Christian who honour Judaism should honour Islam too?

[RJM]

I don't see so much difference between "resurrected" and "revived". The Greek term is just "raised". It transcends our experience anyway, and whatever idea we have, it's not more than an image.

Revived means he did not die but was taken down unconscious, and given medical treatment. His wounds would have been very severe, crippling, and he wouldn't be walking around a bit later, grilling fish and inviting Thomas to insert a hand into the spear wound.

Resurrected means he died and resurrected in a renewed body, over which he had complete manifest control, to appear or disappear and to manifest wounds for Thomas. Sometimes his disciples did not recognize him, until he revealed that it was him. That is why Caravaggio paints a Christ at The Supper At Emmaus who does not look much like Jesus, but revealing himself by the breaking of bread?

 

[talib-al-kalim]

It's a bit hypocritical that you wonder why Christians cannot accept Muhammad as prophet but you deny us our core beliefs. I've explained why we cannot accept him based on a scripture that you say is yours as well and you pish posh it away as pointless polemic.

There will be a day that every knee will bow and every tongue will confess that Jesus is Lord. Every prophecy in the bible has come true so far. Just saying.

Prophecy has always been a delicate thing,in particular if it's concerning future. Jesus did not fit all visions of the Messiah, the end of time was not at reach, as Jesus expected it (although he admitted that doesn't know the time).

 

[wil]

Going on the title alone...Christian who honour Judaism should honour Islam too?

I say no ... and sort of. Now if you lay any claim to interfaith warrior or interfaith ally ... the answer is an obvious yes.

If you are a Christian ... I am sure you can find ideals of Jesus's teachings which support that you should. But many Christian groups say and do things contrary to Jesus's teachings ... as a matter of fact they like to quote Jewish texts when it more suits them than words of Jesus.

But Christians that do honor Judaism (definitely not all of them!) Often do it as it is the "parent" of their religion and the one their savior was born into. Islam is often looked at as a stepchild.

But again ... this is not a christian site, but an interfaith one.

 

[talib-al-kalim]

Yes .. that's what it is.
The Jews base their religion on the Hebrew Scriptures .. which Jesus also followed.
There was no written New Testament, in the time of Jesus.

..but Muhammad revealed a scripture, which more or less confirms a Jewish belief,
thereby condemning Christian belief. It is spelled out.
I guess that it is seen as more of "a threat" .. so it is deemed "false".

Almighty God knows why we say what we say, and do what we do.
He will judge between us all on the day of judgment.

I don't see it exactly like this. The message of the Quran goes parallel with Christian teachings up to the point that Jesus was born from His Word by the virgin Mary, that he is His Messanger, the Messiah, and that he will return before the end of time, just discarding the idea that he is God or that God has fathered him physically. I read the same from the Gospel accounts.
And it re-established some rulings from the old testament, which have not been denied by Jesus anyway.

 

[TheLightWithin]

It seems that there is no Christian denomination that excepts the Quran, and no Islamic denomination that accepts the Bible.

There are no mainstream Christian or Islamic sects that accept Bahai or Mormon writings either...or what Rasti's or Santeria's have written (Abrahamic faiths that perceive themselves to be continuing the Abrahamic traditions)
[I'm less sure about whether Santeria overtly considers itself Abrahamic I'd have to look that up)

 

[TheLightWithin]

Who does not look much like Jesus

To be fair, we don't know what Jesus looked like

 

[RJM]

To be fair, we don't know what Jesus looked like

Caravaggio quite knew what he was doing. Jesus was always portrayed differently, with a beard, and so on. The whole point is that the disciples walked with the resurrected Christ on the road to Emmaus and listened to him without recognizing him, and finally invited the stranger to their home for supper -- only recognizing him as the Christ when he chose to reveal himself at the blessing and breaking of the bread

 

[wil]

To be fair, we don't know what Jesus looked like

Odds are high he was not a blue eyed white guy with flowing sandy blond locks. (Well heehhee....they mighta been locks/dreads)

 

[muhammad_isa]

To be fair, we don't know what Jesus looked like

..some people claim that he was black

 

[Faithfulservant]

I don't care what He looks like.. He certainly doesn't care what I look like.

 

[Faithfulservant]

Well I just learned something. God didn't choose the Jews. The Jews chose God. God took the Torah to all the nations of the world and offered it to them and they asked what's inside.. God too the the Torah to the Jews and they didn't ask what's inside they said they would teach it to the elders and God said that wasn't enough so they said they would teach it to the men and women and God said that still wasn't enough so they said they would teach it to their children and God gave it to them.

They don't refer to themselves as God's chosen people.. that's a Christian thing.

Shavuot/ Shavuos marks the renewal of their commitment and dedication to God. It is this national decision (often referred to as a “marriage” between God and the Israelites) that created the Jewish people.

