No proselytizing! Is it possible?

Awaiting_the_fifth

Awaiting_the_fifth

Where is my mind?
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Something that I have been thinking about since I first found this forum.

The rules here state that proselytizing is not acceptable and, I believe, in some cases has been punishable by a complete ban.

But so often, on any given thread, we all have our own point of view which is usually heavily influenced if not dictated by our own particular faith. When we put foreward our views and opinions, we invariably believe them to be true and use them to sway discussion. At what point does this become proselytizing? Is it in fact possible to argue any belief without some measure of proselytization?

Not trying to be contravertial, just thinking in text.

Peace
ATF
 
Kindest Regards, Awaiting!

Your point is a good one. Speaking as a contributor and participant (not officially), there is a fine line. I think the difference is when someone belittles another for their belief, disregarding, dismissing and even disrespectfully criticizing another's belief. This is plainly evident when the conversation degrades into condescension and personal attacks.

The flip side is that it is only natural for a person to defend their beliefs and views. That makes for conversation, and allows for understanding and learning how others view the world and faith walk, when it is done respectfully. I have said before, tolerance is not acceptance. I do not have to agree. We can agree to disagree and still be friends. I can tolerate a view I disagree with by treating another with respect and courtesy, opening my mind and outlook to understand that others may not see the world, including faith, in quite the same way I do.

We can support each other as brothers and sisters, or we can attack each other as enemies and "unenlightened." This is where I see the difference.

I can share my view, and I suppose that might be considered by some as proselytising. Yet if I allow others to present their views, then they are allowed "equal opportunity" to proselytize in return. At least in this sense, it is balanced proselytising.

Even then, I do not think this is quite correct, in that I am not "recruiting" others to my view. I openly encourage disagreement in my discussions. The only thing I ask is respectful dialogue, and careful consideration (meaning thinking through what one has to say).

My two cents, for what it is worth. :D
 
I think it is very possible to discuss religion without proselytizing, even when one is describing or defending their own beliefs. I think the word Juan chose is a good one: recruiting. Is the intention to win others to your belief system.

There are many members here from whom I've learned a great deal and never felt they were proselytizing. Take yourself for example, Awaiting. You give your view of Buddhism, what you think is great about it, even your views against aspects of other religions, yet I never feel that you are specifically trying to disuade me from my beliefs to yours.

Sometimes folks show up and the proselytizing is easy to spot. They feel they've got a pulpit and start lecturing, or even shouting, rather than talking. Other times, and this is probably a more subjective call, the proselytizing is more subtle and becomes more evident over a series of interactions. In these cases the thing that I think makes the intent of the poster stick out is a lack of one's personal views or experiences being shared, things seem to be coming out "by the book," and there is an emphasis on what others are doing or not doing, believing or not believing, or a chronic insinuation that others are wrong. This is just my opinion; I don't call the shots on whether a member is proselytizing or not, but I would share my opinion with the other mods when asked.

A final thought. I think one of the things that makes CR great, and different from any other religion discussion forum I've seen, is the civility and balance that is achieved. There is room for debate, even a bit heated at times, but all in all it is most conducive to true interfaith dialogue. I think members that come in and end up hanging around are those that are good at, or learn how to have, respectful interfaith discussions. I was just musing lately that CR actually does something other than provide a place to learn about other religions, it is a real training ground for those interested in improving their skill in interfaith dialogue.

2 c,
lunamoth
 
I regard this place as a dialogue forum - so different beliefs are invited.

The problem is when someone joins with no intention of dialogue - of simply using CR as a soapbox to attack other people's beliefs and promote their own.

As you say, there are grey areas here - and such instances have to be handled on an individual basis - but most people who come to CR on a mission to proselytise are easy to spot and dealt with quickly.

It may sound odd, but I think of CR as more like inviting people for a cup of tea at home. So long as we can sit down and be civil as a group, then it's working. When it doesn't seem to be working, I need to look at where the problem is and see if it can politely corrected. I guess that's the group dynamic I work towards.

It's always a learning process, though, and I have made decisions I've regretted - being too lenient sometimes, too heavy other times. Even trying to find a balance requires finding a balance in itself. :)
 
juantoo3 said:
Kindest Regards, Awaiting!

Your point is a good one. Speaking as a contributor and participant (not officially), there is a fine line. I think the difference is when someone belittles another for their belief, disregarding, dismissing and even disrespectfully criticizing another's belief. This is plainly evident when the conversation degrades into condescension and personal attacks.
Click to expand...

I think the difference is not the above; at least not the difference between proselytizing and not.

The difference, I think, lies in how we express our beliefs. For example, "I believe" rather than "this is so"; "my view is" rather than "the TRUTH is", and so on.

I've been on a few other BBSs, and on Religion and Spirituality boards especially. The oddest thing is that they tend to fizzle away without the conflict between those who proselytize and those who defend against it. I'm very much hoping that here I'll find a place where people ask questions and share insights, without conversion attempts.

And without degenerating into accusations of idiocy and blindness between religious fundamentalists and atheists.
 
Oh, agreed - if I opened the boundaries here a lot more we would have more members, more posts, and the activity of the overall forums would increase dramatically.

Been there, done that, and ended up helping on a board that only the most aggressive people cared to visit.

The approach here is quality over quantity - by trying to protect the interests of a wide diversity of interest groups, it encourages them to visit, and difference of opinion between these allows a continued strong dynamic to keep pushing the development of the forums.

For example, check this thread out:
http://www.comparative-religion.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4772

You won't easily get that level of discussion about the intricacies of Jewish faith on a free-for-all forum - and there are certainly not many places with as diverse a range of members where it can happen.

That's how CR works - yes, the pace is slower, yes, we're not growing as fast as some other boards. But by steering the forums with key anchors of respect and civility (for the most part), we have a stronger identity - and in my opinion that's why a string of universities and colleges link to CR rather than other interfaith forums.

2c. :)
 
I'm very much hoping that here I'll find a place where people ask questions and share insights, without conversion attempts.

And without degenerating into accusations of idiocy and blindness between religious fundamentalists and atheists.
Click to expand...
those are my thotz as well.

peace
 
Käthe said:
I think the difference is not the above; at least not the difference between proselytizing and not.

The difference, I think, lies in how we express our beliefs. For example, "I believe" rather than "this is so"; "my view is" rather than "the TRUTH is", and so on.

I've been on a few other BBSs, and on Religion and Spirituality boards especially. The oddest thing is that they tend to fizzle away without the conflict between those who proselytize and those who defend against it. I'm very much hoping that here I'll find a place where people ask questions and share insights, without conversion attempts.

And without degenerating into accusations of idiocy and blindness between religious fundamentalists and atheists.
Click to expand...

Hi Kathe! What do you think of this board? It has a lot of nice features and the atmosphere seems pleasant. Nice to see you!:)

Chris
 
Chris,

So *that* is your screen name here! I was wondering how I'd find ya! *hug*

So far, great, although i spent most of today away from home and have't spent much time looking around.
 
Can any kind person here tell this newbie how to cut and paste text from a Word file into the "Reply" box? I tried to that earlier; after I had the text in my clipboard, I right-clicked while I was in the Reply box, but didn't get the "Paste" option.
 
i've don't know exactly why right-click-paste is not an option for you. perhaps it's a scripting thing within microsoft software or within vBulletin? however; i think you should still be able to use your keyboard (to paste) once something is copied to your windows-clipboard.

have you tried using CTRL+V to paste into the reply box here?
 
*blink*

If you tell the truth, you don't have to remember anything.

Hey, it worked!!!!!!! Thank you! I just pasted that in. :)
 
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