is My God and His name is Jesus Christ. Nice try though!

Does that mean considering all the other Abrahamic religions to be non-false also? In whole or in part?
Or is it more of a dual-covenant Judeo-Christian affirming kind of thinking?

 

[muhammad_isa]

Muhammad made false future predictions..

Really?
Then why don't Muslims think so?

 

[Faithfulservant]

Really?
Then why don't Muslims think so?

I don't know . Maybe the same way Christians don't consider things opposing Christianity? You tell me? Answering Islam has a pretty lengthy list. You probably wouldn't consider that a reputable source as it opposes your beliefs and I don't blame you.

Muhammad's False Prophecies

 

[muhammad_isa]

You probably wouldn't consider that a reputable source as it opposes your beliefs and I don't blame you..

I don't criticise it because it "opposes my beliefs"..
I criticise it because it is a pointless polemic.

It just looks for flaws, and claims that "Rome was not defeated in the time span"..
..or Macca was not defeated as hadith said etc. etc.

Islam has done pretty well, considering that Muhammad peace be with him, is a false prophet.

No .. both Jews and Christians used to bow and prostrate in daily worship. It is truth.

 

[Faithfulservant]

I don't criticise it because it "opposes my beliefs"..
I criticise it because it is a pointless polemic.

It just looks for flaws, and claims that "Rome was not defeated in the time span"..
..or Macca was not defeated as hadith said etc. etc.

Islam has done pretty well, considering that Muhammad peace be with him, is a false prophet.

No .. both Jews and Christians used to bow and prostrate in daily worship. It is truth.

It's a bit hypocritical that you wonder why Christians cannot accept Muhammad as prophet but you deny us our core beliefs. I've explained why we cannot accept him based on a scripture that you say is yours as well and you pish posh it away as pointless polemic.

There will be a day that every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord. Every prophecy in the bible has come true so far. Just saying.

 

[muhammad_isa]

It's a bit hypocritical that you wonder why Christians cannot accept Muhammad as prophet but you deny us our core beliefs..

Yes .. that's what it is.
The Jews base their religion on the Hebrew Scriptures .. which Jesus also followed.
There was no written New Testament, in the time of Jesus.

..but Muhammad revealed a scripture, which more or less confirms a Jewish belief,
thereby condemning Christian belief. It is spelled out.
I guess that it is seen as more of "a threat" .. so it is deemed "false".

Almighty God knows why we say what we say, and do what we do.
He will judge between us all on the day of judgment.

 

[Faithfulservant]

He will judge between us all on the day of judgment.

Indeed.

 

[RJM]

It is NOT false logic..
..to consider Islam a "false religion" whilst not applying the same criteria to Judaism,
is disingenuous, imo.

Both religions have their roots in the God of Abraham .. but you show predudice?

Therefore by your true logic you have to consider Baha'i, and Amadiyya true religions? Also Rasta and I'm sure the list goes on? You would be disingenuous not to?

 

[muhammad_isa]

Therefore by your true logic you have to consider Baha'i, and Amadiyya true religions? Also Rasta and I'm sure the list goes on? You would be disingenuous not to?

No ..
Islam is the world's second most followed religion.
It has its roots through Abraham's other son Ishmael.

..The notion that Jews are favoured by God, and "Ishmaelites" are barbarians is disingenuous.

 

[RJM]

No ..
Islam is the world's second most followed religion.
It has its roots through Abraham's other son Ishmael.

..The notion that Jews are favoured by God, and "Ishmaelites" are barbarians is disingenuous.

Does that mean Christians have to accept the Qur'an as the word of God, in contradiction to the New Testament?

 

[Faithfulservant]

No ..
Islam is the world's second most followed religion.
It has its roots through Abraham's other son Ishmael.

..The notion that Jews are favoured by God, and "Ishmaelites" are barbarians is disingenuous.

It's not a favoured thing.. it's that He has a covenant was with the Jews. God loves the underdog and correct me if I'm wrong but the population of Jews is far less than the Muslims. Israel is the size of New Jersey and still they are surrounded by countries of Muslims that want to destroy them.

God made a new covenant with the rest of the world but if it's being rejected to follow another god how can you blame the Jews for honoring their covenant?

 

[muhammad_isa]

Does that mean Christians have to accept the Qur'an as the word of God, in contradiction to the New Testament?

Of course not.
Read what I said .. does it mean that you should become a Jew, because you consider them favoured?
Of course not.