question for Christian Theology

I don't think my experience was related either to the aesthetics of the church nor it's age. It was a relatively new church and not one I found particularly beautiful, although I grew fond of it after attending there for a while. Actually, I think I could have had my experience in nature or anywhere, although I think that being in that church on my knees happened because I too had hit a kind of spiritual bottom where I had to give up depending upon myself...

luna
 
lunamoth said:
I don't think my experience was related either to the aesthetics of the church nor it's age. It was a relatively new church and not one I found particularly beautiful, although I grew fond of it after attending there for a while. Actually, I think I could have had my experience in nature or anywhere, although I think that being in that church on my knees happened because I too had hit a kind of spiritual bottom where I had to give up depending upon myself...

luna
Click to expand...

Sorry, I knew I should have been more clear. I meant the "energy" left behind in some places as opposed to others.

And there are places that are "holy ground", There is a place here in Maryland near Emmitsburg, and over in the Olympic ranges of Washington state, but there are many others that are small, or not known but for a few. But the effect is the same. It is where the veil between heaven and earth is thinnest, and often parts for a moment or two. :eek:

v/r

Q
 
Quahom1 said:
Sorry, I knew I should have been more clear. I meant the "energy" left behind in some places as opposed to others.

And there are places that are "holy ground", There is a place here in Maryland near Emmitsburg, and over in the Olympic ranges of Washington state, but there are many others that are small, or not known but for a few. But the effect is the same. It is where the veil between heaven and earth is thinnest, and often parts for a moment or two. :eek:

v/r

Q
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Oh I think you are right about that Q. There are definitely places that can only be called holy ground. And I like the way you phrased that, about the veil...very nice. :)

luna
 
WARNING: Sacred Feelings Analyzed Here.

Q, just figured I should issue the warning since you said you don't want to analyze the feeling.

I think that there must be some natural resonance with the individual's inner symbology or memory in order for a place to feel/be holy. The cathedral Q described, or the one in Thomas's picture (see link above), cannot do it for me. It has to be the white frame church with clapboard siding and raw pine floors and pews to do it for me. Dark full-body length garb on men and women and the PA German language with acapella singing. It helps if there is a scent of damp woollen shawls or the sound of horse harness clinking through an open window. This is describing the church of my childhood before the troubles began.

But nothing does it quite like nature. And all it takes is the open blue sky. I know that in either case, it is something that has to be nurtured. I found that the running water of a river or creek soothes my soul. But when I moved to a place far from any running water or other nature resorts, I took to the blue sky above. Nothing can ever take me away from the sky. Sometimes it's blue and other times it's covered with clouds or hidden by fog. No matter; all cases can sooth the soul if the soul is trained for this. Probably there has to be considerable natural proclivity for it to work.
 
I, too, appreciate the power of Sacred Place(s) ... especially the mountains, which are to me, natural sanctuary. The energy of various places, both manmade/humanly-energized, as well as natural, has often impressed me, sometimes deeply. So also, does the following passage:
"And Jesus saith unto him, The foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests; but the Son of man hath not where to lay his head." (Matthew 8:20)
​
And remember the verse to which this reply of Jesus came:
"And a certain scribe came, and said unto him, Master, I will follow thee whithersoever thou goest." (Matthew 8:19)
​
Love and Light,

taijasi
 
RubySera_Martin said:
WARNING: Sacred Feelings Analyzed Here.

Q, just figured I should issue the warning since you said you don't want to analyze the feeling.

I think that there must be some natural resonance with the individual's inner symbology or memory in order for a place to feel/be holy. The cathedral Q described, or the one in Thomas's picture (see link above), cannot do it for me. It has to be the white frame church with clapboard siding and raw pine floors and pews to do it for me. Dark full-body length garb on men and women and the PA German language with acapella singing. It helps if there is a scent of damp woollen shawls or the sound of horse harness clinking through an open window. This is describing the church of my childhood before the troubles began.

But nothing does it quite like nature. And all it takes is the open blue sky. I know that in either case, it is something that has to be nurtured. I found that the running water of a river or creek soothes my soul. But when I moved to a place far from any running water or other nature resorts, I took to the blue sky above. Nothing can ever take me away from the sky. Sometimes it's blue and other times it's covered with clouds or hidden by fog. No matter; all cases can sooth the soul if the soul is trained for this. Probably there has to be considerable natural proclivity for it to work.
Click to expand...

Good point (and my poor choice of words). Sense, not feeling. But feeling does come eventually...

Thanks for catching me.

v/r

Q
 
Monument Valley at the Colorado/Arizona border in the Dineh Nation...the buttes you remember from old westerns and Marlboro commercials...that place is huge and amazing. Driving in I was in awe, and everytime I got out of my car the feeling was incredible.

Yes I think it is a combination of sensitivity, associated memory, residual energy, a thinness of the viel, or maybe it isn't the place at all, the place puts us in a place...close your eyes...go to that place in your mind, view it from a distance, walk up and into the door, sit, look, smell, listen, touch...take time with your all your being...and see if you can bring that place, a piece of that feeling alive now...

If you can just minutely...imagine what practice and patience can do...the joy of knowing that 'that place', 'that feeling', the connection is available anywhere, anytime...
 
Hello,
A big thanks to all who responded.

Again thanks to everyone who shared their intelect, insight, and other useful information.

Looks like I have a million miles to go for that greater understanding I so desperately want...

A favorite expression:

"Mt. Everest looks, and seems insurmountable at the bottom. But with one step at a time the summit can be reached, or achieved."

If any one else has a great book they would like to mention, or Biblical scripture that points the way.. feel free to share that also. Hopefully others have been enlightened by this thread as much as I have.

