symbols in worship

On a picture in a church in Dalby (southern Sweden) the lamb representing Jesus Christ bore a swastika rather than a simple cross. ​

A swastika was also used in the cast of the church bell of Utterslev, Denmark. ​


But from where did these churches of Christendom and their clergy borrow the symbol?
It should not surprise us greatly that the swastika, as many other symbols, was adopted from pagan sources.​
 
Alex P said:
The swastica is also a sign of peace.... Much, much time before it was ever used for hate.... Should look into it, fascinating history has that cross.. :) We shouldn't be so thrilled to find the bad in everything.
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Yes, the swastika goes back to the ancient religious center of Babylon.
 
there is more to Easter than celebrating the resurrection of Christ. Men have taken the Biblical significance of the occasion and added symbols and customs that originate from ancient peoples who served false gods.



For example, consider a well-known emblem of Easter in some countries—the rabbit.

"Ancient pagans used the rabbit as a symbol of the abundant new life of the spring season. . . . The first record of the bunny as an Easter symbol is found in Germany about 1572," says The Catholic Encyclopedia for School and Home.

Likewise, the Easter-time use of hot cross buns, brightly colored eggs, or chocolate bells has its roots in pagan religion.

And, incredibly, the very name Easter (used in some languages) relates to a pagan deity.

The Westminster Dictionary of the Bible states that Easter was "originally the spring festival in honor of the Teutonic goddess of light and spring known in Anglo-Saxon as Eastre.

As early as the 8th century the name was transferred by the Anglo-Saxons to the Christian festival designed to celebrate the resurrection of Christ."


This pagan ancestry is widely recognized and well documented. The question is, Does it matter?

Since Easter purports to honor Christ, does God overlook the fact that its trappings, even the name itself, are linked to the worship of other gods?
​
 
Alex P said:
Yes... And the part you keep skipping, it represented, Love.
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Symbol of Fertility and Life


in the trench graves of Mycenae, Greece, the swastika is found on rich golden jewelry. ​


It also appears on coins. ​

In a funeral scene depicted on an Athenian vase, three swastikas can be seen above the horse pulling the hearse. ​

Goddesses of fertility found in tombs wear the symbol on their throats and breasts. ​

On a sarcophagus we can see the "mistress of life," who later became known as Artemis, surrounded by swastikas. ​

It also seems to have been associated with the lotus flower and decorated the garment of Aphrodite, the ancient Greek goddess of love, called Venus by the Romans. ​


Swastikas have also come to light in excavations at Troy, an ancient city of Asia Minor.

So, at Troy and in its representations in the Aegean area, the swastika conveyed the idea of fertility and life.​
 
So in Matthew 4:19 "And he saith to them: Come ye after me, and I will make you to be fishers of men", are you saying that Jesus was implying that He would teach the fishermen how to use their nets and lines to catch bathers instead?

Slave trade, perhaps? Or cannibalism?

I suggest He was using a symbol to convey a message to those He called to discipleship, and that this meaning was transparently obvious to all who heard it, and so they adopted the sign of the fish as a graffito, a symbolic shorthand, to convey that they were followers of Christ.

Of course, Love is the greatest Christian symbol of them all:
John 13:34-35 "A new commandment I give unto you: That you love one another, as I have loved you, that you also love one another. By this shall all men know that you are my disciples, if you have love one for another."

Thomas
 
Thomas said:
Of course, Love is the greatest Christian symbol of them all:
John 13:34-35 "A new commandment I give unto you: That you love one another, as I have loved you, that you also love one another. By this shall all men know that you are my disciples, if you have love one for another."

Thomas
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very true indeed :) love of God and neigbour

and when Jesus was talking to his followers he said that the identifiing mark to all men , as to who are his dicsiples would be love among themselves.:)
 
mee said:
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i love reading the watchtower mags they are most informative and always direct mee to the bible ........ very good :)
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So you still haven't explained why you or the organization that speaks out so vehemently against symbology utilizes symbology. Along the same vien why a group of people who rally against symbology and earthly governments register and copywrite that symbology.

