What is Objective Truth

China Cat Sunflower said:
That is my five year old on her first birthday. See all the cake in her grubby fist?

My kids are cuter than any one else's. That's another relative truth!:)

Chris
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What is sweeter than a one-year-old covered with cake? For some years when I was in my teens and twenties I worked in the homes of many different families with kids aged infant to teen. One of the sweetest sights I witnessed was a mother hugging a cake-covered one-year-old who at that specific instant needed to kiss Mummy. And I know all about this kind of relative truth. I am the oldest of eleven children. There was a baby in the family most of my growing-up years. Taking care of the baby was part of my growing-up experience. At one point I observed to Mom that our baby was cuter than anyone else's. Mom agreed, but said I should not voice that opinion to others because they think their baby is the cutest. I never forgot that piece of wisdom.
 
lunamoth said:
I think there is a unified process behind everything and I believe it is love. I almost didn't write this because I know is sounds trite, and I know there's a lot of suffering and evil in the world and so saying Love seems disingenious or something. But, I decided to go for it anyway and put myself out there.

luna
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I'm not exactly sure what love, in the largest sense, is. I think you're on to something though, and maybe that's why we have such an emotional connection with beauty. You can beat me and I won't cry, but I'll easily get all misty over something beautiful, especially if there's a connection with what seems universally good and right. Maybe that's another way to look at truth in the terms you described?

Chris
 
lunamoth said:
I think there is a unified process behind everything and I believe it is love. I almost didn't write this because I know is sounds trite, and I know there's a lot of suffering and evil in the world and so saying Love seems disingenious or something. But, I decided to go for it anyway and put myself out there.

luna
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I've heard this from quite a few people. I just don't get it. The thing that makes most sense to me is that God created it all in some form or another. Maybe that is just a fancy way of saying the source or origin of the universe is not a top priority with me. But like anyone raised inside Christianity I can't pretend not to have given much thought to the matter. I've come across the idea that some religions just don't ask that question. It seems to be a Western obsession. I think it was Aquinas who suggested the world might be eternal. I was shocked to read that of a Christian. I guess that shows that the focus of recent centuries has not necessarily been the focus of Christianity since its inception. And then there is the chance that I misunderstood Thomas Aquinas. I trust our resident Thomas will correct me if I misquoted the man from whom he (I presume) takes his name.
 
More relative truth ('course I think this is objective too). My kids are adorable. Lucky for them they can't take after me...:D
 
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China Cat Sunflower said:
I'm not exactly sure what love, in the largest sense, is. I think you're on to something though, and maybe that's why we have such an emotional connection with beauty. You can beat me and I won't cry, but I'll easily get all misty over something beautiful, especially if there's a connection with what seems universally good and right. Maybe that's another way to look at truth in the terms you described?

Chris
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Chris, and Ruby, I can't really defend this point, and I'm not even sure how much of it is based upon faith, how much on reason. I do choose this as my worldview though, and fit things in from there. I've never formally studied philosophy, and even my Christianity knowledge is by the seat of my pants. I put all my formal education into the field of science, which you would think would include a grounding in philosophy, or at least logic (I actually think I have a pretty good natural skill in logic, but I'm typically lazy), but actually it is very...pragmatic. I get frustrated with discussing how many angels dance on the head of a pin rather quickly. Especially when you spend all kinds of time trying to understand what a person is saying, only to find at the bottom of it all an assumption, or a whole bunch of assumptions. Give me the material universe and scientific method any day.

luna
 
RubySera_Martin said:
Luna, what adorable little girls! Why can't they take after you? Are they adopted?
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Thank you. :) Yes, they are adopted. The older one is just six and the younger is 3.5.
 
China Cat Sunflower said:
Wow, those are cute kids! Almost as cute as mine!

Chris
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Your kids are cute. I remember the picture in the thread in the lounge (or was it introductions?). Anyway, somewhere around here. And about the same ages as mine.
 
This was her first dance recital a few weeks ago. Now you tell me this isn't just the cutest!

miniballlerina.JPG

Chris
 
China Cat Sunflower said:
This was her first dance recital a few weeks ago. Now you tell me this isn't just the cutest!

View attachment 252

Chris
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She's beautiful! If I did not have two equally cute but actually ever so slightly cuter because they are mine girls I would be able to objectively and truthfully say she is the cutest.

But yes, she is pretty darn cute.

luna
 
China Cat Sunflower said:
hey Luna,

Tiger Woods missed the cut at the open. Wow!

Chris
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Really!? Unbelievable!

I have not been watching at all. My hub called last night to say that he was stocking hats for 15 hours straight in a big hot merchandise tent and did not see any golf yet. He may have gotten out today, but I have not heard from him yet.

Anyway, that is a suprise about Tiger. My daughter is going to be so disappointed--she loves to watch him play and root for him.

luna
 
Neither having children, nor enjoying golf, I guess I'll have to write about something else.:)

I don't think anyone yet has given an example of objective truth, I'm not sure if any exist. Some have spoken of geography, that we know where a place is by longitude and latitude, but this is not constant, plate tectonics, landslides, mudflows...
it also must be said that there are those who would not mark out land through logitude and latitude.
juantoo speaks of good topsoil that he can feel in his hand, a couple of things here. what's good for the goose isn't always good for the gander, I'm no gardener, or farmer but don't different plants require different soils?
Also good topsoil will not necessarily remain good topsoil.

How can we know that we know what we believe that we know?
 
Short, sweet, and to the point: objective truth is impartial, and free from personal prejudices. If a tree falls in the forest, and no one is there to hear it, does it make a sound? If you answer "yes," that would be an expression of the belief in objective truth. If you answer "no," that would be an expression of the belief that truth is subjective, relative, and personal. JMHO. :)
 
Namaste all,

hmm.. my view?

as near as i can discern, an "objective truth" is that which allows another being to proclaim their view as "correct" and "the truth" whislt denying that same ability to another.

further, it seems to be a bit of human hubris to hold the view that our current levels of consciousnes would enable a human to ascertain "objective truth". that, of course, doesn't seem to stop us human types from this sort of endeavor though :)

i'll read the rest of the thread now.

metta,

~v
 
Vajradhara said:
further, it seems to be a bit of human hubris to hold the view that our current levels of consciousnes would enable a human to ascertain "objective truth".
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yassss
 
Hey Cav !

Love your new avatar ! And to think he started out as one of Muhammed Ali's bodyguards on the great south side of Chicago ! Is America a great country or what ?

flow....:D
 
flowperson said:
Love your new avatar !
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Thanks, I wanted something that really summed up who I am, and where I am on my spiritual journey. I think Mr.T does that.
 
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