Thanks,
T.S.
 
Truth Seeker said:
Hello,
A big thanks to all who responded.

Again thanks to everyone who shared their intelect, insight, and other useful information.

Looks like I have a million miles to go for that greater understanding I so desperately want...

A favorite expression:

"Mt. Everest looks, and seems insurmountable at the bottom. But with one step at a time the summit can be reached, or achieved."
Click to expand...

Yep, all it takes is one step at a time. Start taking those steps and you will be amazed at where it takes you.
 
Quahom1 said:
Sorry, I knew I should have been more clear. I meant the "energy" left behind in some places as opposed to others.

And there are places that are "holy ground", There is a place here in Maryland near Emmitsburg, and over in the Olympic ranges of Washington state, but there are many others that are small, or not known but for a few. But the effect is the same. It is where the veil between heaven and earth is thinnest, and often parts for a moment or two. :eek:

v/r

Q
Click to expand...

Whereabouts in Emmittsburg, Q?

Speaking of which, I used to be a counselor at a camp called Summit Lake Camp, not far from Emmittsburg and I can tell you that place was a spiritual haven for me. I remember mornings I would be sitting out on the cabin poarch and look out across the lake and the protuding mountain rising to meet the blue clouded sky and wonder at the awe of God's creation. Just the atmosphere of being with other Christians and campers and all the relationsips and activities I experienced there. I had a sense of belonging there (a stark contrast to the empty partying that I engage in with my secular friends back at home). The best part of it all were the nightly services in the Tabernacle where we sang songs like Noah's Ark, I've got the joy, joy, joy, joy down in my heart (Where?), coupled with later softer songs like Pass It On. Then we would hear a message for a visiting evangelist, geared to preach salvation to the campers who didn't know the Lord. Just the whole camp experience was the truly best time I ever had in my youth.
 
Dondi said:
Whereabouts in Emmittsburg, Q?

Speaking of which, I used to be a counselor at a camp called Summit Lake Camp, not far from Emmittsburg and I can tell you that place was a spiritual haven for me. I remember mornings I would be sitting out on the cabin poarch and look out across the lake and the protuding mountain rising to meet the blue clouded sky and wonder at the awe of God's creation. Just the atmosphere of being with other Christians and campers and all the relationsips and activities I experienced there. I had a sense of belonging there (a stark contrast to the empty partying that I engage in with my secular friends back at home). The best part of it all were the nightly services in the Tabernacle where we sang songs like Noah's Ark, I've got the joy, joy, joy, joy down in my heart (Where?), coupled with later softer songs like Pass It On. Then we would hear a message for a visiting evangelist, geared to preach salvation to the campers who didn't know the Lord. Just the whole camp experience was the truly best time I ever had in my youth.
Click to expand...

Also the Grotto of Our Lady of Lourdes behind St. Mary's University...;)
 
Truth Seeker said:
Hello,
Folowing the Truth wherever it may lead:)
Click to expand...
Then ,to me , you should study Quran wherein all the truthful teachings of all the Revealed Religions , be it Old Testament or New Testament or for that matter any other Revealed Religion, are included,secured and protected.The Claim and Argument in this regard from Quran,some verses, is as follows.
Chapter 98
Al-Bayyinah
[98:1] “In the name of Allah, the Gracious, the Merciful [98:2] Those, who disbelieve from among the People of the Book and the idolaters, would not desist from disbelief until there should come to them the clear evidence - [98:3] A Messenger from Allah, reciting unto them the pure Scriptures, 98:4] Wherein are lasting commandments. [98:5] And those to whom the Book was given did not become divided until after clear evidence had come to them. [98:6] And they were not commanded but to serve Allah, being sincere to Him in obedience, and being upright, and to observe Prayer and pay the Zakat. And that is the right religion.”
Chapter 15
Al-Hijr [15:7]” And they said, 'O thou to whom this exhortation has been sent down, thou art surely a madman, [15:8] 'Why dost thou not bring angels to us, if thou art of the truthful?' [15:9] We do not send down angels but with the requirements of justice, and when We do send them, the disbelievers are not respited. 15:10] Verily, it is We Who have sent down this Exhortation, and most surely We are its Guardians.”
Well that is me , others may have their own opinions.
Thanks
 
inhumility said:
Then ,to me , you should study Quran wherein all the truthful teachings of all the Revealed Religions , be it Old Testament or New Testament or for that matter any other Revealed Religion, are included,secured and protected.The Claim and Argument in this regard from Quran,some verses, is as follows.
Chapter 98
Al-Bayyinah
[98:1] “In the name of Allah, the Gracious, the Merciful [98:2] Those, who disbelieve from among the People of the Book and the idolaters, would not desist from disbelief until there should come to them the clear evidence - [98:3] A Messenger from Allah, reciting unto them the pure Scriptures, 98:4] Wherein are lasting commandments. [98:5] And those to whom the Book was given did not become divided until after clear evidence had come to them. [98:6] And they were not commanded but to serve Allah, being sincere to Him in obedience, and being upright, and to observe Prayer and pay the Zakat. And that is the right religion.”
Chapter 15
Al-Hijr [15:7]” And they said, 'O thou to whom this exhortation has been sent down, thou art surely a madman, [15:8] 'Why dost thou not bring angels to us, if thou art of the truthful?' [15:9] We do not send down angels but with the requirements of justice, and when We do send them, the disbelievers are not respited. 15:10] Verily, it is We Who have sent down this Exhortation, and most surely We are its Guardians.”
Well that is me , others may have their own opinions.
Thanks
Click to expand...

The same could be said of the Bible and the Pentatuch...No one has all the answers. ;)

v/r

Q
 
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