I will quit referring to them as God's chosen people. I will refer to them as the people who chose God

 

[wil]

@Faithfulservant citation? Is that in this thread? Or from where? My Jewish friends have often referred to themselves as chosen...

“For you [Israel] are a people holy to the Lord your God. The Lord your God has chosen you out of all the peoples on the face of the earth to be his people, his treasured possession” (Deuteronomy 7:6)

 

[Faithfulservant]

@Faithfulservant citation? Is that in this thread? Or from where? My Jewish friends have often referred to themselves as chosen...

“For you [Israel] are a people holy to the Lord your God. The Lord your God has chosen you out of all the peoples on the face of the earth to be his people, his treasured possession” (Deuteronomy 7:6)

I follow an Orthodox Jewish Woman who posts about her life and answers questions that people ask. She has helped me a lot in learning about Orthodox Jewish women.

Maybe @RabbiO would answer you if you asked which is true. I didn't make a very good first impression with him and he doesn't like me very much I'm trying though.

Miriam Ezagui (@miriamezagui).mp4 | By Miriam Ezagui Marri | Facebook

7.7K views, 331 likes, 92 loves, 53 comments, 15 shares, Facebook Watch Videos from Miriam Ezagui Marri:

fb.watch

 

[wil]

Blasted her statement out to a plethora of Jewish friends. Got responses back from half a dozen of the chosen already who all basically say "What?" No response yet from ultra ortha friends...the reformed and conservatives all act confused.

Got one orthodox response so far...

"I have heard what she is saying but it sounds apologetic to the text, to right the discomfort of the chosenness. We are definitely uncomf with that. And by “we” I mean modern Jews who socialize with non Jews regularly. Not like ultra Orthodox Jews. They prob don’t mind it"

Many express embarrassment in their lives, cringed when their parents repeated they are "the chosen" amongst their non-Jewish friends.

So far does not look like conventional thinking @RabbiO ?

 

[TheLightWithin]

@Faithfulservant citation? Is that in this thread? Or from where? My Jewish friends have often referred to themselves as chosen...

“For you [Israel] are a people holy to the Lord your God. The Lord your God has chosen you out of all the peoples on the face of the earth to be his people, his treasured possession” (Deuteronomy 7:6)

I have heard that framing of the story though, that God "shopped the Torah around" (that was the phrasing) and then the Jewish people were the ones who accepted it.

 

[wil]

I have heard that framing of the story though, that God "shopped the Torah around" (that was the phrasing) and then the Jewish people were the ones who accepted it.

From the mishna?

 

[TheLightWithin]

From the mishna?

Perhaps? I remembering listening to a radio program talking about it while washing dishes at my old apartment.
It also could have been from one of my Great Courses series.
But I recall washing dishes in my old kitchen listening to that story.

 

[talib-al-kalim]

This is related to the assumption of pre-existance. The Jewish Encyclopedia traces this back to Zostrian tradition (link).

From the mishna?

I found similar in the Book of Jubilees (Hasmonean period writing). Have to look it up

We can follow a discussion on how voluntarily Bani Israel accepted the Torah, see Gemara Shabbat88a.

Seems to be a late teaching, and not commonly agreed among Jewish scholars.

 

[Faithfulservant]

Blasted her statement out to a plethora of Jewish friends. Got responses back from half a dozen of the chosen already who all basically say "What?" No response yet from ultra ortha friends...the reformed and conservatives all act confused.

Got one orthodox response so far...

"I have heard what she is saying but it sounds apologetic to the text, to right the discomfort of the chosenness. We are definitely uncomf with that. And by “we” I mean modern Jews who socialize with non Jews regularly. Not like ultra Orthodox Jews. They prob don’t mind it"

Many express embarrassment in their lives, cringed when their parents repeated they are "the chosen" amongst their non-Jewish friends.

So far does not look like conventional thinking @RabbiO ?

You are so lucky to have such a range of people to get input from. I wish we had that here. I'm sending psychic messages to @dauer to return.

 

[wil]

You are so lucky to have such a range of people to get input from. I wish we had that here. I'm sending psychic messages to @dauer to return.

I posted the video and added s thread in the Jewish forum to discuss.

My church did an interfaith thing every year before ibeven found this place. Every week leading upto our annual event we had a leader from the various religions come to speak..an hour presentation and an hour of q&a afterword. Additionally I would volunteer to drive them (made it easier for a person to say "Yes, I will come talk to your congregation" when you offer them dinner a chauffeured ride to and fro) that half hour or more commute gave me even more time to listen and learn.

That and like you searching in my youth and twenties I attended all variety of Christian denominations and many other conventional and not so conventional religions...it opened a lot of doors to various thought.