Dondi
Well-Known Member
One pecular OT verse interests me in regard to the concept of the Trinity: Isaiah 49:16:
"Come ye near unto me, hear ye this; I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; from the time that it was, there am I: and now the Lord GOD, and his Spirit, hath sent me."
To get a clearer picture of this, one has to identify the speaker and the subjects of this verse. We can deduce that the "I" refers to a being who has been "from the time that it was" as someone who has been here at the beginning. The context of the entire passage suggests the the speaker is God.
Once we have established the speaker here is God, the context at the end of the verse actually show three subjects. "from the time that it was, there am I" refers to the speaker (that is God), "and now the Lord GOD" (quite obviously God) and, "and his Spirit" (Who's Spirit? the Lord GOD's), and finally, "hath sent me" (back to the speaker, God)
Now I suppose that it could be argued that this a literary device in which God speaks in third person, but that would be like saying that God sent himself, which doesn't make logical sense if there were only one being described here.
But it does make logical sense if one holds to the concept of the Trinity. That is, "the Lord GOD (the Father) and His Spirit (the Holy Spirit), hath sent me (the Son)."
Yet how does one still keep with the idea that God is One?
Well, I've been thinking in the area of metaphysics. If God is eternal, the He exists outside time and space. He knows the beginning from the end ("...I am the first, I also am the last." vs 12). Let me propose that God the Father occupies eternity. But Jesus came into the world, which means, if Jesus is also God, then He entered into the time/space continuum. So we now have God the Father in the eternal and Jesus in the temporal. So what of the Holy Spirit. Could it be possible that the Holy Spirit is a conduit, of sorts, between the eternal and the temporal? That God's Power is expressed in the Holy Spirit from the eternal and into temporal, and therefore this is how God enters the into the universe. Jesus, born of the Holy Spirit, born of a woman, is the result of God completing the process of bringing Himself in the world.
So instead of viewing God as three separate beings, it is actually God coming through from the eternal via the Holy Spirit, who is the go between.
I sorta got this idea by what I learned from the properties of light, for scientists will tell you that light seems to act a particle whilst at the same time acts like a wave, depending on how it is observed. There is also the concept in quantum mechanics something called quantum entanglement, "in which the quantum states of two or more objects have to be described with reference to each other, even though the individual objects may be spatially separated." (Source: Wiki - Quantum entanglement).
Would it be a far stretch to apply this phenomenom to the idea of the Trinity? It certainly appears to solve the issue of the Three-in-One concept.
What do you think?
"Come ye near unto me, hear ye this; I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; from the time that it was, there am I: and now the Lord GOD, and his Spirit, hath sent me."
To get a clearer picture of this, one has to identify the speaker and the subjects of this verse. We can deduce that the "I" refers to a being who has been "from the time that it was" as someone who has been here at the beginning. The context of the entire passage suggests the the speaker is God.
Once we have established the speaker here is God, the context at the end of the verse actually show three subjects. "from the time that it was, there am I" refers to the speaker (that is God), "and now the Lord GOD" (quite obviously God) and, "and his Spirit" (Who's Spirit? the Lord GOD's), and finally, "hath sent me" (back to the speaker, God)
Now I suppose that it could be argued that this a literary device in which God speaks in third person, but that would be like saying that God sent himself, which doesn't make logical sense if there were only one being described here.
But it does make logical sense if one holds to the concept of the Trinity. That is, "the Lord GOD (the Father) and His Spirit (the Holy Spirit), hath sent me (the Son)."
Yet how does one still keep with the idea that God is One?
Well, I've been thinking in the area of metaphysics. If God is eternal, the He exists outside time and space. He knows the beginning from the end ("...I am the first, I also am the last." vs 12). Let me propose that God the Father occupies eternity. But Jesus came into the world, which means, if Jesus is also God, then He entered into the time/space continuum. So we now have God the Father in the eternal and Jesus in the temporal. So what of the Holy Spirit. Could it be possible that the Holy Spirit is a conduit, of sorts, between the eternal and the temporal? That God's Power is expressed in the Holy Spirit from the eternal and into temporal, and therefore this is how God enters the into the universe. Jesus, born of the Holy Spirit, born of a woman, is the result of God completing the process of bringing Himself in the world.
So instead of viewing God as three separate beings, it is actually God coming through from the eternal via the Holy Spirit, who is the go between.
I sorta got this idea by what I learned from the properties of light, for scientists will tell you that light seems to act a particle whilst at the same time acts like a wave, depending on how it is observed. There is also the concept in quantum mechanics something called quantum entanglement, "in which the quantum states of two or more objects have to be described with reference to each other, even though the individual objects may be spatially separated." (Source: Wiki - Quantum entanglement).
Would it be a far stretch to apply this phenomenom to the idea of the Trinity? It certainly appears to solve the issue of the Three-in-One concept.
What do you think?