I'm totally confused on this issue. As it appears these Watchtower folks bow to the evil governments and utlize non biblical symbology to promote their beliefs. Please explain the dichotomy.
 
wil said:
I'm totally confused on this issue. quote]


there is great confusion on a worldwide scale , and i am glad to say that in the worldwide brotherhood of Jehovahs people there is no confusion at all .

thats because they have got out of BABYLON THE GREAT . as Jesus has commanded them too REVELATION 18;4


But those who are not humble enough to listen to Jesus are wandering around in a great confusion.

NOT MEE
:)
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mee said:
there is great confusion on a worldwide scale , and i am glad to say that in the worldwide brotherhood of Jehovahs people there is no confusion at all .

thats because they have got out of BABYLON THE GREAT . as Jesus has commanded them too REVELATION 18;4


But those who are not humble enough to listen to Jesus are wandering around in a great confusion.

NOT MEE
:)
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If JW's have no confusion and neither do you, why do you avoid the simple question?
 
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mee said:
the Babylonian Ea, a god of the waters, was depicted as a man covered with a body that was part fish; the Syrian Atargatis was a fish goddess; and in Egypt certain kinds of fish were viewed as sacred and were even mummified. Such fish worship was, of course, prohibited in God’s law to Israel.—De 4:15-18.


What about the figure of a fish, which appears on some ancient artifacts associated with Christians




Objects dated as far back as the second century C.E. have been found bearing this figure along with the Greek word for fish, ICHTHÝS.


This is understood by many as a cipher for the Greek expression Iesous CHristos THeou Yios Soter, meaning "Jesus Christ, Son of God, Savior." Is the fish a truly Christian symbol?


According to The Interpreter’s Dictionary of the Bible, fish frequently appear in ancient pagan symbolism, often apart from water scenes. "In such cases," notes this reference work, "it would seem to have symbolic significance, possibly to represent deity, power, fecundity, etc."


The same publication further notes that certain Jews adopted use of the fish symbol from pagan religious customs, adding: "It is probable that the considerations mentioned [in this regard] account in part for the appearance of the fish in the art of the oldest Christian catacombs.

How early the Greek word for ‘fish’ (ichthýs) came to be interpreted as a cipher for ‘Jesus Christ, Son of God, Savior’ . . . we do not know; but once this identification was made, the fish became a standard Christian symbol."


The Bible, however, sets forth no visible symbol for Christianity. Christians today, therefore, must be on guard not to adopt such a symbol.

​
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"this is my body, this is my blood...do this in memory of me..." "...when you see these signs, you will know that the time is nigh". lol, I guess you forgot that part, about Jesus himself providing Christians with "symbols" and signs.
 
Quahom1 said:
"this is my body, this is my blood...do this in memory of me..." "...when you see these signs, you will know that the time is nigh". lol, I guess you forgot that part, about Jesus himself providing Christians with "symbols" and signs.
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i am glad to say mee has those things in clear focus :) the annual memorial 22nd march this year,
the memorial of christs death i will be an observer to this very important thing.


One reason why the Memorial was instituted had to do with one purpose served by Jesus’ death.

He died as an upholder of his heavenly Father’s sovereignty. Christ thus proved Satan the Devil, who had falsely charged that humans serve God only out of selfish motives, to be a liar. (Job 2:1-5)



Jesus’ death in faithfulness proved this contention false and made Jehovah’s heart rejoice.—Proverbs 27:11.



the Lord’s Evening Meal was instituted to remind us that by means of his death as a perfect, sinless human, Jesus ‘gave his soul a ransom in exchange for many.’ (Matthew 20:28)



When the first man sinned against God, he forfeited perfect human life and all its prospects.

