protestant vs catholic?
- Thread starter Zaakir
- Start date
path_of_one
Embracing the Mystery
The Catholic Bible has some books in it that are not included in the Protestant Bible, but not much. Otherwise, the two are the same as far as I can tell.
There are quite a few differences in terms of beliefs and especially understandings of authority. There are also a lot of differences between Protestant denominations. Quakers, in both beliefs and practices/structure are not much like Episcopalians, etc.
Lots of diversity with the unifying factor being a focus on Christ.
There are quite a few differences in terms of beliefs and especially understandings of authority. There are also a lot of differences between Protestant denominations. Quakers, in both beliefs and practices/structure are not much like Episcopalians, etc.
Lots of diversity with the unifying factor being a focus on Christ.
One of the biggest differences, so far as I understand it, is that in Roman Catholicism the meaning of different passages of the Bible - and hence the theology of Christianity - is decided upon by the authority of the Roman Catholic Church itself.
However, within the Protestant branch, the Roman Catholic Church has no authority over interpretation - leaving the individual to either be an authority within themselves, or else subscribe to the authority of one of the newer Reform churches.
It's difficult to translate into Islamic terms, but if the Caliphate still existed, it could be near on par by analogy with the Roman Catholic Church in terms of spiritual authority in interpreting texts.
However, within the Protestant branch, the Roman Catholic Church has no authority over interpretation - leaving the individual to either be an authority within themselves, or else subscribe to the authority of one of the newer Reform churches.
It's difficult to translate into Islamic terms, but if the Caliphate still existed, it could be near on par by analogy with the Roman Catholic Church in terms of spiritual authority in interpreting texts.
Zaakir said:
This is a good question. I will answer your part about the bibles, as the differences between the actual denominations are more political and more or less in nuances than anything else (but that gets complicated real fast).
When the Christian Bible was being put together (as we see it today), most Christians were using the Greek Septuagint as the Old Testament (circa 100-150 A.D. "C.E.").
At the time of the Reformation (circa 1500 A.D "C.E"), Protestants decided to use the revised official version of the Judeac cannon, which eliminated a dozen or so books that were not part of the original Hebrew scripture. However, the church of Rome continued to use the Septuagint as the old testament. The Protestants' Bible did contain the books pulled from the Septuagint for another 300 years, but put them in a seperate section called "The Apocrypha", but then dropped that section all together (circa 1820). A good example of a Protestant Bible from that 1500 era would be the Luther Bible.
The additional books remaining in the Catholic Old testament are 1st and 2nd Maccabees, Baruch, Tobit, Judith, The Wisdom of Solomon, Sirach, Eshter (addenum), Susanna and Bel and the Dragon (Daniel addenum).
The Greek Orthodox Catholic Old testament have additional books to the Roman Church which include 1st and 2nd Esdras, Prayer of Manasseh, Psalm 151, and 3rd Maccabees.
The Protestant and Catholic and Orthodox New testament however, are identical.
Hope this helps.
v/r
Q
i know there are seven books in the catholic bible..the douay rheims...but why is christianity so wide ranging...what are the 100s of types of bibles and practices...is it right that obviously all but one have been altered?
Zaakir said:
The same reason any other religion is so wide ranging, because the adherents are human, and humans have a tendency to disagree with eachother.
There's not a single religion that hasn't had it's scriptures subject to editing or change. Again, because they are in human hands.
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Dor
Bible Thumper
Zaakir said:
There are differences between a few books that the Catholic's use and the Protestants dont use.
Q gave you a very good list of the books that Catholics and Protestants differ on.
There are numerous different versions of the Bible...some differ cause they are made to be read easily. There are also some that were changed or altered to suit what some of the denominations want followers to believe.
Also as Aburaees stated there is not a single religion that hasnt had its scriptures edited or changed in some form.
Jeannot
Jeannot
Most Protestants, particularly the Evangelicals, believe in the Bible alone as the guide to faith.
Catholics beliieve in the Bible and Tradition, that is, the development of doctrine over the years, even on subjects not specifically found in the Bible.
Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary and to the saints. Most Protestants do not.
Catholics beliieve in the Bible and Tradition, that is, the development of doctrine over the years, even on subjects not specifically found in the Bible.
Catholics pray to the Virgin Mary and to the saints. Most Protestants do not.
paul
recovering sinner
Quahom1 said:
this is not completely true, the roman catholic church don't use the septuagint, the greek orthodox church do.
the roman catholics use the bible translated by jerome, who had the hebrew and septuagint greek before him, but although sometimes using the septuagint where he thought the hebrew in error, he mostly followed the hebrew text, which was considered corrupt by earlier christians.
he did translate the two versions of the psalms though from the hebrew and greek, his translation was into latin, and is known as the latin vulgate, that's the official version roman catholics use today.
also the protestant catholic and orthodox new testaments are not identical, the three do slightly differ.
there is also a syriac translation of both old and new testament, which sometimes agrees with the septuagint and sometimes the hebrew.
there is also the ethiopian bible, which contains more books than even the greek orthodox canon, such as the book of enoch, jubilees, the martyrdom of isaiah, and a few new testament books, all of which were used by early christians.
the ethiopian bible is said to be translated from the septuagint, into geez i think, an old ethiopian language, i've never seen this text to study it.
the septuagint was considered inspired by early christians although being a translation of the original hebrew, there is some story to it, i can't recall it tidy, but it was considered an inspired translation, and also the hebrew version has come to us from jews who didn't beleive in christ, who blasphemed him, and are said to have rejected some portions, and maybe even some were lost after the destruction of the temple.
