be gone the standing empty cross

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Luke 4:8



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8 Jesus replied to him, “It is written: ‘You shall worship the LORD your God and serve Him only.’” what's the rule when capitalised letters are used when spelling lord ?
 
locust said:

John 4:24​

God is a Spirit, and those worshipping him must worship with spirit and truth.”

John 4:23​

Nevertheless, the hour is coming, and it is now, when the true worshippers will worship the Father with spirit and truth, for indeed, the Father is looking for ones like these to worship him.
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Yes because we are Spirit housed in bodies of flesh. We wrestle with our flesh.

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Romans 8:3-4

New King James Version

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3 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, 4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

The Father is Spirit.. Jesus was a man but also God worthy of worship

Matthew 14:33 And those in the boat worshiped him, saying, "Truly you are the Son of God."

Matthew 28:9And behold, Jesus met them and said, "Greetings!" And they came up and took hold of his feet and worshiped him.

John 20:28 Thomas answered him, "My Lord and my God!"

Matthew 2:11 And going into the house, they saw the child with Mary his mother, and they fell down and worshiped him. Then, opening their treasures, they offered him gifts, gold and frankincense and myrrh.
 
Faithfulservant said:
Yes because we are Spirit housed in bodies of flesh. We wrestle with our flesh.

.

Romans 8:3-4​

​

New King James Version​

​

​

3 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh, 4 that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us who do not walk according to the flesh but according to the Spirit.

The Father is Spirit.. Jesus was a man but also God worthy of worship

Matthew 14:33 And those in the boat worshiped him, saying, "Truly you are the Son of God."

Matthew 28:9And behold, Jesus met them and said, "Greetings!" And they came up and took hold of his feet and worshiped him.

John 20:28 Thomas answered him, "My Lord and my God!"

Matthew 2:11 And going into the house, they saw the child with Mary his mother, and they fell down and worshiped him. Then, opening their treasures, they offered him gifts, gold and frankincense and myrrh.
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its speaking about an act of Obeisance . a gesture or attitude that shows respect or submission, or acknowledgment of another's importance or superiority: its a stretch to call it worship
 
muhammad_isa said:
..but not established by Jesus, or endorsed by Jesus.
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I disagree ... Mark 8:34 "Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me."
The same sentiment is repeated at Mark 10:21, and echoed in Matthew 10:38 and 16:24, and again Luke 9:23 and 14:27.

Paul mentions the cross 10 times, the author of Hebrews once – both realising the significance of the Cross in the works of redemption.

muhammad_isa said:
Of course, that has little to do with the OP i.e. cross or pole ;)
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Quite.
 
locust said:
sound as if its idealized ...
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Really? And you think the JW fixation with the narrow literal reading of stauros – in the face of ample evidence to the contrary – doesn't?
 
locust said:
its speaking about an act of Obeisance . a gesture or attitude that shows respect or submission, or acknowledgment of another's importance or superiority: its a stretch to call it worship
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Lol what is worship to you? Because that sounds like worship to me.
 
Thomas said:
I disagree ... Mark 8:34 "Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me."
The same sentiment is repeated at Mark 10:21, and echoed in Matthew 10:38 and 16:24, and again Luke 9:23 and 14:27.
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Umm .. when was Jesus reported to have said this .. before or after he was sentenced to death?

I don't see the relevance, personally .. it's a figure of speech, that the Gospel writers employed..
..it does not refer to his being hung on a cross.
 
Thomas said:
I disagree ... Mark 8:34 "Whosoever will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me."
The same sentiment is repeated at Mark 10:21, and echoed in Matthew 10:38 and 16:24, and again Luke 9:23 and 14:27.

Paul mentions the cross 10 times, the author of Hebrews once – both realising the significance of the Cross in the works of redemption.


Quite.
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its very likely that the ones Jesus was talking to those that have seen different ones being led off to execution .being treated poorly .
it was all ready explained to you what the stake of torture would look like when being carried . the cross-member would be used to aid in the standing and the removal to lay it down .























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locust said:
it was all ready explained to you what the stake of torture would look like when being carried . the cross-member would be used to aid in the standing and the removal to lay it down .
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By you? I think you're wrong ... so if you can provide any reference at all from antiquity, rather than some irrelevant anecdotal reference to you putting posts in holes ...

I once raised a circus bigtop king pole with five or six others ... we used a Ford van to raise it. Way bigger and heavier than a cross.
 
Thomas said:
By you? I think you're wrong ... so if you can provide any reference at all from antiquity, rather than some irrelevant anecdotal reference to you putting posts in holes ...

I once raised a circus bigtop king pole with five or six others ... we used a Ford van to raise it. Way bigger and heavier than a cross.
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I built pole barns and decks . most of them poles were also heavier than a cross. had a skytrack but standing poles by hand was faster
 
Thomas said:
By you? I think you're wrong ... so if you can provide any reference at all from antiquity, rather than some irrelevant anecdotal reference to you putting posts in holes ...

I once raised a circus bigtop king pole with five or six others ... we used a Ford van to raise it. Way bigger and heavier than a cross.
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did you also take the pole down ?
 
locust said:
an act of Obeisance would be caritised as a quick bow to someone's superior
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Ohh you're an expert on Hebrew and Greek? The definition you used was for Hebrew worship of God the actual Greek word was a dog licking their masters hand. And who would you consider as superior? Anyone? You didn't answer my question.. what do you consider worship?
 
Additionally the word used for worship is the same word in all the text.. so you can't differentiate one verse to the other... They all have the same definition. That means the word used for worship God in Spirit and truth is the same used for the ones in when Jesus was worshipped.
 
Faithfulservant said:
Ohh you're an expert on Hebrew and Greek? The definition you used was for Hebrew worship of God the actual Greek word was a dog licking their masters hand. And who would you consider as superior? Anyone? You didn't answer my question.. what do you consider worship?
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Hebrew sha·hhahʹ and the Greek pro·sky·neʹo
Faithfulservant said:
They probably just let it drop.. do you honestly think they were worried about the victims getting hurt by taking it down carefully?
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maybe you missed it but it was addressed to Thomas
 
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