Jesus said, however: “God loved the world so much that he gave his only-begotten Son, in order that everyone exercising faith in him might not be destroyed but have everlasting life.” (John 3:16)


Indeed, “the wages sin pays is death, but the gift God gives is everlasting life by Christ Jesus our Lord.” (Romans 6:23)



Observance of the Lord’s Evening Meal reminds us of the great love shown by both Jehovah and his Son in connection with Jesus’ sacrificial death. How we should appreciate that love!
 
mee said:
i am glad to say mee has those things in clear focus :) the annual memorial 22nd march this year,
the memorial of christs death i will be an observer to this very important thing.


One reason why the Memorial was instituted had to do with one purpose served by Jesus’ death. ...

Observance of the Lord’s Evening Meal reminds us of the great love shown by both Jehovah and his Son in connection with Jesus’ sacrificial death. How we should appreciate that love!
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Namaste mee,

You crack me up!

You don't celebrate Easter or Good Friday...no...that is Pagan... but you celebrate the memorial!

poe tae toe, po tah toe, toe mae toe, toe mah toe, 2 funny.

Do you need a ladder to get on and off that high horse??

ps, still haven't provided the biblical origin for that castle symbol you so revere....
 
wil said:
Namaste mee,

You crack me up!

You don't celebrate Easter or Good Friday...no...that is Pagan... but you celebrate the memorial!
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thats because Jehovahs witnesses listen to Jesus and the bible . memorialize Jesus death ...... YES ............. sticking to what the bible teaches is for mee.



pagan beliefs mixed up with bits of the bible such as easter ... NO ....




:) the truth has set mee free:)


The Gospel writer Luke confirms that Jesus commanded: “Keep doing this in remembrance of me.” (Luke 22:19)



These words have also been rendered: “Do this in memory of me” (Today’s English Version)


and “Do this as a memorial of me.” (The Jerusalem Bible)


In fact, this observance is often referred to as the Memorial of Christ’s death.


Paul also calls it the Lord’s Evening Meal—an appropriate designation, since this was instituted at night. (1 Corinthians 11:20)


Christians are commanded to observe the Lord’s Evening Meal. :)



thats why Jehovahs witnesses are doing it right:)
 
So are you celebrating Jesus's Death or the Lord's evening meal?

The evening meal, wasn't an evening meal, he probably had one of those most every evening of his life ('cept when fasting). Many Christians refer to it as the last supper, which is a little more accurate although you may have some opposition to those terms since you've got your own. Isn't the correct term Passover, something that he celebrated every year of his life. Something Jews continue, breaking bread and drinking wine, and going through the Passover traditions. Do you follow the same traditions the Jews do for this meal?

still wondering about that castle worship you are avoiding...
 
wil said:
So are you celebrating Jesus's Death or the Lord's evening meal?

The evening meal, wasn't an evening meal, he probably had one of those most every evening of his life ('cept when fasting). Many Christians refer to it as the last supper, which is a little more accurate although you may have some opposition to those terms since you've got your own. Isn't the correct term Passover, something that he celebrated every year of his life. Something Jews continue, breaking bread and drinking wine, and going through the Passover traditions. Do you follow the same traditions the Jews do for this meal?

still wondering about that castle worship you are avoiding...
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yes it certainly was his last supper, and yes it was on passover.



Passover was a memorial celebration; therefore the Scriptural command was: "And it must occur that when your sons say to you, ‘What does this service mean to you?’ then you must say, ‘It is the sacrifice of the passover to Jehovah, who passed over the houses of the sons of Israel in Egypt when he plagued the Egyptians, but he delivered our houses.’"—Ex 12:26, 27.





Since the Jews reckoned the day as starting after sundown and ending the next day at sundown, Nisan 14 would begin after sundown.


It would be in the evening after Nisan 13 concluded that the Passover would be observed.


Since the Bible definitely states that Christ is the Passover sacrifice (1Co 5:7) and that he observed the Passover meal the evening before he was put to death, the date of his death would be Nisan 14, not Nisan 15, in order to fulfill accurately the time feature of the type, or shadow, provided in the Law.—Heb 10:1.
​
 
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