Zaakir said:
There are Hadiths that contradict your claim... even the Qur'an has been edited.
Would you like to see a few? Then we can return to the topic of the thread title.
The only place the Qur'an has been preserved is on Al-Lawh Al-Mahfooz, and those are in heaven - not on Earth. Everything on Earth is corruptible.
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Jeannot said:
Not quite correct.
Catholics pray to God. They ask for intercession from the Saints. Kind of like asking Mom to go talk to Dad on one's behalf, because one feels Dad is not happy with one...(ok, that is a simpleton answer, but the best analogy I can think of at the moment). And not all Catholics adhere to this "policy". Hey, it's three in the morning! v/r
Q
We'll try and leave the Qur'an to it's own thread.
A key point to remember about the Bible is that it's not writing from a single individual, but instead a compilation of texts from thousands of years comprising a whole theological library.
A key point to remember about the Bible is that it's not writing from a single individual, but instead a compilation of texts from thousands of years comprising a whole theological library.
Zaakir said:
I'm saying there's a hard-copy of the Qur'an in heaven, which is different to what we have on Earth. I'll give you one example from Sahih Muslim;
My personal take is that this is 'editing' and not necessarily 'corruption'.
If you want to discuss this further you can 'pm' me, I don't want to hijack this thread, although you are the thread originator. I'm also reluctant to put this on the Islam board as it can be taken the wrong way.
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juantoo3
....whys guy.... ʎʇıɹoɥʇnɐ uoıʇsǝnb
Perhaps in the Abrahamic board then? as I find this interesting.
you can call it editing, but as you are muslim, you beleive that the Quran is the word of Allah (s.w.t)? well...the ahadith you gave me i have raed, i havent researched into it, nut ata a first thought i would say, hadith we know are written by people and some of them say different things, Allah (s.w.t) may have wanted to change this part of the Quran just as He revealed different parts at different times,,,but the right times. and it has to be noted taht this was done before the prophet Muhammad (s.a.w) died
enton
www.theoldpath.tv
In their words of acceptance alone, they differ. Members of the Roman Catholic church gladly declare of their being "catholics", while members of the Protestant church gladly declare of their being "protestants".Zaakir said:
And is this will always be the case, perhaps I am just correct if I say they are not christians. If they are, why then they prefer to call themselves "Roman Catholic Church, Protestant Church"? And they should be one, if they are christians.
Romans 12:5 So we, being many, are one body in Christ, and every one members one of another.
Ephesians 4:4 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;
Colossians 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
1 Corinthians 11:16 But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.
BUT WE CANNOT READ bodies to mean different churches.
So, the church is just one, though we can read these:
Romans 1:13 Now I would not have you ignorant, brethren, that oftentimes I purposed to come unto you, (but was let hitherto,) that I might have some fruit among you also, even as among other Gentiles.
1 Corinthians 1:2 Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours:
Galatians 1:2 And all the brethren which are with me, unto the churches of Galatia:
Ephesians 1:22 And hath put all things under his feet, and gave him to be the head over all things to the church,
Philippians 1:12 But I would ye should understand, brethren, that the things which happened unto me have fallen out rather unto the furtherance of the gospel;
Colossians 1:2 To the saints and faithful brethren in Christ which are at Colosse: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.
I Thessalonians 1:1 Paul, and Silvanus, and Timotheus, unto the church of the Thessalonians which is in God the Father and in the Lord Jesus Christ: Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and the Lord Jesus Christ.
With I Thessalonians 1:1 alone as basis of the existence of the church which we can read in Matthew 16:18 , we can realize that God owns the church through Christ Jesus.
So, whenever, one desires to be a part of the church of the Romans, Corinthians, Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians and Thessalonians among others, he must first see to it that really in wholeness of the teachings of Christ and the Apostles, the church which he should cleave into is the ground and pillar of the truth, the word of truth (the Gospel of salvation).
Actually there arose many "churches" so-called because of this reason:
Philippians 1:15 Some indeed preach Christ even of envy and strife; and some also of good will:
And you know what shall happen to some who preach of good will;
Romans 12:9 Let love be without dissimulation. Abhor that which is evil; cleave to that which is good.
They will cleave to that which is good. And what is good?
Psalms 133:1 [[A Song of degrees of David.]] Behold, how good and how pleasant it is for brethren to dwell together in unity!
See! brethren, church, one body, one God the Father, one Lord Jesus Christ, one Spirit, one mind, one mouth. (Ephesians 4:4, I Corinthians 6:17 Romans 15:6, I Corinthians 8:6)
But one thing to be sure!
Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world. I John 4:1
So, thee are spirits claiming to be of God, but many of them are not, so try and don't believe instantly because there are spirits carrying:
Matthew 15:9 But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
1 Timothy 4:1 Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils;
Hebrews 13:9 Be not carried about with divers and strange doctrines. For it is a good thing that the heart be established with grace; not with meats, which have not profited them that have been occupied therein.
For what reason(s) they (false churches) teach doctrines the commandments of men?
1. Colossians 2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit, after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.
2. 1 Timothy 6:20 O Timothy, keep that which is committed to thy trust, avoiding profane and vain babblings, and oppositions of science falsely so called:
BACK TO one mouth above, I am interested to open this to you folks!
Luke 21:15 For I will give you a mouth and wisdom, which all your adversaries shall not be able to gainsay nor resist.
Whose mouth could that be where wisdom is?
If you please, I am inviting you all to our online webcast located at see.tv under Channel Index: America - The Old Path TV.